Google Updates and SERP Changes - May 2019

[Mark_A]

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System: The following 12 messages were cut out of thread at: https://www.webmasterworld.com/google/4940766.htm [webmasterworld.com] by goodroi - 12:25 pm on May 1, 2019 (utc -5)

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For my main current site, Google Organic accounts for 28% of sessions.

I swear it takes up 80% of the effort though!

[riccarbi]

Speaking of mr Barry and seroundtable....
He reports about Google like <someone trying to preserve relationships with them>, avoiding anything important.

Is it perhaps the same mr. Barry who started removing all my comments at Seoroundtable by default as soon as I began to be critical on Google and to ask the same questions you are posing here?

[edited by: Robert_Charlton at 10:03 am (utc) on May 8, 2019]
[edit reason] editing quoted passage [/edit]

[Mark_A]

It is one thing organic visitors not converting, but I wonder if this is also happening with Ads visitors.

I certainly don't want to be paying cpc for visitors that don't convert!

[rustybrick]

riccarbi, I do not remove comments - maybe yours are filter by Disqus. The only time I remove comments is when someone insults or makes fun of someone else. That is the ONLY time I would ever remove a comment from SER. Oh, I do not remove comments where people insult or mock me, I leave those. Just when people go after other people like little children.

StoneSolid, I have reported on almost all of those topics in the past.

It is funny - SEOs think I love Google and Google thinks I hate them. I guess a perfect balance. :)

But this is way off topic to this specific thread...

[glakes]

Seeing no movement in SERP, but user behavior is changing DRASTICALLY.
Rank brain appears to have early onset dementia...or advanced, I forget.

My traffic is down a combined 50% from Google. My Adwords campaigns are down 30%, which runs contrary to any company trying to pad their earnings. Conversions are terrible, and I may give it up to another week to let those Adwords campaigns run until I pause them and reallocate the funds to other marketing opportunities. What sticks out is the high level of traffic from Canada. Even though my traffic is down substantially, the traffic Google is sending us from Google.ca has doubled. WTF is up with that? Anything we ship to Canada costs a minimum of $20 in freight which is why Canadians rarely convert. Rank Brain does not understand this basic concept?

[StoneSolid]

@RustyBrick

StoneSolid, I have reported on almost all of those topics in the past.

Maybe you did, maybe I missed it. Stuff like that needs way more coverage. WAY MORE.

But this is way off topic to this specific thread...

It is off topic indeed but I simply can't force myself to discuss "heading tags" or "should I link from widget or footer" and such silly topics while a GIGANTIC ELEPHANT is in the big picture.

[riccarbi]

iccarbi, I do not remove comments - maybe yours are filtered by Disqus. The only time I remove comments is when someone insults or makes fun of someone else. That is the ONLY time I would ever remove a comment from SER. Oh, I do not remove comments where people insult or mock me, I leave those. Just when people go after other people like little children.

Dear Barry,
I trust what you are saying, really.
Nevertheless, my comments (which have always been polite and respectful for the last 25 years, believe me) were filtered out, all of them, and within just a few minutes after I'd posted them on Seoroundtable. Therefore, should I presume that Disqus doesn't like any comment vaguely critical on Google? And that they don't like them so much that they have implemented an automatic removal tool so smart that it can understand whether a comment is critical on Google or not? That would be a great AI. I hope that, at Google, they will rent all Disqus' software engineers as soon as they can in order to fix their own AI, which hasn't been that great, so far...".

[mosxu]

@MarkA

cpc mainly here and it doesn’t convert

[mosxu]

@glakes

The machine knows the traffic from Canada does not convert this why is sending it to you.

We all get a lot of international traffic instead of genuine buyer traffic.

[Mr_Dok]

Google lost it all! its bsolutely chaos now in SERPs. googler engineers need to be shame to themselves. Again and Again - youngest, thin and irrelevant content sites is up and old, rich and quality content sites is no more in priority. if so - what exactly the incentive of site owners to invest in rich and quality content ?! - shameful. Googlers think we all stupid enough to eat and support their unjustly acts in a name of the "AdWords coin". You better get yourself together and back to your roots when rich and quality content sites had priority and really donate to the world.

[glakes]

@mosxu

Please note my comments below are provided in the context of a manufacturer. What I sell is unique with the distribution channels controlled by my company. In other words, we are not selling the same widgets that other companies are selling.

It is true, I also get a lot of useless international traffic but this update resulted in a substantial rise in traffic from Canada which I can't ignore. Canada traffic from Google.ca doubled. My Adwords campaigns are set to USA only. Could it be that the relationship between paid ads and organics is a lot closer now? I'm thinking it's possible that Google will wipe out organic listings for a site, and replace them with ads, when an Adwords option exists for that same site. So for Canada, the only way Google's users will see our products is if Google shows them in the SERPS organically. Important note: My running Adwords campaigns are for shopping ads only - no text ads.

To further expand on the above, I sell on Amazon.com and not Amazon.ca. Meaning there is no Amazon.ca option for Google to display for my products in Google.ca. If people in Canada want to buy my widgets, they have to buy from my site.

On Amazon.com, my sales are normal but there are many, and I mean many, sellers complaining they've had no sales on Amazon since Google's last update. The title of that thread is "Zero Sales Since May 1st." The OP of that thread, which is now 115 entries long and has many others claiming the same, no/low sales points out:

Number of items sold on Amazon last 7 days:

April 27: 21
April 28: 24
April 29: 22
April 30: 23
May 1:0
May 2: 3
May 3: 1 (so far)

Something happened May 1st. Still dont know what yet.

As we all know, Google has planted Amazon pages on the top of the organic SERPS for years and Amazon also spends big on Adwords. But that has changed with Amazon pulling back on shopping ads and Google reducing domain crowding and demoting many Amazon pages in the last 1+ year. I think it is possible that Google is demoting Amazon pages at an even faster rate as many in the Amazon forum are seeing substantial and sustained drops in sales despite no update in Amazon. Here's some more quotes:

Same! I was making 20 sales a day for the last two days I have 0 sales! What is going on? My listing is fine and searchable.

Similar experience. 30-50 sales a day to 2 sales on the 1st.

Same here…zero sales since May 1st

i went from 125000 sessions on april 30th to 4500 everyday since my sales have crashed and burnt

Many Amazon sellers are seeing a sustained (not just one day) drop in sales too, which I find interesting. Normally Amazon is spared from the carnage left behind after a Google algo update, but not this time. The impact is much larger and impacting more sellers on Amazon then I have seen in times past.

[Milchan]

Ive just noticed in google webmaster console there are no updates at all for May with some reports showing data from April 29th and some from April 30th.

[StupidIntelligent]

Google and Amazon are rivals. This was bound to happen.

[mosxu]

@glakes

Yes it is all about personalising the buyer journey what I see is no traffic from ready to buy searchers and only from previous visitors.

Ready to buy searchers can not be shared with every advertiser regardless how high they bid because that would destabilise the ad rank formula if you know what I mean.

To what extent is happening I do not know

[rustybrick]

riccarbi, please email me at rustybrick.com/barry (there is a form there) - i can investigate it with Disqus.


Mod's note: Normally we don't allow public requests for private messages. I know that Barry (aka rustybrick) knows that, and this is for new members who don't. We are making an exception in this special case, and thanks to Barry for his graciousness under the circumstances.

[edited by: Robert_Charlton at 10:23 am (utc) on May 8, 2019]
[edit reason] Added note to message. [/edit]

[BangkokBaby]

I've been using DuckDuckGo for about a month now as I like Google storing my search history. I switched because when I was using Google, my "Discovery feed" on my phone was returning articles based on niches I've searched on Google.

Google did a very good job too, it did too much of a good as I was worried they were tracking everything I was searching for:

"Where to find a Mexican restaurant near me"
"I have a spot in place X, what does it mean"

Anyway, I changed Google for DuckDuckgo a month ago, and half the time I'm searching on DDG I end up going to Chrome because the search is much, much better.

DDG reminds me of Google Search in 2015, many of the stuff is from dated sites or old sites I've not seen when using Google. I don't think Google is broken, each time I make a search I find my query.

For the people in here who sell products or services, you need ACCEPT that all it takes to be an online business owner is to start a website. With all the online courses and gurus pushing how to rank in Adwords and Google Shopping, of course there are going to be more ads.

More businesses = more competition in serps and AdWords, is Google just meant to keep things they way they were in 2015 to keep a small group of people happy and stop others from making a living?

The face of online marketing is changing, and no doubt 10 years from now SEO will be a totally different thing.

Do you think Michael Jordan blamed anyone when he lost, no he got back on the field and did what needed to be done.

For those of you who have lost a lot of traffic over the last year, if you were ranking higher before you can be there again, you just need to work.

This thread is about changes to Google algorithm changes and what happened, not for webmasters to take no responsibility for their website and to blame Google. I've been in the doldrums and knows how it feels when the rug is swiped under your feet, I also know crying and complaining doesn't do as much as reading data and taking the correction action.

I really hope all of you turn it around and your websites get back to where they were before, if not better. But honestly some of you are not cut out to be webmasters if all you do is blame Mr G and don't take responsibility for your own sites.

[browndog]

I have gone up and up since the March update. Before then, my site had sunk to an all-time low. But every week, traffic grows. Personally, I think it's just good luck more than anything. But just in case, this is what I've been up to for the past 6-8 weeks.

I disavowed a tonne of shady backlinks. I have never paid for SEO or links, nor have I actively sought them out, but I went to Webmaster Tools, found a lot of iffy ones and disavowed.

I spent a good 3-4 weeks going through my content with a fine tooth comb. I use both Yoast and Grammarly premium (a bit of overkill) to check my content. Mostly pick up spelling mistakes, typos, double ups (such as the unicorn went to to the vet). Purchased a decent subscription with Shutterstock and use a lot more images to really demonstrate what I mean. Always cite my sources, this is such a big one for me and I don't care what Google thinks, if somebody is going to state a fact, I want to know where that fact came from.

Why did I do those things? It was because I had completely given up on Google, and needed to find ways to share my content, and by making people want to share it because it is credible, visual and easy to follow.

[StoneSolid]

Do you think Michael Jordan blamed anyone when he lost, no he got back on the field and did what needed to be done.

Ah yes, I'm loving this inspirational example.

Year is 2019 and rules of basketball are mostly unknown.
NBA gives zero feedback about anything and there is no channel of communication with them.

It is break time, and Micheal Jordan's team is losing 21 : 74

Michael looks to the other side of the field...
- 5 other team's players
- 3 Nike players are against him at all times
- 4 referees with 4 more balls are also playing at the same field against Michael


We should really ask Michael Jordan what he would do in that case and apply his solution.

[JesterMagic]

@BangkokBaby of course things have changed. Sure some of us like to complain but that doesn't mean we don't take responsibility for our site. Amongst the complaints there usually is some useful information for others. I am sure most of us work hard, that helps but working hard doesn't mean you will be successful.

I assume you are doing well (since you don't mention you are not). A lot of that I am sure is your hard work but some of it is luck as well. Weather it is choosing the right niche at the right time, getting that key back link or just doing some obscure small thing on your site that Google's algorithm deems it's worth ranking your site well.

I think a lot of complaints about Google stem from the fact that the quality is not there for a lot of searches. I would complain less if I thought the listings before me were better or at least as good as mine. Over 50% are not and actually are much worse. It's difficult to improve your site if the SERPS are like this.

As far as ads are concern your logic is not sound. Sure there is more people willing to pay money for advertising, just as there are more people performing searches. This doesn't mean filling the SERPS with all ads above the fold is something we should be okay with. In fact if you want to rank well in Google, they advise that other websites cannot do this. Look at other media like radio and TV , if they filled if with over 50% of ads people would start moving on. In fact with TV they have. While not the major reason a lot of people enjoy the ad free experience of streaming services like Netflix or Prime, over cable TV companies and there commercials not only in breaks but during the actual show.

[ichthyous]

@BangkokBaby Most people on here are working just as hard as you on their sites. We follow all of Googles guidelines, make sure the sites load fast, have great UX, etc. and some of us have been at the top of our respective Serps for a lot longer than you have in sure. Still, my site lost 30% of traffic because 1) Google is taking that share for itself, not my competitors, and 2) Entire swaths of searches vanished overnight as Google now ranks completely different types of sites for those searches.

It's not that my site is better or worse, it's that I (and all of my competitors) vanished for some of our top searches and a whole host of seemingly crappy article sites replaced us. I have no intention of now turning my site into an article based website for Google. What you say about the volume of competition is true though, and so the takeaway for me is that the best days of Google referring converting traffic are just over. I am looking for completely new ways for people to find me. I will not devote more and more time to Google because from now on it just won't pay off. So far everything I've tried has not come close to replacing the sales that Google brought in consistently... but I am determined to get away from Google as quickly as possible. Google is actually ruining my peace of mind and taking up more time than it deserves in my life.

[EditorialGuy]

@JesterMagic: Google has a reputation for being a data-driven company. There's obviously a sweet spot on the spectrum that runs from "no ads" and "too many ads," and multivariate testing can identify that sweet spot for specific categories of searches ("transactional," "navigational," "informational") or even individual users. You or I might have opinions on what a SERP should look like, but--unlike us--Google is in a position to know what will maximize search revenue without driving away searchers.

(Side note: Multivariate ad and layout testing isn't just for the big guys these days. We've been using it since last July, and the results have challenged some of my own previous assumptions about user behavior in the presence of advertising.)

[ichthyous]

I disavowed a tonne of shady backlinks. I have never paid for SEO or links, nor have I actively sought them out, but I went to Webmaster Tools, found a lot of iffy ones and disavowed.

I came to the same conclusion because Google is reporting thousands of spam backlinks to my site. But I updated my disavow file more than two months ago and still the same spam links reported in GSC and no update except those spam links are increasing! Meanwhile links from good quality sites were dropped. I can only hope that one day maybe Google will actually read my disavow file and update the links!

[universenet]

ichthyous tell me please how you have enough time for doing this about backlinks?
What if you have million of backlinks to your website?
Google really know what to do for making people "busy" for nothing and not doing right things from own side
If you asking john muellerr he will tell you next:
"Hey man, you are concentrated in links TOO MUCH"

He exactly told that to one person online
Google analytics discovering in very short time if your website is quality or not...
They no need investigating your backlinks...backlinks are just for folk... for playing with people
Now is new modern time in search engines...new tools... we do not proof nothing with backlinks
Search engines discovering eveything about our webstie very easy just with own analytics
If google can discover who is real buyer and who is not so google analytics very easy can discover if your website is high or low quality.. no need nothing other..just analyzing what visits to your websites doing on your websites.. what kind of activity

[edited by: universenet at 3:41 pm (utc) on May 5, 2019]

[StoneSolid]

Problems are much deeper and creepier than just what meets the eye.

It isn't just about google ads and google widgets all over the serps.
They are blatantly FILTERING traffic and serving the best kind of it to adwords.

Best examples for that is if you look for something very profitable, example: buy gold bars

First search for that term will show full page of ads.
Depending on what and where you click, or if you do additional searches (value of gold, should I buy gold)...
.. when you again do a "buy gold bars" search, you just might get a page with one or none google ads whatsoever.

Why is that?
Because algorithm realized you're NOT a buyer - you are a "RESEARCHER".
Therefore, they let that nicely filtered click go to organic.


This isn't a conspiracy theory, it is a fact.

[universenet]

StoneSolid yes... this can be strategy from google..and it is for sure.. and many more what we did not discovery

(backlinks are no important in this modern time)

Google analytics is like a police on airports.. they discovering suspected people only looking in face and their activity in very short time
Looking users activity google in short time discovering if visited website is good..bad...
Is so easy!

[wondering]

Look at Google's most recent financial results. Despite massive shuffling of SERPs over the last year, they still disappointed wall street. They are shuffling results to make sure that they extract the last penny they can to please their wall street masters without totally destroying user experience. They will continue to do so till they can't extract any more juice from the SERPs. If anyone really thinks that thousands of Big Data/AI Phds at Google are not playing with SERP datasets to maximize revenue, they are kidding themselves. Just look at the amount of doublespeak and coverups we have seen from them over the last few years.

And that point they really hope Waymo or other moonshoots begin to generate dividends. Which may or may not happen.
The problem with this constant shuffle is that newer organic traffic based businesses will not be created and innovation in the ecosystem will die. Over the last decade or so, we saw so many businesses grow based on the virtuous combination of
Great Missing Piece-Great Content-SERPs-More Backlinks-Brand-Better SERPs and so forth
This is going to largely die a slow death.
Which means great businesses like Indeed, CarGurus, Glassdoor, Zillow, Housze and thousands of similar sites will not get developed. I'm currently working on several ideas, but I question whether it's worthwhile to pursue the above strategy. May be it's a decade too late...may be some other approach is needed.

For Google, outbound webtraffic is just as necessary as human drivers are for Uber. In their ideal scenario, there would be a made in G solution for every problem (Travel, Maps, Hotels, Jobs etc.) with no dependence on downstream sites.
Ideally, G would want every single search to monetize exclusively for them. But just like Uber's fully automated cars, it just can't happen. Don't think they don't desire to do so though. So they continuously work against the site owners to get a bigger and bigger share of revenue. With zero accountability required.

If businesses not dependent on organic traffic are built and they thrive, it's lethal to Google in the long term. All these sites are the golden egg laying hens that G is slowly killing. And farmers will start growing pigs or cows that don't depend on Google at all.

[ichthyous]

(backlinks are no important in this modern time)

Half the posts here state the utmost importance of new backlinks with all these updates. I am finding that getting new backlinks is not moving the needle much, if at all these days. My site still hasn't recovered from the drop last September and then again in March and I have some good links coming in. So it appears that the back link profile doesn't count as much as it used to. Has anyone seen otherwise lately?

[Milchan]

google apparently stated recently that the backlinks reports are out of date and it will likely stay that way until they completely recover from the indexing bug and various other reporting issues. So I wouldn't expect to see results from disavowing things quickly at the moment.

[ichthyous]

@wondering

Amen brother...this is exactly what I have been saying. Google employees need to keep up the GOOG share price at all cost...the value of their stock options depends on it. Amazon, Facebook are pounding on the door stealing ad revenue so Google is going to do whatever it takes to keep up quarterly profits, including killing organic traffic to all our sites. Today its me, tomorrow it will be you.

I have had many good years going back to 2002 and built a good business on googles organic traffic. But those days are coming to an end and I am spending my marketing budget elsewhere, not at Google. I would happily pay Google to get good leads, but I tried it numerous times over the years and paid for traffic that didn't convert at all.

[glakes]

Yes it is all about personalising the buyer journey what I see is no traffic from ready to buy searchers and only from previous visitors.

@mosxu

Funny you mention getting no buyer traffic from Google but traffic from previous visitors. I see a similar pattern.

When viewing live traffic on my site, a good number of visitors from Google are hitting my page from a paid ad then returning a few minutes later from an organic listing. It's as if Google is using organics in a remarketing campaign. Logically paid ads are on top and organics are underneath so this behavior should be expected if I am listed in both paid and organics, but I've not seen it to this degree prior to the April 29/May 1st algo update. To me it points more to a further degradation of Google's traffic quality when a visitor lands on a product page from a paid ad, quickly bounces back to the SERPS in 1-2 minutes then returns to my site again after clicking on a more general/non product specific organic listing where they spend a substantial amount of time. To me it is obvious these visitors have no intention on buying as they are drawn to more general information pages -vs- the paid ads Google served them. While I am getting some converting traffic, the cart value is down 60% of what it was prior to this update. That's a substantial drop, and I'm not sure how Google can expect any business to absorb the cost of conversions at this rate.

[StupidIntelligent]

No conversions. Just repeat visitors.