Welcome to WebmasterWorld Guest from 34.238.192.150

Forum Moderators: Robert Charlton & goodroi

Message Too Old, No Replies

Whether to move a link from sub menu to top navigation?

     
6:09 am on Nov 29, 2014 (gmt 0)

New User from GB 

5+ Year Member

joined:Oct 9, 2014
posts: 31
votes: 0


I'm working on a website with 7 links in the top navigation.

e.g. Home | Cat 1 | Cat 2 | Cat 3 | Cat 4 | Cat 5 | Cat 6

Cat 1 has 7 sub navigation links.
Cat 2 has 4.
Cat 4 has 5.
Cat 6 has 3.
Cat 7 has 4.

These are css drop downs.

Now the way the site is set up, if you go into the individual posts, the top categories show in a left hand side navigation, and depending on what section you're in those sub menu links will show.

One of the major keyword terms that I'd like to rank for is a sub menu link.

Should I move it up into the main navigation? and take it out of it's natural category.

Just out of interest in GWT the page I'd like to improve ranking for is about number 25 or so for the pages with most internal links.

Adding it to the top navigation would make sure that it also appears on the posts left hand side navigation and increase the number of internal links considerably.

Good idea or not?
11:50 am on Nov 29, 2014 (gmt 0)

Senior Member from GB 

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month

joined:Sept 7, 2006
posts: 1137
votes: 140


There have been a couple of recent threads discussing menus which would probably be worth your taking a look at:

Duplicate content and drop-down menu ([webmasterworld.com ])

Most SEO friendly on-hover drop-down menu (http://www.webmasterworld.com/google/4710108.htm)

and, related,

Crawling Page Assets May Help SEO (http://www.webmasterworld.com/google/4711411.htm).

In general I would advise against a css-drop-down menu, but from your description your own has less than 30 links in it, which isn't a prohibitively large number.

I would also advise against having a link-order that doesn't follow site structure, especially as what you are asking about is attempting to manipulate ranking.

If the page you wish to feature has greater significance than the rest of the site, you may want to think about site structure and page hierarchy, rather than manipulating links.
12:25 pm on Nov 29, 2014 (gmt 0)

New User from GB 

5+ Year Member

joined:Oct 9, 2014
posts: 31
votes: 0


Wilburforce you say if the page has 'greater significance than the rest of the site, you may want to think about site structure and page hierarchy'...

I'm not sure what you mean here?

Could it not be argued that moving the Sub Category up into the top navigation is for user benefit rather than manipulation (and that a by product of this would be more internal links and thus increasing the ranking power of the page?)

I've added more internal keyword related links to the page I want to rank higher, including a link from the body text on the homepage.
12:26 pm on Nov 29, 2014 (gmt 0)

Preferred Member

5+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month

joined:Sept 12, 2014
posts:384
votes: 68


Will it improve the viewers experience?
1:49 pm on Nov 29, 2014 (gmt 0)

New User from GB 

5+ Year Member

joined:Oct 9, 2014
posts: 31
votes: 0


debatable.. it'll save those looking for a particular best selling product having to go to a sub menu, they can have easier access to one of the top products.
2:36 pm on Nov 29, 2014 (gmt 0)

Senior Member

WebmasterWorld Senior Member planet13 is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 5+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month

joined:June 16, 2010
posts: 3828
votes: 31


One of the major keyword terms that I'd like to rank for is a sub menu link.

Should I move it up into the main navigation? and take it out of it's natural category.

...it'll save those looking for a particular best selling product having to go to a sub menu, they can have easier access to one of the top products.


Why not put a link directly from the home page to that particular product / subcategory instead?

You could have some sort of Best Selling products feature on your home page and list the top products / subcategories you are trying to promote.

There is an older video by matt cutts (maybe three years old?) where he says that is what he would do if he had an ecommerce site.
3:12 pm on Nov 29, 2014 (gmt 0)

New User from GB 

5+ Year Member

joined:Oct 9, 2014
posts: 31
votes: 0


Planet13 yes that's what I did as I mentioned above. I'd be interested to view video if you can find it.

However even with more internal links to this page it still doesn't have as many internal links as some of the top categories.
7:26 pm on Nov 29, 2014 (gmt 0)

Preferred Member

5+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month

joined:Oct 29, 2012
posts:554
votes: 99


I would personally just do it and watch for the natural user site flow after the change. Will users benefit from able to see the link directly while they are on other categories? If they do and will benefit, it's probably a good idea for higher chances of exposure and cross-sell. Maybe people just don't know that the main category has that subcategory that they might be interested in, so they never know the subcategory existed. So it's like instead of thinking it as simply moving subcategory to main navigation, you are actually making it a "main category" by itself.

In terms of raw ranking, I don't think that it will make much of a difference with the setup change by itself (seeing that you already have direct link to it via home page, so it's not really deep linked content in itself). Sometimes it only helps when the subcategories are buried so deep that search engines have trouble ranking it appropriately.

Having more internal links to flow within your setup does not necessarily make them rank higher, in fact it can actually dilute the thematic link and content relationship. But then you never know until you test, looking at user's immediate actual behavior is a good place to start after the change.

It will make some difference over the long term if you do get more natural users to flow to that page. You will probably not see any immediate search improvement after the change. That's my experience.
5:46 am on Nov 30, 2014 (gmt 0)

Senior Member from US 

WebmasterWorld Senior Member tangor is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month

joined:Nov 29, 2005
posts:10569
votes: 1124


The SE will see and find the link in nav, thus traffic might follow... however if the landing page has (via menu/navigation) made that link/content not READILY VISIBLE, the visitor might be lost. Don't know many who will click on navigation of find something they expected to find... or look further for more...

Shoppers WANT to see the goodies FIRST LOOK, so place those not just high in navigation, put them on the home page.
5:49 am on Nov 30, 2014 (gmt 0)

New User from GB 

5+ Year Member

joined:Oct 9, 2014
posts: 31
votes: 0


Frank, I have just started doing the internal links and the links from the homepage. In my experience a keyword link from the homepage content makes a big difference.

Adding/editing the sub category to appear in the main top navigation, would mean it appears in the side bar navigation. That would increase the amount of internal links by just under twofold, and make it show up as one of the highest internal links in GWT. I read somewhere on Google where it states that the amount of internal links corresponds to the importance of a page.
6:53 am on Nov 30, 2014 (gmt 0)

Junior Member

5+ Year Member

joined:May 16, 2014
posts:141
votes: 0


Have you done a full analysis on keyword density?

I read somewhere on Google where it states that the amount of internal links corresponds to the importance of a page.


Taking concepts like that, and building a site structure around it usually leads to unhappy experiences.
4:30 pm on Nov 30, 2014 (gmt 0)

Senior Member from GB 

WebmasterWorld Senior Member redbar is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 5+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month

joined:Oct 14, 2013
posts:3371
votes: 564


Have you tested the navigation on tablets and smartphones?
6:45 pm on Nov 30, 2014 (gmt 0)

Preferred Member

5+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month

joined:Oct 29, 2012
posts:554
votes: 99


@MichaelW

That's kinda what I meant, once you place that direct link to it via home page is probably the highest that your page will rank based on existing metrics.

By shoving it to the navigational menu where every single page onsite links to that page will not likely to give it any further boost (at least for the short Term, even if it does give a boost, you may find the effect really shortlived). Especially if no visitors visit those pages naturally.

You can actually get more mismatched traffic by having those semi unrelated keywords on other pages onsite, which sometimes is not so good depending on overall setup. I would assume that your goal is not just rank for that particular page, but keeping the existing traffic for your other pages as well. Unless you are a major brand with tons of links flowing to you, mismatched traffic can hurt.

And @RedBar bring very good point on mobile devices, once you start shoving more navigational links, it can further reduce your mobile usabiilty (if you have a good chunk of visitors that use mobile).

But if your goal is really to "upgrade" a subcategory into a category of its own because it's already popular, it is a good choice in my opinion. But if you are simply trying to manuever the internal linking setup, it would most likely not work in your favor. Your eventual goal is really to give what people want and need, design navigational menus with user in mind, search engine really comes second. (this is true especially if you already have a good existing traffic).