To subdomain and not to subdomain?

[hachirokoo]

I run a free city and interest group based online classifieds website.

there are 2700 sites(as subdomains). eg. sydney.example.com seoul.example.com and etc..

I really do not have any idea if this decision is good for SEO or not.

1. I do not have top www.example.com. I only have subdomain sites. Should I get www one for SEO purpose?
2. Should I get rid of a subdomain per each city idea and go with the www.example.com/sydney (subsite?) and etc.?
3. If to use subdomain, how does Google Web Master Tool work? I cannot create and maintain 2700 sites under the tools. I think you have get one for each subdomain of your site. Can I just create one site on the tool and maintain all?
4. Would there be another other issues, pros and cons using the subdomains rather than subsites?

Thanks heaps in advance.

[edited by: brotherhood_of_LAN at 4:27 pm (utc) on May 24, 2014]
[edit reason] Using example.com [/edit]

[aakk9999]

Welcome to WebmasterWorld hachirokoo!

I would personally not developed information architecture in this way, but as always, it depends. Perhaps you could answer questions below:

- How old is the site (i.e. subdomains)?
- How big are subdomains (approx how many pages each)?
- Are they (and how) interlinked?
- Have you had any significant drop (or issue) in ranking?

[phranque]

welcome to WebmasterWorld, hachirokoo!


if you eventually go with subdomains, you'll need at least 3 GWT account to verify all 2700.

http://support.google.com/webmasters/answer/34592 [support.google.com]:

You can add up to 1,000 sites—including news and mobile sites—to your account.

[lucy24]

I do not have top www.example.com. I only have subdomain sites.

When you say "don't have", do you mean that it belongs to someone else-- or only that there is no page at this URL?

Either way it's unnerving. We know darn well that when a search engine (any of them) sees subdomain.example.com, it will inevitably ask for example.com and www.example.com-- to say nothing of example.com/index.html and the other permutations. What do visitors see when they ask for this (nonexistent) page? Where does the DNS point to?

Seems as if the missing primary would leave a huge hole in the middle of the domain. Not just for search engines but for humans who come to a subdomain and then maybe backtrack expecting to find some kind of directory or umbrella page.

[Robert Charlton]

Yes, as lucy24 suggests, you really should have a www.example.com, not just for SEO purposes, but for site identity as well.

While we don't normally refer to specific sites as examples in WebmasterWorld, in this case there are a couple of extremely prominent sites, so prominent that we're not discussing anything not commonly known by mentioning them, which both have geo subdomains and a www home pages. They are Craigslist and Wikipedia. Default canonical urls below. You'll see how the www page is in fact a site map for all the others....

http://www.craigslist.org/

[wikipedia.org...]

Craiglist appears to redirect to other than the canonical url above and also uses a cookie to remember your last selection as default... and might also use IP detection for location (which I don't recommend)... so I'm not sure what you'll see where you are and what you see after you've navigated the site, but it is essentially set up with a www home page.

I've done several geo sites with www home and then geo subdomains, and I'd recommend that unless your site is extremely large with many pages in each subdomain, for a variety of reasons you might be better off using folders rather than subdomains for your geo areas... but I could argue it both ways.

[hachirokoo]

If you browse to http://www.example.com or http://example.com it just detects your location by ip(it may not be accurate) and goes to for eg, http://sydney.example.com

Yes, that craiglist example is perfect match for my situation. (very similar site except mine's a big more graphic :) ). After reading comments, I am now certain that I should build the www homepage rather than redirecting straight away.

Hi AAkk9999
- How old is the site (i.e. subdomains)? - just built, brand new
- How big are subdomains (approx how many pages each)? - a few static pages
and all others are dynamic pages (a page for each user posting)
- Are they (and how) interlinked? - no, although there is wall(each subdomain site) selector
- Have you had any significant drop (or issue) in ranking? - it's a brand new site anyway.
.

[edited by: Robert_Charlton at 2:27 am (utc) on May 26, 2014]
[edit reason] exemplified domain, per forum Charter [/edit]

[hachirokoo]

Thanks Phranque,
Thanks for the info.
Then I am wondering, for SEO purposes, would I actually need create one for each site? I am new to GWT and SEO. GWT is absolutely required for each site I run? (it will be quite impossible for me to register and use it separately manually anyway :))

[hachirokoo]

Now,
1. I will create the www page - a sort of indexing site for the 2700 subsites.
2. GWT - I will perhaps create sties under GWT for a few of my subsites and use it to test my site(and the code behind) code as all 2700 sites share same code behind.

Now the big question remaining is, as originally asked, whether to subdomain or subdirectory?
http://sydney.example.com or http://www.example.com/sydney ?
for my case, what are the pros and cons?
My site is very similar to craiglist and perhpas I should follow what craiglist has done. i.e. subdomains.
but I'd like to know why that's better choice, what differences is that, if any, will make for the SEO results?

Thanks heaps guys!

[aakk9999]

If you go for subdomains, you can host each separately. So for example, you could host sydney.example.com in Australia and london.example.com in UK.

If you go for subdirectories, you cannot host them separately.

With regards to SEO, if you go for subdomains, would each be able to stand on its own, attract links, etc? You said each would have a few static pages and remaining being UGC and as we know, the quality of UGC is always questionable.

On the other hand, if you go for one site with subdirectories, would these "few static pages" be the same for each location or are they unique by location? If they are unique, the site may end up having more than 3 static page (2700 x 3 static pages). But if they are kind of templates, so you have 2700 x 3 different static page with only a word or two changed between location, then you are creating a site full of duplicate content.

There are many angles to think about.

Whilst craiglist may be doing it in certain way, it has been around for a long time and has an authority so if it works for them it may not mean that the same architecture will work for a new site built today.

[Robert Charlton]

Also, reflecting on your site and Craigslist...

If you start with 2700 cities immediately, or even 50, you're likely going to have a great many empty pages... not good for users or for Panda. You might want to carefully consider if you really need 2700 cities, or even a fraction of that number... and, if so, you should consider how fast you want implement them.

Craigslist expanded gradually from one site in the San Francisco Bay Area, and I believe it currently only covers roughly 700 cities. It was an extremely hot brand, though, before it started expanding moving into other cities. So I'd be very careful about thinking you can simply launch a site on the scale of Craigslist and be successful.

I'd favor the several years of building up slowly. This is apart from whether you do subdirectories or subdomains.

If you go for subdomains, you can host each separately. So for example, you could host sydney.example.com in Australia and london.example.com in UK.

This may be a particularly important point with regard to business model... especially if you build up gradually and have the local sites operated by locals, which it seems to me would make the most sense to do.

[hachirokoo]

Hi aakk9999,
thanks for your advice!. Yep, I think I should go with subdomains for the scale out scenario you envisaged. 2700 pages will just share the same contact us pages and etc. they are not really physical html pages but from db. I guess it's 2700 duplication anyway from the SEO bot's point of view. Would these duplication hurt my SEO? Yep, I agree that I shouldn't exactly follow the craiglist as the site has been around for a while. THanks heaps!

Hi Robert,
same to you, huge thanks :)
Yep, I should actually start from small then expanding. Also thanks for the craiglist history, I actually didn't know that :) Yep, I agree, I am trying to get the some respectful local traditional media to run my sites for their city or something :)

I am creating some videos and stuff at the moment. I also need to crate the www page as advised on this forum. It's currently missing.

Thanks guys!
.

[edited by: Robert_Charlton at 3:10 am (utc) on May 27, 2014]
[edit reason] needed to remove domain name, per forum Charter [/edit]