Forum Moderators: Robert Charlton & goodroi
In my post msg #:86 on this thread, I wrote:
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msg #:86 3:18 pm on Sept 23, 2005 (utc 0)
Hi Folks!
Just like any other previous update, its gonna be very tough as the update proceed. Google updates arenīt something for the weak souls. During Allegra and Bourbon some of our fellow members couldnīt take it any more and did a very wise thing. They took a break ;-)
..........etc
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And I have nothing to add ;-)
Well I got a reply from Google Search via Adsense, who forwarded my enquiry, they said that we were not being penalized for anything on the site and that, as they add new sites and content, positioning moves about...
So I am not sure what to make of the huge drop, though I guess they are always cagey about any updates. At least it looks like it not due to anything on our site, which is good.
I guess more wait and see then.
After drying up the puddle of tears below my desk and waited for my keyboard to dry out I made a list of alterations I would set about making.
I firstly listed anything different I'd done to my site within the past two months. Only 1 major thing so that was easy.
I gave up checking what the #1 - 10 ranking sites for my keywords were doing that I was or wasn't because I could find no sense or consistancy there.
I used the removal tool to take down 2 folders of pages that were recently added. I also added NO INDEX, NO FOLLOW tags to these and added them to my robots txt file.
The following had always exsisted on the site but decided it was now bad practice where before I found it worked very well.
Cross linking to another site I own on a simillar theme and done likewise to it. These were plentiful.
eg
site 1 big widgets interlinked with
site 2 small widgets and reverse.
Site 2 funnily enough has made a comeback, It hasnt been updated since May and Id meant to rework it into something else and never found the time. I still intend to at some point.
One other thing Im gonna do is use site 1 under a diff domain, juggle it around a bit, ban googlebot from the entire site and use it over at yahoo where the original does very badly.
After a little work on a seperate site yahoo seems a lot easier to rank in. Older techniques still seem to work there.
Should I ban yahoo from the original version?
EDIT: I just checked to see how removed pages request was pending or complete. Answer complete.
Try it on G. three word search.
Results 1 - 1 of about 44
shows only 1 result on serps though.
I add the &filter=0
Results 1 - 10 of about 18
shows all 18.
There were only 16 related pages in the rmoved folder that relate to this search.
18+16=44 - it does when you use the calculator sponsored by Big G - lol!
[edited by: djmick200 at 10:27 pm (utc) on Sep. 28, 2005]
Well I got a reply from Google Search via Adsense, who forwarded my enquiry, they said that we were not being penalized for anything on the site and that, as they add new sites and content, positioning moves about...
Sounds like the standard Googlease to me.
I should say we use subdomains for all our section so this maybe further complicates things.
Also they mentioned getting morehigh quality links, yet we probably have hundreds of them added every month, on everything from major news sites to blogs. I doubt many sites get as many so quickly in fact. Yet we seem to have been degraded despite these, which are all organic to articles.
So will see what they say.
18+16=44
The 18+16=44 was a slight jibe at googles inflated number of pages per site count.
I used the removal tool to take away 16 pages that would contain 'big red widget'.
There remains 18 pages in my site that contain the text 'big red widget'.
The two together = 34.
When I done the initial search it said 1-10 of 44.
10 extra. No where to be found. Non existant.
site.com -word1 where word1 is on 14 of the sites 1000+ pages... it returned 9000+ results
site.com -word2 where word2 is on 19 pages... it retuned 997 results
After a few dozen checks, if a word appears on 15 or less pages on the site, the result comes back over 9000 results; if the word appears on 16 or more pages, the results come back at 1000 or less. This could be because I have 1015 pages on the site. I don't really have an accurate count, or it may be because 15 is somehow mystical to Google, but it is interesting that I am able to get an accurate count by -someword
A suggestion to the engineers at Google working on this problem. Back out of this trainwreck, whether it be an update or a new filter or whatever. You can't save it by trying to tweak it a little bit more. Back out and start over again once you actually have a solution that's been tested!
On the plus side my Yahoo traffic is rising as it appears that people are getting as fed up with Google's results as I am. My Yahoo referrals have doubled in the past two days and it's not because my rankings have changed. It's because more people are using Yahoo rather than Google. If this drags on much longer I think Google is risking large scale defections to the competition, which come to think of it, is a good thing! ;-)
-- T
This could be because I have 1015 pages on the site.
steveb - I've started a new topic on this very subject. I think we've got something in common here from what you're describing. My topic is still under review.
So google is prefering the sites that link to me - so really is ranking directories and link farms.
This is making the out bound link more important than the inbound link
so higher PR for in links but higher serps for out links.
I'm quickly going to link to google,amazon and yahoo :)
Everflux has never been this odd
there are some strange goings on, some sectors have changed others have not
from what i have seen so far this is not an update IMO
dazz
ONE WEEK has passed since this update/no update has started on 22nd September 2005.
It is sad to see sites with original contents dropped out of the index or lost high degree of their rankings on the serps. Fellow members are loosing revenues. Searchers are presented with more spam on top of the serps.
A kind fellow member stikied me yesterday a keyphrase in German related to travel sector and asked me to run a query on google.de as well as google.com and see for myself how spam has emerged victorious as a result of this update (till now).
<snip>
After a week from the start of this update/no update thing, <there are> maybe 1000īs of duplicate pages while at the same time <original pages of our fellow members have been removed>.
<snip>
[edited by: lawman at 10:19 am (utc) on Sep. 29, 2005]
dan
I have noticed that aolsearch.aol.co.uk (Which google provide the results) looks to be giving out the old results. I typed in a keyword in google.co.uk and got zero results, yet in aohell same keyword I get 4 pages of results?
Listen ;) - I will say this only another 95 times. The canonical url for my site is the homepage with the www - I have done the 301 - this is the page with the most backlinks - it is the page that should rank for the company name search. Etc.
This site is so clean it squeaks. But I really don't feel that these changes we're seeing are related to anything we're doing.
Im seeing the same results on both aol uk and google uk for my sector.
<snip>
I am up <a> creek without a paddle since last Thursday like everyone else posting in this thread.
I have made several changes and will make my daily updates to my site that has lost 14,000 unique a day from Google though I will focus on other projects for Yahoo and just see what happens to my main site and Google. I feel there is nothing more I can do.
One last thing; I'm still astonished that Brett hasn't yet added a post to this thread. My reason for saying is that he owns the board, has sites other than this and has been around the block a few times and would have experienced threads of this sort when Google has changed things in the past.
[edited by: lawman at 10:24 am (utc) on Sep. 29, 2005]
This is what I see on my pages:
The pages with current filter problems have a lot of the keywords on them compared with more successfull pages (also are most relevant but that is something else). The pages with less troubles have very less of the keyword combination on them but have internal links with those search words in them. Maybe the anchor text links have more weight now, disturbing the balance on every page which was optimal for the search words before?
I have two possible hypothesis to explain my filterproblems in the SERPs at the moment:
1. Filter is different per page (not site wide). Some pages have more filter points, some have less. The density of the search words on the pages with a lot of filter problems is to high according to Google. The search words used in links are added up to the ones on the pages so the pages most relevant on you site are filtered out (total result minus filter points). Pages with less search words on them but with some text links have less success in the unfiltered SERPS but since there are less penalty points score is better in the filtered version.
2. Filter is site wide. All pages on a site have the same amount of filter points. Some pages are doing still fine because they are so optimal for the search according the current Google that after deleting the filter points still enough points are left to place them high.
I have the impression that the filter problem is per page beacuse situation two can't explain the huge difference for some pages after filtering and leaving others with the same search words nearly unfiltered.
What do you think?
