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I wouldnt mind making a little dvd collection of war films...
I like the Pianist and 'we were soldiers'
What you all think...
Has San Salvador been mentioned?
I have not seen it this way. Of course it is the dramatised version of what really hapened for making Vassili Zaitsev a USSR war hero. What was his true story, I guess we'll never know cause this hero was mostly made by propaganda.
I knew about Vassili Zaitsev before the movie was shot. A friend of my dad collects militaria from the Great War and the second WW. His best treasures where pictures, newspaper clippings, letters and private diaries. He got them all sorted and translated and I spent a lot of time reading them when a was a youg teenager. Henri (the collector) had many letters that has supposed to be written by Vassili to his 'fans'. All bear a different handwriting...
The movie is a good version of the official Soviet propaganda. Except and also according to propaganda :
The scenario was patched with bits of the story of a rare female sniper Maria Ivanova wich served in a different batallion in Minsk. She never went to Stalingrad. They must have a happy ending, right? ;)
There are many tracks of the legendary duel between Zaitsev and Konig. Official paper sayed Zaitsev killed Konig after Konig shot Zaitsev's assistant (I dont remember the name, but it was not Danilov) and revealed himself to confirm the kill. Wich can only be BS, cause Soviet snipers where working in teams covering each others, and Konig knew that.
There is a lot of material saying the duel never took place and was completely fabricated.
With this background in mind, I saw this movie quite differently. I dont think it's better, just different.
I saw a conscript who randomly got trapped by a propaganda machine. Talking about heroes was a big switch in Soviet propaganda at the time, since communist values where not really promoting individualism. This conscript was really challenged with a lot of pressure to live up to the role that was forced on him, especially since the hero thing was just a test. He knew the German was better than him, he also felt he was forced into this confrontation. I saw he reluctantly trained other snipers because of his own feeling of incompetence and insecurity.
I cannot remember the name of the caracter (Ron Perlman), but when he explains the reason of his gold denture to Zaitsev, it really doesn't help his moral into fighting for a good cause. He really feels stuck as meat in a sandwich knowing his hero role is just plain baloney.
As for major Konig, he was actally depicted as monster capable of the worst things imaginable, but didn't he volunteer for the mission after he lost his son to war? I believe hatred and despair was part of his motivations. I believe went there in person with a secret hope that was it's last mission.
>>so much as highly intelligent and deep, which makes it bizarre for a war movie.
I fully agree with this statement. One of the rare war movies wich isn't completely tainted with testosterone.
Alain Godard and Jean-Jacques Annaud really pulled a good scenario here. Annaud directed it masterfully showing all the misery, suffering and despair of war. Art department did a huge job and also went deep into small details. It's a must see.
rj, did your movie have Christopher Walken in it? Wasn't it Commando something?
lol no! The first time i seen it was maybe a month ago or so... Thats all i can remember about it.
Wasn't it Commando something?
lol anyone like the Spoof war films...
From what I remember, I can't find a flaw in your analyses either. I think it might be a case of the movie having a lot of mixed messages, and one of those rare war films worth watching several times, in different frames of mind, just to see what aspects of the theme jump out at you differently.
Aside: Lots of great stuff in here. This thread goes to the bookmarks.
I will watch this movie soon again from a different angle too.
Since I have worked for 15 years in SFX for movie production, there is too much room still used by it in my little brains. The first time I watched this movie, I was so obsessed at trying to find historical flaws in weaponnery, uniforms and pyrotechnics, I was totally clueless of what the movie was about at the end. :)
Saving Private Ryan was absolutely the best ever in this regard. We are far from classic Hollywood style gasoline fire balls FX in this masterpiece. FX where reinvented to reproduce acurately the real thing. I have spotted less than 50 goofs in this one. A record low.
What is the one with the submarine tied in a knot on the cover with Val Kilmer helping the French resistance? It is a parody.
Top Secret!
[imdb.com...]
