Forum Moderators: martinibuster
BUT - to find out who my competitors are I mainly have to click Adwords adverts because they are obviously the ones hard at work promoting their site. The natural results are normally full of information pages and "less specific" firms.
As I'm clicking on Adwords adverts anyway I decided to search from my affiliate search box (why not get a bit of the cash I'm giving to Google?). My question therefore is as these searches are valid and I would be performing them anyway in the course of my duties as a marketer, does earning some cash out of it go against Adwords/Adsense terms and conditions?
I thought I'd be better asking here before declaring my actions to Google!
You have no logical grounds to label it "abuse" when others are simply stating facts .... no matter how uncomfortable those facts make you.
So every click that isn't from a potential customer is fraud and that person should be considered a thief?
If your dud clicks on competitors' ads (or any other advertiser) put money in your own pocket, it's theft.
But watch your logic here. You've lumped a couple of things together in that sentence that don't actully belong together. You're committing the logical fallacy of the Complex Question:
"Two otherwise unrelated points are conjoined and treated as a single proposition. The reader is expected to accept or reject both together, when in reality one is acceptable while the other is not. A complex question is an illegitimate use of the "and" operator." (Source: Stephen's Guide to the Logical Fallacies)
Not all dud clicks are theft or fraud, although those you have described are.
The only reason I was using my own Adsense for Search box was because I didn't think Google should get all the money themselves ... it's not theirs as much as it isn't mine.
That "reasoning" doesn't stand up to any sort of ethical standard whatsoever.
Even without analysing it in depth, if you were a person of principle you'd have rejected it a few seconds after you thought of it ... for the simple reason that you gave your word about not doing things like that when you accepted the Adsense terms of service.
What does a promise mean to you, anyhow?
My question therefore is as these searches are valid and I would be performing them anyway in the course of my duties as a marketer, does earning some cash out of it go against Adwords/Adsense terms and conditions?
This question was sussinctly and clearly answered in posts #2 through #11. Only ONE of those 10 posts said anything insulting or rude (quote: "What you are doing is wrong on so many levels.").
In post #12, internetheaven (the original poster) stated that perhaps he hadn't been clear in his first post, and went on to clarify that he intended the thread to really be about this...
I was asking if Google are as in-human as their crawlers or are they partner-orientated. Certainly, my clicks probably won't even be noticed amongst the thousands of genuine ones I send so I wasn't really concerned with being thrown off - more an ethical debate.
Well, internetheaven, you got it. Ten long pages of ethical debate about Google Adsense's rules regarding a publisher clicking on the ads served to their page.
In post #12 you changed the course of the thread, and as a "preferred member" with over 500 posts under your belt, surely you know that "ethical debates" in this or any forum are likely to degrade into some measure of insult and bad vibeage? And, of course, like all ethical debates, there comes a time when both sides have said their peice, noone has been convinced, and there's nothing left to do but make fun of each other's hair.
Point being, let's all take a little responsibility here (please notice the "all"). We're not off topic; most of us are almost certainly being nastier than we ought to be.
cEM
It seems like internetheaven is part of a problem that threatens this business model that most of us are very happy to participate in. I wonder, is internetheaven one of my competitors? How many out there are doing what he is doing? How many legit clicks am i really getting from google?
Google will ban I think as soon as they find out. This is the only way they make the money to keep going and fraud threatens their livelyhood.
Actually saying you had no common sense was not meant as an insult, but rather a point of fact.
Some things are sooo simple;
You don't steal
you dont kill
you dont lie
etc etc
Things a 6 year old knows.
There is NO grey area. You DO NOT CLICK YOUR OWN OR YOUR COMPETITORS ADS. It is not complicated at all.
If you NEEEEED to see a site in google adwords/adsense really gotta see it, don't be LAZY, type the url in your browser... Duh? Gee wiz wasn't that complicated?
and as a "preferred member" with over 500 posts under your belt, surely you know that "ethical debates" in this or any forum are likely to degrade into some measure of insult and bad vibeage?
Fair point. You have to admit though, this is far better than a "how do I get out of the sandbox" thread anyday ... ;)
Palehorse - thankyou for just proving my point about people not bothering to read the thread and just jumping in with insults. "you don't steal, you don't kill, you don't lie ..." - I mean, come on, what were you thinking? As for the other "suggestions", they have been covered and I have asked and been answered and it isn't as simple as you were pointing out because ... oh, I really can't be bothered with you, just read the thread will you?
I understand though that I am really, really getting on peoples nerves with what I'm saying and I can't tell you what a kick it gives me to see messages like that one you just posted. It cheers me up at the end of a hard day.
He knows he is wrong. You can tell by the way he keeps defending it.
I'll remember that one next time I'm in court ... it'll give everyone a good giggle ...
How about this one - "everyone else knows I'm right because if I was so wrong they wouldn't bother responding to me". I mean, how many threads with ridiculous statements reach Page 10 within a couple of days?
As for the post that talked about my question being answered and therefore the debate was over (I forget who, sorry) yes, it was answered but I do feel I have to right to continue asking different questions along the same theme. This is a "thread" isn't it? Not "Q&A". The only people going over and over the same original question are those that want to get their kick in, I stopped ages ago but I do feel the need to respond to certain messages which is why the thread seems to be repeating itself alot.
Is he trying to get people to join webmasterworld so they will reply this thread?
I like the way you think, I'm betting you're a pretty successful marketer, one of the only guys in the thread that has stepped back and asked "why is he doing this". I mean, it wouldn't make sense for someone who wasn't going to get caught to publically confess, would it? Thank you, my faith in the original thinking webmaster is restored.
P.S. some of you are really showing your true colours as your posts show that you are not reading the thread, just quickly hitting the post button. Like that guy a couple of posts above this that said (again) about me getting "found out". Read the thread before posting because it just makes you look less impressive to argue against me when you go stating things like that.
To make a long story short, if you click on your competitor ads running on your own AdSense ads or AdSense for Search, you can end up getting suspended for fraudulent clicks. It is against the AdSense terms to click on any of your own ads - even if you would have clicked on them without personally making money from it. If you do it anyway and take the risk, you can (and should) be suspended for it.
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If you want to visit an AdSense ad without anyone being charged for it, simply right click the URL, view properties, and it will give you the URL. Copy the actual destination URL portion of it, and enter that into your browser. This will take you to the same landing page you would end up at as if you had clicked the ad normally.
You can also use your AdSense Preview Tool - it will bring up the ads, and you can click the ads that show up in the tool, without anyone being charged for them.
Alternatively, you can click on the "ads by google" and get the URL that way, although it will be the domain rather than the specific destination page.
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