Does the fact that Google is showing you CPM tell you about their algo

Looking at stats differently

[Clark]

Has anyone else noticed that you fool around with your ad layout to maximize clickthrus. After a lot of work you manage to bring up your clicks a lot, but the earnings don't seem to quite add up to the extra clicks you brought in? It's as though all that work was more for Google's benefit and less for yours? Then you look at the CPM column and think, perhaps Google looks at your site, determines a CPM they want to give you for that theme, adds in a randomizer so that you can't second guess their algo, add in a little bit of extra earnings boost for higher clickthru, but mostly it's the CPM that counts?

[richmondsteve]

I love conspiracy theories, but I don't think Google is doing what you described. Personally, I think they added the effective CPM column as a virtual clue stick for all of the publishers who are whining about low EPC, are planning on switching to a competitor or otherwise think they're getting shafted.

[howiejs]

I agree. It makes you feel less bad - when you have an EPC drop but are still seeing a damn good CPM (makes you realize you really can't go anywhere else . . .)

[Clark]

I guess that means I'm the only one unimpressed by the CPM. It makes me think of alternatives even more than before...

[richmondsteve]

Clark, I'm sure there are plenty of publishers rightfully unimpressed by their effective CPM using AdSense. But I bet they'd be dwarfed by the number of publishers who couldn't easily monetize their content sites before AdSense was launched and the number of publishers whose ignorance leads them to assume the grass is greener on the other side.

[ownerrim]

That's true. adsense changed everything. Still, and I'm not a conspiracy nut at all (though I do wonder about those crop circles and whether or not there was a second gunman in a tunnel under the grassy knoll), it is strange that almost every time my traffic goes up and my number of clicks increases...my epc goes down. It's like I'm running faster just to stay in place. Nope, not a conspiracy nut. Just makes me wonder as I stare into the sky looking for lights that move in a weird way.

[jomaxx]

IMO Google added CPM to the reports in order to keep people from obsessing over the value of each click. I doubt they want webmasters trying to maximize the EPC, but in general they DO want them to maximize the visibility and clickthrough rate of AdSense ads.

[HughMungus]

Then you look at the CPM column and think, perhaps Google looks at your site, determines a CPM they want to give you for that theme

Hasn't Google stated in the past that they base the value of click-throughs on what type of site you have (e.g., a widgets review site gets a higher per-click rate than another type of widgets site)? So, therefore, CPM would be more constant than your ability to manipulate it...?

[uncle_bob]

I've always found CPA ( cash per article ) a better motivator when looking at stats. If I have a 10 article site (ignoring about and filler pages) then I calculate how much each article is earning per day, and per year. I think of the yearly rate as how much an article is worth, and use that to motivate me each day to write content.

I'ts just a shame google can't calculate it for me ;-)

[peterdaly]

I think EPM is a number that many of us calculate and track based on anyway. Google is just saving many of us a step.

I don't think any deeper thought into this is needed.

[howiejs]

"Hasn't Google stated in the past that they base the value of click-throughs on what type of site you have (e.g., a widgets review site gets a higher per-click rate than another type of widgets site)?"

Is this per SITE or per PAGE

[ownerrim]

does anyone even know if adsense distinguishes between sites? I thought it was by individual page. that way, if you run adsense on 5 different sites, each page from your cumulative total of pages is on an even footing and will earn depending on what adsense determines its value to be.

[2oddSox]

Re-reading the e-mail where Google introduced the smart-pricing to publishers, they specifically refer to 'web pages' rather than 'sites'.

[Powdork]

The only thing you need to know is more clicks = less money

[howiejs]

"The only thing you need to know is more clicks = less money"

Are you stating there is a drop in EPC as clicks increase or (CTR increases)?

[HitProf]

It's also less clicks less money now :(

Don't know what's wrong but our numbers have decreased significantly starting 8 July :(

[dhaliwal]

whatever happens

let it happen

i don't think we have any other such network to go and whatever we are getting we should be happy with it.

only thing we can do is increase our click thru with some layout or other techniques

then we can make better content that could fetch more money.

google will do what is good for their business and with the IPO coming, they will probably be trying to make more profit to woo shareholders.

[Powdork]

Are you stating there is a drop in EPC as clicks increase or (CTR increases)?

No, that would be too strong. In my experience, with only my data pool, there does appear to be an inverse relationship betweeen the number of clicks and epc. This is only in regards to amount of clicks, rather than ctr. For instance, my best dollar amount day was one with high ctr, high epc, and low traffic. Using those three variables only, I have had the following combinations numerous times.
high high low
high low low
low low low
low low high
low high high
low high low
high low high
I have never had a day (or any time frame) where it was
high high high
Statistically, this seems improbable.

[edited by: Powdork at 2:45 pm (utc) on July 13, 2004]

[Powdork]

As I read my post above it seems likely the above relationship may be due to the ad pool drying up on high traffic days. This would especially be true for a local niche site where the Adsense statistics day period and the Adwords day period are the same (ie, in the same time zone). This brings up the question " Can I advertise adsense on a page that doesn't run Adsense?" For instance, my site only allows three vendors per category. Could I, on my advertising page, put something like "If there is no availability in your category you can still advertise on mydomain.com by running an Adwords campaign with contextual advertising implemented. This would place your ad, if deemed appropriate, in the advertising space marked with 'Ads by Google' you see sprinkled throughout the site."

[mquarles]

I think the reason they added it is simple: AdWords is a CPM model.

Hang with me. I know you're saying it's CPC, but it's really not. Consider how position is calculated, and you'll realize that the ad in the #1 spot is the one with the highest CPM to Google, #2 the next highest, and so on.

I think they're thought about it from a CPM perspective from the beginning, so they're just passing on the info.

MQ

[europeforvisitors]

Speaking of CPM, I remember speculating a while back that the new "image ads" might eventually be sold on a CPM basis, since they lend themselves to conveying a brand message ("Drink Coke") and not just a direct-response message ("Click for Coke at a discount").

Google is already doing CPM deals with some of its premium partners, so it wouldn't be too big a stretch to sell "image ads" on a bid-per-thousand-impressions basis.

[Clark]

PowDork,

I don't think it's ads drying up and I can confirm that I see the same thing on my adsense sites. I'd like to hear if anyone has contradictory data.

mquarles, I haven't been able to convey my message, but what you said about CPM is what I feel Google is doing.

[HitProf]

PowDork,

As you have no control over when and where Google will show those ads that wouldn't be wise. You can test whether the ads run dry if you put a custom "ads" page in the alternative url. Your logs will tell you if and when Google will fall back on it.