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Is it possible that PPC is quite overratted?

Miniscule ROI - can someone help me understand why?

         

HyperGeek

4:54 pm on Nov 7, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



This is what we've experienced in the past:

- Over 100 campaigns launched within the last year maximizing the use of AdWords by paying close attention to price fluxuations, targeting optimal keywords, keyword matching, stop words, direct matches, etc.

- Placement is at an average cost of $1.00 to $3.00 a click, if you even show up at all. Where are these fabu .25, .75 listings I always hear about? I've even been know to calle up competitors to find a way for us all to benefit by cooperatively lowering our bids. When it comes to saving money, almost everyone plays ball.

- PPC returns are ATROCIOUS, ATROCIOUS, ATROCIOUS. And we KNOW the sites "work" when it comes to effective copy, ease of use, etc. We have great inbounds from valuable articles people love to link to, beautiful rankings and get an EXCELLENT AMOUNT OF REVENUE FROM STANDARD POSITIONING AND PRESENTATION. In knowing our weak spots, only then have we tried to fortify our presence with PPC campaigns.

- All of this is based on my experience with AdWords, so I truly fail to see how Overture could work for any business that can take the chance at losing a couple of grand.

This is pretty much the only part of internet marketing that I don't fully understand after almost SIX YEARS in this business. PPC has never worked for me, nor has it worked for anyone else that I know of personally other than success stories I hear on WebmasterWorld.

Do many people have this problem or is it just me? I've been wrapping my head around this for almost two years now - to no avail.

How DO you run a successful PPC campaign? Right now, I honestly fail to see how it can be accomplished - and doubt whether PPC benefits anyone but the search engines that provide the service.

redzone

5:21 pm on Nov 7, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



If you go into PPC campaigns blindly then you can't expect to reap the benefits...

There are web analytics programs out there, that track both Google/Overture at the keyword level. This will return an accurate (ROAS) Return on AdSpend for any individual keyword, giving you the proper information to make bid adjustments, deletions, etc.....

It takes some work to get things tuned, but ignoring PPC engines, is giving up a lot of valuable traffic...

HyperGeek

5:39 pm on Nov 7, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



We've actually invested in software to help view current prices, fluxuations, keywords being searched for, etc.

Any suggestions as to what programs to use? Maybe I overlooked a good one.

Macro

6:09 pm on Nov 7, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Hypergeek, what about the actual $ amount you make per sale? Is it large or small? I understand that for larger value items PPC tends to work better (I do realise that a pure ROI calculation is independent of average cost per item).

HyperGeek

7:27 pm on Nov 7, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Small items were out of the question. Large items were highly competitive and pricing usually had to be adjusted a tad to hook the buyer.

We found in most cases that prices that worked well for non-PPC (standard positioning and advertising), had to be lowered to work for PPC.

Most often we would cut these campaigns short since perceieved value and normal pricing is usually more important to our clients when selling product than lowering the price to make a PPC listing more attractive... espcially if they see little to no return anyway.

roitracker

7:49 pm on Nov 7, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



If you have to lower your price to make a sale, it sounds like you're not taking comparison shopping into account for your PPC campaigns. Users will often click on 2 or 3 PPC listings, not just one. If your original price is much higher than your competitors, therein lies your answer.

HyperGeek

9:12 pm on Nov 7, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



I guess I didn't make it too clear in my last post - the prices were adjusted BEFORE we placed the ad.

I've been marketing products and services for quite a while, so I made sure to do all of the necessary research before we went into even setting up an adwords account.

I get the feeling that the PPC climate is just simply horrible for a good amount of retail industries.

Service industries seem to do a bit better - and niche industries do very well.

I'm planning on marketing a niche service by January, so we'll see how that goes. I expect it to be pretty successful considering the main keyphrase is practically untouched and going for that beautiful .20 per click.

I never got the "gut feeling" that these campaigns would work - but with this service site, I almost know it will.

Online retail of popular products is, for lack of better words... a real b*tch. I commend anyone who finds success for popular retail through PPC.

SlyOldDog

11:23 pm on Nov 7, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



We sell a differentiated product through ppc. I wouldn't dare enter a commodity market unless there was no competition.

PPC is sbout the closest you can get to perfect competition. When you have a commodity you have perfect information. That spells big trouble for market particpants. Eventually the market must tend to the point where only the hungriest or those with the lowest earnings target, or the most efficient will stay in business. That's not a scenario I find particularly inviting :(

webdiversity

12:52 am on Nov 8, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Why not try a proof of concept through a company that can make PPC work for you.

Each industry can be quite idiosyncratic, some of the competitors are plain mad in their approach.

The fact you have data to use makes your failure even more difficult to grasp. Even with extended broad match, match driver etc.. there is still a glut of inventory available in most sectors at a low cost level. This allows your blended CPC to be lower than just trying to get into a bidding war that erodes all your margin.

Don't get sucked into those wars. Colluding with the enemy is mistake #1. Outsmart, out perform, bid the right keywords into the right position, in the right place at the right time.

The site copy may work when there is 500 words on a page with graphics etc.. but don't forget that with PPC your 70 characters is all someone has to formulate an opinion on whether you can satisfy their needs or no.

The actual bidding process is one of the easier aspect of a campaign. Pareto's law of 80/20 applies (more like 90/10 actually).

90% of your keywords need little or no day to day management.
90% of your action will come from 10% of your keywords. So if you have 1000 keywords, then maybe 100 need to be managed.
90% of your sales will come from 10% of your keywords and their derivatives.