Forum Moderators: not2easy
So as I'm looking at a particular site, I noticed that it had what I thought was a pretty cool header/banner at the top of each page.
Pretty cool use of images I thought, and well laid out. The header varied a bit from page to page using images that were appropriate for that page. Nicely done, I thought.
Then I realized they were my images! [At least I think so.] LOL
OK, it's a hobby field and a LOT of the hobbyists are pretty .... uhh.... casual ... about using other peoples images without crediting the image owner/creator.
But this is the first time I've seen someone take my images, rework them (delete the backgrounds) and use them in this manner.
I think that would be called a derivitive work, but I'm not sure. I'm also not sure if this would fall into fair use territory.
Given that this is a non-profit enthusiast group using my images I don't really want to make a fuss about it, their members are a large part of my target audience too, I don't want to offend them.
But I would like credit for the use of my images.
I've thought about sending an email to the group and/or their webmaster complimenting them on what a nice website they have (it is good), and mentioning the uncanny resmblence between their header images and my images.
Good idea? Bad?
I'm not looking for money, just photo credits.
What you describe is almost certainly not Fair Use.
A good source on Fair Use information is:
[fairuse.stanford.edu...]
Just my 2 cents.
What harm is it if they use some different version of your images?
Images are a large part of the value of my site. They are why many people come to my site, that's what they are looking for at the moment.
Others come looking for information, but we are talking about images in this thread.
A good number of the people looking for images on my site click on a ad when they are done looking around. They click on an ad, I get paid.
If they see the images somewhere else, then they won't see the ads on my site, won't click an ad on my site, and I won't get paid.
Still making a fuss about it is likely to upset at least some hobbyists, and word travels fast. I don't need a reputation as a jerk in the hobby.
Finding the balance between reasonably protecting my work and acting in a way that is comsistent with the general attitude freely of sharing knowledge in the hobby is the trick.
If they see the images somewhere else, then they won't see the ads on my site, won't click an ad on my site, and I won't get paid.
Yes, but you said they were only using your images as headers. That's not the same as posting your images outright.
A copyright holder controls any and all derivative works of that property - reworking a copyrighted image is violation of copyright.
I personally have zero tolerance for theft of images - I run a travel site and people "borrow" the images on a frequent basis.
Everytime the Google or Yahoo image search updates I find new sites using my images.
They all get C&D's and/or DMCA complaints, depending on their responses.
No, not all derivative works are a violation of copyright.
ken_b was right in the first place to ask about how Fair Use applies to derivative works. In fact, not all derivitive works as a normal person might interpret that term are derivitive works in the legal sense.
In this case, it almost certainly is not Fair Use, and it is unlikely that it is sufficiently modified that it would not qualify as a derivative work in the legal sense.
ken_b is also right to worry about his reputation in a hobby field. Few people would be bothered by him asking for credit where it is due him, but sending out C&Ds would very quickly change his name to , um, excrement in the community.
In my field, I can think of two companies off hand that have been hurt by the attitudes of their owners. In both cases the owners start waving the lawsuit flag incredibly easily.
kenb,
Since your pictures are so popular, have you considered posting some terms for the "sharing" of your pictures?
If you are very open about sharing *with proper attribution*, and you do not get that attribution, you are likely to even end up with a base of people that will actually argue your side online and you will then be safe in taking a harsher stance with those that are not in compliance.
For example, you can limit the number of pictures that any individual website may use. You can require that they link the image back to the page on your site that contains the image with appropriate ALT text. Include proper attribution, etc.
This way you might find people pointing out when they find one of your shots on another site. We've had that happen several times already this year.
Get a grip. Going around suing everyone is just anal-retentive, especially when it's this minor of an "infraction".
Now if they STOLE his images and posted them as their own, that's another story. But they didn't.
Don't waste your time on minor things when it's not important.
Nuff said for me on this topic.
Since your pictures are so popular, have you considered posting some terms for the "sharing" of your pictures?
I haven't had a statement like that in the past, but I'm sure considering it now. Thanks.
If you are very open about sharing *with proper attribution*, ...
I have been very casual in the past about folks using my photos. Frankly, they aren't great photos, and they weren't meant to be. They are what could best be described as "record shots" overall.
As I've been thinking about this the last couple of days, I've begun to think I might want to consider setting up a clip art/image bank of available images though, with the stipulation that photo/clipart credit be given.
For example, you can limit the number of pictures that any individual website may use.
Normally when I'm asked for permission, I limit the number to 20 images or so. Most often those requests come from students working on web site design projects for school.
I do ask for a list of images they want to use because some images on my site have been submitted by hobbyists and I don't have authority to grant republishing of hobbyist submitted photos. I stopped accepting photo submissions a while back for the most part, because of copyright concerns.
I ask for photo credits and that hasn't been a problem when people have asked for permission as opposed to just using the photos without asking.
At this point I'm thinking more along the lines of how to turn this situation into an opportunity as opposed to letting it continue as a problem.
If I were you, I'd send a very friendly letter, just asking... "Did you guys get those photos from my site? If you did, would you post some fairly inobtrusive credit for their use? I'd appreciate it."
You could even use it as an occasion to start off a discussion about doing reciprocal linking.
