Is it OK to charge for Public Domain Items?

[musicales]

I want to put some PDF files that are in the public domain on my site. But as they are a large download (several megabytes each) I want to make them available only to my paying members. Is this acceptable does anyone know? (In terms of effectively charging for access to public domain work).

[Sanenet]

To the best of my knowledge, even if a document is in the Public Domain, the copyright is still retained by the original author.

Therefore, you could get in trouble if the author complained. Basically, if it's in the Public Domain, you can just republish and share the work, but not profit from it.

However, if you are just charging the same amount as it costs you to find and distribute it (i.e., no profit for you), you should be OK. Putting it into a members only section should be fine as long as you aren't taking credit for it or using the work to encourage people to sign up to your site.

Sanenet.

P.S. - Usual disclaimer: I'm not a lawyer, just my opinion, rules change from country to person to personal reality... blah blah.

[anchordesk]

Warning - I am not a lawyer.

If something is in the public domain ... and you are a part of the public-at-large ... it's yours to profit from as you see fit. If copyrights are in effect, it's not in the public domain. It's in a specific domain ... the copyright holder. Now the copyright holder can place it in the public domain, but once done, they relinquish all rights.

Some will argue that it becomes a moral issue. Be that as it may, public domain is in the publics domain. If you can repackage public domain content, by all means you can charge for your services. Many publishers do just that.

[musicales]

Thanks guys. The stuff in question is very old so there should be no problem with copyright holders. I feel morally I have a clear conscience as I couldn't afford to offer them for free - the bandwidth costs would be too high.

anchordesk - I'd be most grateful if you have any example you could sticky me of such 'repackaging'.

[jim_w]

Yester-century, there were several companies that put PD software onto floppy disks, and I'm talking 360k floppys, and sold them. It was perfectly OK for them to charge a nominal fee for their time and effort to organize, maintain, etc. which added to the PD works.

[buckworks]

To the best of my knowledge, even if a document is in the Public Domain, the copyright is still retained by the original author.

No, being in the public domain means that the copyright has expired and the work is available for others to use in various ways. The length of time a copyright remains in effect varies in different countries.

Basically, if it's in the Public Domain, you can just republish and share the work, but not profit from it.

No, again. If a work is in the public domain, others are free to reproduce it, create derivative works, and so on, and if they can make a profit while doing so, more power to them.

as long as you aren't taking credit for it

Don't stop with not taking credit. Do your best to give full, clear credit to the original author/composer/illustrator/whatever even if the copyright has long expired.

Something to remember is that while a work might be in the public domain, there may be some limits to what actions you can take to reproduce it.

Example: suppose you wanted to publish a collection of sheet music for Beethoven piano sonatas and sell it on CD so people could print out the pieces they wanted to learn. It would be legitimate for you to reset the music and create a new edition. It might not be legitimate to just scan some existing sheet music and put that on your CD.

Beethoven's compositions are in the public domain, but the publisher of the sheet music might still have copyright on their work of typesetting and engraving the music for their particular edition. If that copyright were still in force you'd have to get permission to re-use their printed version.

Musicales, who created the PDF files you're thinking of using, and how were they created? There might be some copyright permissions you need to obtain that cover aspects of the presentation, even if the core content is in the public domain.

[musicales]

They are held on a public domain website and both source and edition are in the public domain - they were probably created as PDFs by a library I think. There is a notice on the site that says you "may freely copy, print, distribute the files"

From what's being said, it sounds like I'm in the clear.

[John_Shaw]

Keep in mind that many companies make profit by selling various old (King James, etc.) translations of the bible, as well a derivative works.

Also Lexis, West, and others sell online access and print copies of statutes and court decisions that are public records and are in the public domain. They charge a large amount even though the information is really available to the public for free. Lawyers and others pay for the service because of the value added by the compilation, organization, ease of access, and the fact that all those books make their offices look like law offices.

There are many other examples.

If you are sure that there are no copyright restrictions, you should have no problem.

disclaimer-I am not a lawyer. If you really want to know, find a lawyer and be willing to pay.

[BlueSky]

I don't know how it works in other countries, but in the US the only ones running public domain websites are the federal government and those who specifically state their site is public domain. The latter of which is very rare.

Don't confuse public domain with someone giving permission to "freely copy, print, distribute the files". Giving something away for free does not mean the orginators gave up their copyright. In the US, any material produced by federal government employees is automatically public domain. Depending on the state, material created by state government employees may be as well. Contractor produced work may or may not be depending on the contract. For everyone else, they have to outright say they are placing it in the public domain (ie giving up all claim to copyright on the material). If they don't specifically say this, then it goes by timeframe on when it expires. Works published before 1923 are in the public domain. After that year, it depends on whether they registered the material and renewed their claim.

Anyway, you can charge for public domain material. Even if it's not, you can still charge for it unless the originators specifically forbid you from doing so.

[amznVibe]

Um, if a group puts on a play that is "in the public domain" (which is commonly done) and they charge for attendance, surely they are allowed to do that to make up their costs of renting the space and costumes, etc.

I know logic has little to do with law, but the above happens all the time, no?

[musicales]

The website also says

"All the files are derived from public domain music in editions that are in the public domain"

- it's a US libraries website which seems to be 'promoting the spread of the public domain'.

[richlowe]

It's quite common (in the US at least) to charge for public domain materials. You can do with it what you will. You just have to be absolutely sure it IS in the public domain...

[Hollerith]

Since you are only charging people because these downloads cost you (bandwidth issues), why not just put a link to the original PDF (perhaps in a pop-up window with set height and width, so your visitors are less likely to go wandering through that site)?

Or just give them the link to the original PDFs without restriction? Why copy large files to your own site and then see them cost you money?