Forum Moderators: LifeinAsia
Yeah, it's expensive. But it's a lot more expensive to have a major surgery without coverage. Do you really want to risk your life (or the lives of your loved ones) to save a few bucks?
If you're relatively healthy, then you can save some money with high deductibles. That way if something happens and you need major surgery, you're only out a few thousand dollars.
As a reminder (if you're in the U.S.), health insurance for the self-employed is 100% deductable for taxes.
must admit can feel your pain as when my wife and i looked into it when she was thinking of changing from job with full cover for family to job with no cover, was very very worrying the amounts quoted
both my wife and i would be considered high risk so the premiums were pretty scary
stve
You cannot afford to be without the insurance. You are risking your life without it.
We now live in Virginia, a decidedly more pro-business state than Vermont. Our premium is around $515/month and the coverage is very good with small copays and a $2,500 deductible for the entire family.
In any case if you're self-employed or are the only employee of the corporation or partnership, depending on the structure of your organization you may be able to create a benefit for your full-time employees (you) that pays the insurance PLUS all medical expenses (prescriptions, copays). Having the company pay these is better for you, because it's an expense that the company can write off. If you're paying them personally, then it's presumably with W2 income that has been taxed and so on. Talk to your accountant.
I agree with others. Health insurance is expensive because health care is expensive. Sure you may never need it, but you can't predict that. Find a plan that you can afford now that has a very high deductible (say, $5,000). The higher the deductible, the lower you premium will be. Then at least you're protected from catastrophes. If something terrible happens, emergency surgery and a week long stay in an intensive care unit could cost $250,000!
Sean
Less than $300 per month? How good are your benefits?
For $259 per month the policy is accepted in all 50 states which I couldn't get with United Health Care; $1000 deductable and 80/20 (i pay 20) on my prescriptions and $15-$20 co-pay at the Dr's for in-network physicians (You'll pay more for a specialist like a cardiologist as an example). Too, if you're in FL, BCBS has also negoiated every hospital in the state into the plan with the exception of 1. You just have to be careful where some hospitals have completely outsourced the ER staff & mgmt. In those situations you may/will be facing a physicians fee on top of your insurance policy if that outsourced group doesn't have an agreement with BCBS.
The most I can be out of pocket is $3000 in a calendar year. And for $35 per month my wife and child are both covered with Dental via Blue Cross Blue Shield too.
It's not BCBSs' cadillac policy which is more along the $500-$600 per month flavor but it lets me sleep at night.
This is a good thread, insurance is such a pain in the rear.
This is a good thread, insurance is such a pain in the rear.
Yes, but, for different reasons.
I can afford good Health Insurance, but, I see it as a rip-off, so I don't choose to purchase it.
Unfortunately I also believe that most people in the USA see it as a rip-off, and those that pay for it also see that they should recoup the costs by making unnecessary visits to the Doc!
It is the mentality that says "If we have to pay this much, we will use it"....all that does is drive up the costs in future years.
I have sufficient capital reserves to pay for heart attacks or cancer, so for me being "self-insured" works better.
I believe it is true that the Health Industry is scamming the US population, I also believe it is true that the USA population aren't helping by visiting the Doc "too Often".
You only have to watch TV for "60 minutes" on a Sunday evening to see that 50% of the TV commercials are encouraging you to go to the Doc for something you need to get treated for. High cholesterol, ED, bone loss, allergies, deceases like RLS that your parents would laugh at! All aimed to create business from the insured.
Insurance companies will always make a profit, at their subscriber's expense. If you decline the extended warranty on your new washing machine, then you are only a few steps away from declining offerings of "current health insurance", excessive car insurance, excessive home owners insurance and of course most types of life insurance.
IMHO all types of insurance are evil, that would take hundreds of pages to discuss in depth, but, if you look at the fundamental concept it is simply this:
Do you want to pay before it happens, or after it happens?
Do you have no health insurance then?
I visit the US often, and stay for three months at a time. Thats a month too long for any travel insurance I've ever been offered, so I'm not sure what I should do.
I got ill in America once. I went to the Doc. 60 minutes and $70 later I was cured.
Contrast that with lying on the floor in casualty for 7 hours, for 'free', in the UK before giving up and getting carried home by my (regular) cab driver. I was lucky to survive that as it was adreno-cortical insufficiency brought on by prescription drugs no one warned me about.
So far US 1, UK nil. And we pay a fortune for that nil through taxes.
I might like some US health insurance for three months, next time. If anyone has any recommendations, PM me. I'd sure rather be ill in the US.
This is the main reason I keep my "day job." It offers medical benefits which, unfortunately, I need.
The US has something called "COBRA" which is a program that allows you to pay your own health premiums if you lose your job, but this is allowed for only a maximum of 18 months. After that, there is something called a HIPAA plan which apparently for me would be a few thousand dollars a month.
Not much choice here.
I should add, however, that before being diagnosed with this condition, Blue Cross/Blue Shield (Anthem) was offering fairly reasonable rates of about 200 dollars a month. If you're in good health, and especially if you're younger, this may be the way to go.
Also, you might look for a "co op" insurance place. There are companies that handle medical benefits for several small businesses allowing them to get the rates of a medium to large business.
JK
[edited by: JollyK at 9:18 pm (utc) on April 4, 2006]
those that pay for it also see that they should recoup the costs by making unnecessary visits to the Doc!
Boy that is so true. Most people just loooooove going to the Doctor, and if someone else pays for it they'll just do it all the livelong day. Just human nature, I guess. Why, just thinking about it has got me salivating for the hours-long waits, the selection of 1990's reading material, the smell of antiseptic-trying-to-cover-vomit, and the trending-towards-minimum-wage receptionists. Who wouldn't want to spend their days in that kind of fantasy?
Yup, no doubt about, it's the people who actually use health care who are to blame for its high cost. Fortunately, insurance companies are cleverly segregating people who use health care from those who don't, so if you're 20 and in good health you can get insurance pretty darn cheap -- right up until you actually start using it.
Hospitals routinely charge a 10,000% mark-up on ordinary items and procedures and unique items and procedures are marked up even more.
But when you need a treatment you are hardly in a position to shop around and the health care industry preys upon your misfortune.
Must we really pay $39.00 for an aspirin tablet when hospitalized? It is abuse like this that makes me want to see hospital administrators led off in handcuffs. Unfortunately there aren't enough jails to hold them all.
1. Cobra - we could have extended our benefits for 18 months under Cobra and then would have been guranteed coverage with a private insurer, even for pre-existing medical conditions, under HIPAA (Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act). We would have had to pay indiviudal policy rates for our family of about $600 a month, but at least we would have had insurance.
2. If you have your own business and have employees (which can include relatives) you might be able to get a group health policy for your small business.
3. A lot of retail stores have group health benefits even for part time employees. We thought if we couldn't qualify for an individual policy for some reason, one of use would just try to get a part time job at a store a few nights a week just for the health coverage. (I figued I would come out ahead money wise working for myself as my main job and just getting a part time job for the health benefits rather than getting a full time day job and working on my sites part time).
4. Some professional associations also offer group health benefits.
My father-in-law just got on me pretty hard about not having health insurance and said we should check into major medical. It upset me enough that I cried, and then he felt really bad. He couldn't help himself, he is an insurance salesman.
If you have a cold or break a leg you are paying for it. If you need a liver/kidney transplant (something major) the insurance pays for it. Its good for generally healthy people and fairly cheap. It allows you to cover the minor stuff which prevents you from abusing things like $10 copays, but protects you when you need expensive things done.
Did you say your dad was an insurance salesman and he didn't explain what "major medical" is?
No, absolutely none......pay as you go is much cheaper as long as you have reserves to afford that route!
>I might like some US health insurance for three months, next time. If anyone has any recommendations, PM me. I'd sure rather be ill in the US.
Bupa International offers a decent program if you think you are likely to need emergency health care. I had their coverage for a while 10 years ago, via a corporate scheme.
Basically in an emergency they will pay to get you fixed in the USA, in a none emergency they will get you back to the UK to get fixed.
My father-in-law sells insurance and his rant was right after dinner and in that parental "tone". I wasn't in the mindset to ask questions then. Reading this thread was timely, so I thought I'd ask you all.
Major medical sounds good, now the question is finding an affordable option. I can share some links with folks, just sticky me.
No question about that. A tax deduction at Adjusted Gross Income level. It comes off the top!
Absolutely anyone self employed should learn whats going on with HSA's. It does not help the cost of your insurance but can make a large part of deductables and out-of-pocket expense deductable from the top. I.e. get high deductable insurance, which is the cheapeast and out-of-pocket costs are fully deductable to a certain level because you pay with your HSA (you don't have to meet the normal high percentage of expense-to-income for tax deduction qualification). This is the best deal you are going to find. IMHO
well, someone else is paying for you, and he/she is not even getting a "thank you" note. Most likely that person is working 80 hours a week, taking risks and losing sleep so he could still afford a few thinsg after he's done paying his taxes for the "free" healthcare and other benefits.
not sure about that. I would never go without a major medical option as some medical procedures cost well north of $500,000. Even if had that money and much more, paying a few hundred a month would make sense.
