Time standards

Standard time to design web site

[altima]

What is average time (hrs) required to create custom web site design?
Let's have in example: we need to make design solution for quite small site, about 10 sections. As design solution I understand home page and 1 internal page template delivered in HTML. Pages have mouse-overs, processing of client's graphic, Flash animated elements. Let's count that we allow client make 1 major and 3-5 minor revision of designed mock-up.
In our company we have standard time for such solution 45-55 hrs.
I'll appreciate other member's opinion to understand how fast (or slow) my designers are?

[edited by: Travoli at 1:41 pm (utc) on Feb. 19, 2004]

[benihana]

45- 55 hours for that site seems like a large amount of time for that site but it depends on how much YOU have to pay your designers: e.g. a designer that costs twice as much but takes a third of the time maybe better value (assuming quality of work is equal)

[altima]

Thanks for reply, benihana

What is your time standard for similar work?

My designer's salary is quite good (above average) according our country standards.

[balinor]

I'd say a site like that (minus the flash) would take in the neighborhood of 25 hours or so, depending on how quickly the layout was finalized with the client. The coding itself: probably around 15-20 hours.

[benihana]

yep i was thinking around the 20-30 hours mark, but it really depends on the quality of the info supplied by the client - e.g. did they send the translated version etc etc.

[altima]

In my question to simplify evaluation I asked about only design solution - home page and 1 internal page template. Evaluate the whole site is to complex, I don't want you spend so much time. BTW it has server side PHP programming, so let's forget about it.
So work will be:
1) develop graphic mock-up and confirm it with client, maybe make some changes, including looks of roll-over effects
2) Create Flash element (s)
3) Prepare HTML code for these 2 pages - home and internal template

Here we spent about next time:
1) 30-35 hrs
2) 7-10 hrs
3) 8-10 hrs

Balinor, Benihana do I correcly understand that such work without Flash should be done in 25-30 hrs in your companies?

[benihana]

1) 10 hours
2) 4-8 hours
3) i tend to provide clients with an html page as a mock up anyway, so the bulk of this will be done >>> 3-4 hours.
(to be fair - i use dreamweaver and then clean up by hand - so coding is pretty quick - especially if the clients sends good copy for cut and paste)

[balinor]

I'd agree with benihana, except #1 can be a whole lot more time depending on how many tries it takes to get the right layout. I've had clients who love the first one I sent them, and I have also spent weeks working with other clients because they are picky as hell.

[benihana]

yeah balinor - the last similar layout i did took about 5 hours from blank photoshop canvas to mock up html, because it went quite smoothly. Now, if it hadnt gone smoothly, or the client hates it, it could easily go up to 15 or more, so i guess 10 was an averageish figure.

[altima]

You are very fast, guys.

I don't know how it can be. We have simpler solution with less standard time, but even there it's 20-24 hrs for all (design solution and HTML) and this is without any flash and much simpler in term of design, something like:
<snipped URL>

Do you use any wizards or templates that adjust for client's needs or design sites from scratch?

[edited by: Travoli at 1:42 pm (utc) on Feb. 19, 2004]
[edit reason] no URL's please [/edit]

[balinor]

Everything I do is from scratch, as benihana says, from a blank Photoshop image.

FYI, it is against the Webmaster World Terms of Service [webmasterworld.com] to post URLs Altima, so you should remove the ones you have posted so far.

[Fenceman]

You guys show the client a full HTML mockup during the design phase? rollovers, menus, multiple pages, etc?

I usually just design any significant pages in Photoshop and then export to some format for the client's approval before I start to reproduce the design in HTML.

I can see pro/cons to each. Obviously my clients don't have anything to click on, no interaction. However, I'm not designing with HTML in mind and I find I can be more free flowing and less restricted. Also, since I usually show the client 3 to 5 designs, I don't have to replicate each of them in HTML, just the final, approved design.

[balinor]

No, I don't do anything in HTML until the client signs off on a .jpg template. Usually takes 4 or 5 cracks at it to get it right, and then I start with HTML. I learned this the hard way!

[altima]

we also never do HTML before client accept mock-up. It will be double time to make corrections otherwise.

[benihana]

i do tend do html mocks simply because a lot of the clients i work for understand that better - they get what e.g. a rollover is if they can actual see it happen.

also i when it comes to laying stuff out i often get a page of their content and mark it up 'purely' e.g simple <h> and <p> tags in a very structural manner. i like to flick between photoshop and css to start 'decorating' when the structures in place as it allows for fine control, and helps bring any potential problems out as development goes on.

the last design i did like this the client liked but wanted to change the color scheme, so i took a screen grab and then
produced different jpgs of the layout simply by changing the colors in photoshop - it was extremely quick, and ill easily be able to alter the actual graphics when the client picks one color they like.

/but thats just me, everybody works in different ways...

[altima]

We show rollover on mock-ups, like make one menu item active, other passive and 3-rd 'stick' (show current page), if have such option.
For Flash, we usually show a concept (several key frames, with explanation) and than do actulal Flash, while for small work can make Flash from start.

[Fenceman]

Thanks for clearing that up. I was worried that most designers were doing all the HTML in the design phase and I better get my butt working before things get away from me :)