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After 2 month and after florida, Google penalize my sites, they had PR=4 or 5 and now they have PR=0 and you can't find them in SERPS.
Someone know how to re enter in the index in hurry? And with the normal Page rank?
Thanks.
It would be trivial for a competitor to spam the competition's URL to lots of blogs. If Google is penalizing for this, this is truly bad and alarming.
It would be trivial for a competitor to spam the competition's URL to lots of blogs. If Google is penalizing for this, this is truly bad and alarming.
It think about it too.
if someone spam my sites to many blogs and after google penalize these sites what i can do?
How can i demostrate im not spamming but it's my competitor?
Why googleguy said, external factors don't penalize your site..? Uhmm
Ok the only thing google can do is to reindex the websites but it takes long time, if a company have business only with SEO if it lost their sites what will happen?
I mean if these sites can't be in adwords for strict adwords rules how a company can live?
?!?! gulp?!?!
Google is doing so much better than pre-florida, but it still is vulnerable to the obvious bits of zero-content anchor text spam -- especially in combination. I'm looking at a site that just rocketed up the serps for a 20,000,000+ term. It has less than eighty backlinks, of which seventy or so are from blogs and message boards (the other ten are junk link exchanges). This gets the page a middling amount of PR. Then, the "content" of this site is one page consisting of nine links to family sites, plus a "partner links" link. This partner links section... well, I'm looking at page2016.asp right now. Thousands of pages of off topic, irrelevant, anchor text junk.
I'm glad the datacenters haven't come back because if this is what we have been waiting for it would be catastrophic.
Dear Google, florida was great. Now PLEASE add some topic relevance; please ignore all linksmanager pages; please consider blogs the same as message boards and ignore those links in terms of topicality.
I personally do understand that blog spamming is a tough one for Google to deal with, and that many blogs are legitimate, but this is one of the key/succesfull spammers tools of choice right now, and it is only getting worse.
... for someone who got caught doing something against the rules
that's just it, there are no *RULES*, only conventions,
superstitions, what have you.
but it IS like cheating at a card game, ...
well, no, because card games have *codified* rules.
try cheating in a real casino sometime.
an observation: organisations promulgate rules and
regulations for behaviour that *threatens* them or
offer them an advantage. ergo, it is fruitful, with
regard to google to examine their rules and guidelines,
with an eye to attempts to regulate by fiat, what they
cannot prevent with technology.
in other words, what guidelines are in place simply
because they cannot force compliance by technical means?
You never did answer if they were blogger weblogs. If you were really penalized for this (which I still doubt), this is a very important question to answer.
And if they were Blogger weblogs, did you post the messages from the same IP address as your site?
Like I said, the comments were not aimed
at you, I just found them to be a convenient
starting point.
The point is everyone at the card table
knows the rules not some guidelines
that move like quicksand.
I think that this is an important distinction
when calling someone out for some supposed
violation.
If you play by the rules, you have nothing to fear from the guidelines.
Huh?
What rules?
There are guidelines and a lot of folklore, there
are no rules.
By this, I mean that there is a lot of gray fog
out there. Nothing as simple as the rules of
poker.
And to repeat an old nut, they can't even figure
out how to correctly apply some pretty basic rfc's.
Can any of the leading lights here truly say that
they never stray from the guidelines and never
do anything for their own advantage? Even WWM
does not link freely, but carefully hoards PR.
You said:
Can any of the leading lights here truly say that
they never stray from the guidelines and never
do anything for their own advantage?
Where do you people get this strange idea that google does not want you to "do anything for your own advantage". If they did not want you to be able to improve your site for better rankings, why do they specifically tell you how to do it?
If you read their guidelines page, it is basically a list of *things to do*.
The last section tells you what not to do, particularly
Avoid tricks intended to improve search engine rankings. A good rule of thumb is whether you'd feel comfortable explaining what you've done to a website that competes with you. Another useful test is to ask, "Does this help my users? Would I do this if search engines didn't exist?"
This doesn't say that you should not try to improve your rankings, it says "don't try and trick us". Are you unable to tell the difference between things you do to actually improve your site and a "trick"?
Yeah, there is a grey area, but it really is very small.
Just because google does not catch you (currently) does not mean that it is in the grey area. Even if it is in the grey area, you should understand that you are the one taking a chance when you play in the fog.
I can honestly say that I only take small excursions into the grey area, and only in those cases where someone doing a manual check would understand the reason. For example, hiding a document from the SE using a JS link because it was coming up for a lot of searches that were serving no one's interest.
Have I done things to get better search engine rankings? Of course. And I almost always get complements from users for the changes improving their experience. Do I try and trick the SE? No.
Google wants the best sites to come up at the top, and if you happen to decide to make the best possible site in your category, and it ranks #1, they would be thrilled. That is why they tell you how to do it.
madone,
You never did answer if they were blogger weblogs. If you were really penalized for this (which I still doubt), this is a very important question to answer.And if they were Blogger weblogs, did you post the messages from the same IP address as your site?
Yes there are blacklists, in there you can find a lot of sites, if someone write a site in blogs it block his/her message.
I think a owner of a blog just give to google this list so it penalize the sites.
I used the same ip address.
Google has the log files, and they will have a record of the IP addresses of the people that spam the blogs. If the IP addr of the spammer matches the address of the site they are spamming, then that is proof positive.
Your actions are damaging one of their properties, so it would make sense for them to penalize your site.
Are you unable to tell the difference between things you do to actually improve your site and a "trick"?
Of course.
Just because google does not catch you (currently) does not mean that it is in the grey area. Even if it is in the grey area, you should understand that you are the one taking a chance when you play in the fog.
Actually, I only play in the clear blue sky.
My *problem*, should you wish to call it that, is
simply that things that are known to work
or guidelines are refered to as rules.
This may be purely semantics, but semantics affects
perception.
Further, my earlier point is, and remains, that it
is useful to consider that organisations have a
tendency to promulgate directives when they cannot
accomplish their goals unilaterally. Therefore,
studying the guidelines with this in mind, *may*
yield some useful clues as to current weaknesses
in their abilities. The *may* is emphasised.
+++
Further, my earlier point is, and remains, that it
is useful to consider that organisations have a
tendency to promulgate directives when they cannot
accomplish their goals unilaterally. Therefore,
studying the guidelines with this in mind, *may*
yield some useful clues as to current weaknesses
in their abilities. The *may* is emphasised.
Oh, there is no question that this is true, and no one ever seemed to say otherwise.
BUT, if you go against the "rules" (it is their game, therefore the rules are what they decide), even if you are not caught, you are still going against them. Then if you get caught at a later time, *it is your own fault*.
He spammed blogs. He admitted he spammed blogs. He feels he was caught for spamming blogs. Some people seem to think this is unfair because "innocent" people might get caught. Well, we haven't heard any evicence of an innocent person getting caught, only a guilty one. He broke a rule, a rule set by the cops, judge, jury and executioner. He doesn't even have to know that it is a rule for it to be a rule.
I doubt in the real world that the IPs used by spammers to spam blogs is in the same block the servers are on very often.
The same goes for spamming message boards. I had no idea there was so much trash being posted on message boards. Links to Viagra and enlarge your *** sites all over them. Yet at this point I don't see Google filtering out these links. A competitor in my industry ranks #1 with a huge number of these backlinks showing up when you search for his backlinks.
I hope Google will soon figure out how to filter out both blogs and message boards.
I hope Google will soon figure out how to filter out both blogs and message boards.
I certainly hope not. On Webmaster World (which is a message board in case you didn't notice) there is a tendancy to only think in terms of how things can be used to spam.
And while there is only a limited amount of useful content on guestbooks. Blogs and message boards are some of the largest sources of useful, up-to-date information on the web.
Slashdot is a blog. Groklaw is a blog. And Dave Barry's blog kindly passes PR to a lot of pages that I find to be quite hilarious.
As for useful message boards, in addition to webmaster world, I generally end up finding answers to my programming questions on message boards rather than on official pages.
For example, about the only good information out there on blocking e-mail address harvesters is on the boards. If you go with the static pages on various websites, you will only come up with information that is at least several months old.
He broke a rule, a rule set by the cops, judge, jury and executioner. He doesn't even have to know that it is a rule for it to be a rule.
And now, we get to the crux of the matter,
even though it has taken the long way round.
These words bring to mind, such other words as:
Spanish Inquisition, McCarthyism, Alice in Wonderland,
and Weapons of Mass Destruction.
So, between the IPO, dollars wasted on SEO,
dollars wasted on bad searches, how much money
is Google going to suck out of the economy
this year?
As you can see, I love conspiracy theories :)
+++
Google is not a goverment agency, nor are they governed by contract law in their SERPs.
They are a site that gives their opinion on what I might be looking for when I enter a search term. Most of the time, I like their opinion, therefore I go back to them often.
You can have all the conspiracy theories that you want, it doesn't make one bit of difference. When it comes to what goes on their site, all that matters is what Google thinks.
Your only option is to use them or not.
I certainly hope not. On Webmaster World (which is a message board in case you didn't notice) there is a tendancy to only think in terms of how things can be used to spam.
I guess I wasn't very clear in my post - I didn't mean to suggest that Google filter out blogs and message boards from their SERPS - those can be very useful.
What I meant to suggest is that Google should be able to filter out the spammy links on those blogs and bbs so that the sites that are spamming them don't get a PR boost ahead of those who are developing content rich, honest sites. I rank quite well for my search terms, but I'm still consistently outranked by a guy who spams blogs and message and has virtually no content on his site. Even though I continue to add fresh content to my site, it seems I'll never be able to compete with the 100s of keyword-ladden links he has posted to blogs and message boards in response to topics that have absolutely nothing to do with his industry.
It just rubs me wrong that bad behavior would be rewarded like this, and it isn't helping Google produce the best results in their SERPS either. And I guess that should be Google's main concern with this issue.
[edited by: oilman at 6:09 pm (utc) on Feb. 23, 2004]
[edit reason] no email quotes please [/edit]
Thanks google you brake my business for long time.
But in your first post you said
Hello, i tried to post as message in different blogs my own websites.
I'm sorry, but you were the one that broke your business. Google has no contractural responsibility to list your pages.
Buy advertising.
If there is a problem there is a solution for this. Which is the solution?
I can pay google to re-rank my sites :-)
Blog-spamming can't be penalized. I think you have to look somewhere else. Maybe your site was just down.
How would you implement an algo to sort spammy links from good ones?
If you could, Google will hire you instantly :)
http://www.jayallen.org/comment_spam/blacklist.txt
This black list is present in many blogs.
[edited by: engine at 6:35 pm (utc) on Feb. 23, 2004]
[edit reason] de-linked [/edit]
I suggest that you read the "charter" link at the top of this page.
In the meantime, here are some quick guidelines as to post types and phrases that might trigger an action:
<snip>
# Personal pleas: the site in my profile - can you sticky me the url or offering to stickymail the url to look.
<snip>
# pleas to specific users such as a mod or Google representative.
