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I must say that whenever I read this forum, there is always something in the back of my mind that just doesnt add up when i see Googleguy interacting with everyone here.
Allow me to give you my 2 cents for what its worth...
A wise man once told me to always follow the money trail when looking at intentions. Google is a company that is making HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS. Their main source of revenue is Google Adwords.
As an organic SEO consultant for years, I've seen clear and conclusive evidence as of late that Google does NOT look kindly on the SEO industry as a whole. Think about it... when SEO's succeed, GOOGLE LOSES MONEY. If we can help our clients to rank better in the MAIN search results (where 95% of the traffic is), than the client will have less need to PAY Google thru Adwords!
We've all seen the recent "Beware of SEOs" post that Google put on their website... and if any of you are SEOs, you've surely had clients call their Google Adword Reps and ask them if its ok to use you. Whenever my prospects ask, they dont get anything positive in response thats for sure.
If you were a Google executive looking long term at revenue growth potential... and you saw the "organic" SEO industry experiencing explosive growth like it is... what would you think?
95% of people skip over the Google Adwords and click on the main search results. That HAS to mean something Google. There is actuallly a hidden incentive now to make the results LESS relevant so that more people click on the adwords. (Im not saying they have gone this far yet, but its interesting to think about.)
So here's a possible theory:
1 - Google saw the light and realized that their single biggest future threat and competition are Organic SEO companies. They also do not want the average Webmaster to be able to rank high on their own so that they will have to use Adwords.
They have an incentive to throw us all off by doing things that make no sense. They do it just enough to where the results are still decent enough, but it hurts the ability of an SEO company to have any level of security and stability... even the ones using perfectly legitimately means.
2 - Is anyone here open to the possibility that GoogleGuy may not be the hero that everyone here treats him as (no offense - just speaking my mind - hope i dont get censored).
Think about it, I never see Google Guy telling us anything that REALLY help us know whats going on... its always weird cryptic messages that dont mean anything.
C'mon folks... do you REALLY believe that GoogleGuy is just some Google employee sitting at a desk who thinks its cool to interact with the largest known group of professional SEOs on the plant (WebmasterWorld)? Dont you think he is being closely monitored by the uppers at Google, and everything he says is being carefully watched?
I cant help but think that Googleguy is getting information from us rather than the other way around...
There's one other saying a wise man once said that I believe GoogleGuy might be following:
"Keep your friends close... and your enemies closer."
Again - im sure that Googleguy is a nice fella... just throwing out some possible theories here.
They know 99% of the tricks out there, and maybe only ever learn the other 1% from people here ;)
First. What's an organic SEO?
Second. The strategy to reduce the quality of the SERPS for users is suicidal. There are plenty of competitors, and they have learned from google and getting much better. The SERPS are their product. They only sell off the side, and if people dont come to see their SERPS they would be off somewhere else.
Now, to make the SERPS more confusing for Webmasters is a different thing altogether! If i was Google i would make it as confusing as possible. I would be laughing off my head now with all these update threads and slapping each other on the back.
Googleguy is here as a classic PR man to help us if we help them. There are many goals in common. When goals do not co-incide, GG has a great place to give google's side and pick up intelligence. GG will have weekly briefing at least i think to top-middle management Im absolutely sure, and Im not too convinces he's the cleaner either - i think he's pretty high up.
If i had a search engine i would be here 20 hours a week soaking up some SEO tricks so i know how to combat them. That said, the best SEO tricks are NEVER talked about here, im absolitely convinced.
Third: YEs there is a small amount of i love google posts, possible the same amount of i dont like google posts. However the vast majority of WebmasterWorld members are mature and intelligent enough to unemotionally and rationally assess where synergies exist, and that Google at the moment, like it or not, at the moment is an important player.
Fourth. You are absolutely right that SEO is a threat to Google. We stuff up their rankings to kingdom come. Part of GG's function is to scare us a bit, and make us play the game. Yes, we all realise that. And Google continually works to make the work of tricky SEO less impactful.
But the argument that Google will purposely reduce the value of their SERPS *for the user* to get advertisers is flawed due to the reasons above. Yep, its in their interest to make it as hard for people to reverse engineer, predict,and work out their algo as possible. So i see a lot of people complaining that sj.fi whatever results are terrible (though their (own) terms are fine thanks!) but i dont see Google USERS complaining.
edit: I am also curious about the Organic SEO thing.
First. What's an organic SEO?
Someone who optimises webpages ;)
don't know who edited this one but you took the fun out of the post :(
[edited by: chamade at 2:00 am (utc) on May 14, 2003]
If you go back and read chiyo's 3rd section and last section, you'll get the major insight: the best choice is the one that helps the user and gets them the information that they need. If you do that, the user will come back next time. Long-term relationships with users are worth more than short-term gain. If you start with the assumption that Google wants what's best for users, you're 95% of the way to understanding all you need to know about Google.
Anyway, welcome to WebmasterWorld Staza!
Successful establishments in the real world don't turn away 'Browsers' they make their stores attractive and welcoming and even add content such as restaurants and cafes to make the 'Browser' stay awhile and possibly become a 'Buyer'. Goodwill is a tangible factor in the real world and is even bought and sold.
I think some are losing sight of what really matters as they delve deeper into SEO tweaking a word here and a hyphen there.
In a recent post I asked how webmasters would describe their site in relation to the real world. i.e. if it were bricks and mortar what would it be like? Why would it attract people to it and why would they return to it again?
I think if that question can be answered it might supply an insight into long term survival on a web where SEO is overtaken by other factors.
Hey chiyo, with great respect and acknowledgement of the likelihood that you probably know far more than me...
I'm one of those that has voiced concern, especially about -fi...and our sites ARE actually poised to slightly benefit from the -sj/-fi results going global (some up some down)...
Why am I talking about it then? Because I really see spammy results in -fi, worse than in www; and top site dropping for no good reason. We follow numerous categories: *all of the ones we're in; *all of the ones we're thinking about getting into; *and some we'll never go near, to keep some perspective; toys would be one of those - go take a look at THAT one. (Also, without going into detail, I have a vested interest in the quality of Google's results.)
I agreed with almost everything in your excellent post...except the implication that no one in here could actually be bothered by the quality of the SERP's unless their rank fell seriously.
The fact that most of the real world may not see much of a difference in these SERP's, doesn't mean Google should have gone out with them, even in dns rotation. If I work at IBM, I don't cut corners on consumer machines just because I expect that most of the little people won't notice...now THAT is a bad strategy for long term success.
Hmmm, now you've got me to thinking... I hope I'm not the only honest one in here :-) Maybe I should just stick to making wise cracks!
PS, as far as GG goes, perhaps all that Staza was getting at was to wonder aloud how much of GG's comments can be taken at full face value, given that he is, formally or informally, a corporate representative. There, you covered it better than anyone else I had seen. Just MO.
