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The top 5 and 6 positions are all those web sites with www.my-keyword-keyword-keyword.com and because they
have so many keywords in the domain name they rank well because of the number of words used in the page.
The only way around the problem is to have two or three web sites. One with the brand name and a few with keywords in the domain. It seems very unfair that a company who was quicker enough to scoop a good domain name that they rank well.
Can Google make if fair for all those web sites that don't have keywords in the domain and score higher for more content! We have to work twice as hard just to compete!
Point Two:
What bothers me is that if a marketing guy does the smart thing and wants to truly brand his site lets say "Coca-Cola.com" he isn't going to rank very well for the search term "soda." "Lowes.com" cannot compete with "HomeDepot.com" when people search for "goods for the home" and neither can compete with a site named "GoodsForTheHome.com." "GradyWhite" can't compete with a site called "FishingBoats.com" for the typical search.
I guess I'm saying that typical market branding doesn't fit with the Google search.
domain names give you with HIGH degree of probabilty what the site will be about.
granted - it may use spam techniques, but at least you are getting targeted spam.
domain name is only one of ~100 things that google can and does look at.
also - you are looking at survivorship bias as well as shotgun SEO.
If someone is interested in doing agressive SEO - he or she will use:
domain name
hidden links
big text
repeated text
tiny text
alt text
link to google
...
...
just because you see one of these techniques on the page - doesn't mean that it works. someone using all-kinds-of-dashes.tld is likely to use a panoply of techniques that at least some of them will work.
I can't see Google penalizing for just 2 hyphens. Just too many very legit sites with that many. However, beyond that I'd say is getting into the clearly unsafe range.
None of the major search engines use "search engine" in their name or even title and google has no problem figuring them out
[google.com...]
same with books
[google.com...]
auctions
[google.com...]
google in each case has no problem figuring out the best and most popular regardless of domain name
Consumers often search for the name of a company or brand. If I search for "Honda", I'm going to be returned "honda.com", rather than sites about/affiliates of Honda, or worse yet, sites masquearding as that brand.
Consider what would happen if this were NOT the case, you might see a page with the title:
"Considering buying a Honda? Buy a Suzuki instead!"
This would open up a whole new approach to "spamming".
If you don't remember whether that Blue Fuzzy Widgets site you visited last month was bluefuzzywidgets.com or .net, or blue-fuzzy-widgets.info, you type "blue fuzzy widgets" into Google, and expect the site to appear on the first page. Giving more weight to domains that contain the search phrase helps to give these users the expected results.
The question is... does blue-fuzzy-widgets.com have a better chance of being at the top of the SERP, versus bluefuzzywidgets.com? (all things being equal) It seems that the answer is yes.
Top results come from titles, headers, links, off-page factors and maybe content. One competitive area has been dominated for many, many months by a page that sits in 3rd level sub-folder and the entire content says
NEW SITE NOW OPEN!
www.keyword-keyword-keyword.com
Please click the above URL to visit the new blah blah Directory!
This new hyphenated domain site along with with all its topical content, themes, optimistaion etc apparently can't outrank a pseudo doorway/redirect with no content.
I see lots of hyphenated domanin names and they rank relative to the factors mentioned above... not because of the domain name.
As for the "wah wah wah" comment, I consider that a flame. Trust me, I'm not complaining. I believe I do well enough in Google.
Over the past 21 hours my Analog stats show 2000 referrals from Google.com, 1,000 from Yahoo (mostly Yahoogles), a couple hundred from AOL (mostly AOLoogles), about 1,000 from assorted Google IP addresses, about 1,000 from assorted non-US Google domains. So my placement in the index is OK by my small site standards - I don't do this for a living.
I simply am perplexed that while I get plenty of referrals from G and typically rank one or two for the words which make up my domain name, I can't seem to move beyond number 150 for the one keyword which describes my space. Iknow, I know, I sound like a broken record. I've posted this same message in various versions too many times. This should be the last time! But I'm still perplexed about how to get my site up for that one keyword. The best thing I can come up with is starting over with a new domain name using that keyword.
Can anyone confirm or disprove the theory that a site could be degraded in the rankings for a certain keyword or search phrase, due to the Big G algorithm suspecting a page is SPAMming that keyword, while being fine with other phrases?
Now let's also imagine that it is primarily an information-driven subject rather than a product/brand driven subject.
Now let's say that the easiest way to describe the subject is through a two-word expression (e.g. drunk driving, domain names, dog breeding, fruit salads etc.)
So what are the options open to a potential site owner (given that they're not motivated by establishing a "brand"):-
Word1Word2.com
Word1Word2.net
Word1Word2.org
Word1Word2.some_other_tld
Word1-Word2.com
Word1-Word2.net
Word1-Word2.org
Word1-Word2.some_other_tld
It may vary a little depending on the topic, but I would place the "desirability" of the above something like this:-
1+. Word1Word2.com
2. Word1-Word2.com
3. Word1Word2.net or Word1Word2.some_other_tld (if tld matches theme of site e.g. uk travel under .co.uk)
4. Word1Word2.org and Word1-Word2.net
5. Word1-Word2.org and Word1Word2.some_other_tld (where tld is something contrived e.g. .to or .cc)
6- Word1-Word2.some_other_tld
In other words, for countless subjects, there are about a dozen people in total out of tens of thousands or more who are going to be smart/lucky enough to get a domain name that SAYS WHAT THE SITE IS ABOUT. Everyone else is going to have to make do with contrived names, which are never as good.
Even if you're selling products, unless you're a major manufacturer, is it better to have a keyword domain (which tells people instantly what they can expect to find at the site, e.g. WinterCoats.com or Black-Diamonds.net - not my sites just coined examples for this post) or to have something that nobody will associate with a particular product (ACMEsales.com, shinythings.net)? I would say that 99% of the time you'd be better off with the descriptive domain name.
The above holds true for Word1 Word2 Word3 expressions, where "Word1 Word2 Word3" is a phrase, service, product etc. that would be instantly recognizable in that word order to anyone with an interest in that subject.
So while people may use keyword-rich domains to spam, I am certain that many, many, many such domains are also used to build very useful and valuable sites. Not sites run by Fortune 500 companies, but then that's only about 0.00001% of all the sites on the Web!
Yep. If I want to buy a blue widget, and search "blue widgets", the site I'll check first is blue-widgets.com. Sounds like they've got just what I want.
In other words, hyphenated domains are, on the whole, exceedingly undervalued in the domain aftermarket compared to their actual value (if used by a company committed to developing them)
Going back to the winter coats example, wintercoats.com might sell for 10x-25x winter-coats.com whereas a more appropriate multiple might be of the order of 5x.
This will most likely change, but these things take time and meanwhile there are bargains to be had :)
