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webposition and google

Been reading contradictory reports and need independent comments

     
5:11 pm on Apr 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Iíve been reading threads about how Yahoo and google will penalise you for using webpostion gold. Could someone please explain to me if the use of a router to hide the IP address will help?

What about other search engines? Do they also penalise Webposition Gold users?

I am a new comer and came across this site by chance. I hope Iíll be able to contribute to the discussions too.

Sorry if the answer is already on the site, but I couldn't find it. If that's the case, my apologies.

5:21 pm on Apr 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Welcome aboard FredP!

Google states that they don't like WPG and every so often the will take action to block access from those who pummel their servers with rank reports. Use it sparingly and you should be ok.

As far as the other WPG features, haven't used em in ages so can't comment much on those. Remember it is a tool that can help in the learning process. I wouldn't use any page on my site that was autogenerated by WPG if it still does that but you may find the suggestions it give for improving pages helpful.

5:23 pm on Apr 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Hey FredP - here's a good discussion on the issue: [webmasterworld.com...]
5:23 pm on Apr 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Welcome to Webmasterworld FredP!

Actually I've not used webposition, but I know the basic features of that software.

Google don't like webposition because of two reasons.

1. Webposition checks your website's position in Google automatically, and it can do so very aggressively (download lots of pages in a short time). This violates Google's terms and conditions. If you use a proxy router you're still violating the terms.

2. You can create doorway pages with webposition, which will be like a page full of text generated by a computer. Such text is useless for Google's users and those pages will get low ranking in Google.

5:24 pm on Apr 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

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You should not use any sort of automated query software. It is against google's TOS. They will block the IP of the site that is sending all the queries.

Even more important, it is *rude*. Google sends your site all sorts of free traffic, and you start slamming their servers with software that they ask you not to use.

If you use a proxy or a router with NAT to hide your IP, you could end up getting the address of that router banned from doing searches on google. That doesn't sound like a very nice thing to do to the owner of that router and all the other users.

In other words, just don't do it.

Set your preferences to 100 results per page and use [google.com...] to check your results. And if that is still too much work for you, hire a high school kid and have them do it for you.

6:05 pm on Apr 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Surely the number of 'visitors' to your site from searches for keywords is more important and this you can check from log files or visitor tracking.
If you get no visitors for a keyword then you need to do more work.....
Just a thought...
7:08 pm on Apr 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

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If its just straightforward optimisation that youre after then the "page critic" element of WPG does not seem to be a problem.
7:45 pm on Apr 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Thank you Big Fave for the hints.

I'm not trying to be clever, just trying to learn and filter out the bad advices I've been receiving.

I certainly don't want to abuse google, just want to optimise and check my results efficiently. As I said, Iím new and I didnít know about things like [google.com...] How do I set my preferences?

Thank you all again and any more tips and advice for a novice like me would be appreciated.

7:52 pm on Apr 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

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I recently inquired directly to WebPositionGold regarding some of what WG does (especially, the auto-generated ranking reports)...

Google states very clearly in their TOS that they do not want, and will take action against, a bunch of bots coming in to check and collect ranking information.

The representative from WG, who was kind enough to respond to my inquiry, stated (in much flower marketing embedded rhetoric) that WG has taken steps to address this by simulating a regular browser, as close as possible, when querying Google's index...the problem still..is that it is an automated query...and this is what Google doesn't want... 10s of thousands of individuals chewing up their bandwidth multiple times a day...you know what I mean...that old obsessive-compulsive behaivour that is so easily played out here online as any of us humans sit here and work away...we want answers...

Regarding machine-generated pages based on the latest release of WG (which is unlikely to keep pace with algo changes)...personally, I wouldn't touch this...
Better to deploy the good old human touch...called your brain...and get to work...

8:15 pm on Apr 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

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I have a competitor who used or perhaps is still using WPG, and I have not seen his site in Google for 2 years. Not one single page. And he has been listed in ODP and Yahoo directory for over 4 years, so don't say it has something to do with backlinks, because you can find him if you look for links to his site.

"Thanks Webposition Gold, you're the best."

I think I am going to send a copy to all my competitors for Christmas. :)

9:03 pm on Apr 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

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So could someone explain something here please!

What if my competitors use my domain name on Webposition Gold for frequent ranking report and over-submission, etc... Will this mean that my domain name will be penalised and dropped by Google? Or do they somehow protect my domain against such actions?

9:56 pm on Apr 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

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You cannot get a site kicked from Google by using WPG. You get the IP address you use to connect to the internet banned ifyou do too many automated searches, because this is explicitly against the TOS. Or, you use WPG to make spam pages which gets you banned. Many people use WPG who have successful sites, but it's just an unnecessary and inadequate piece of software if you learn your SEO.
11:55 pm on Apr 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

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The new version of Webposition gold has a feature that lets you run reports but at a very slow pace and by using a browser handle to query the server. So it would look just like you were manually doing it.
8:26 am on Apr 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

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can anyone confirm what Kurupt is saying?
10:52 am on Apr 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

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can anyone confirm what Kurupt is saying?

WPG will obviously try everything they can to get around Google's TOS. They'll probably get caught out again eventually. My personal opinion - it is very difficult for Google to do anything about automated queries. You'd have to be doing it on a massive scale for them to take notice and even then what can they really do about it? The decision for me is more to do with wanting to stick by the TOS. The advantage of using programs like WPG is negligable, but if you really want to use it then go ahead.

11:38 am on Apr 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Set the time between searches to 5-10 seconds - do it just MAYBE once a month, do it from a dialup and only do it for a handful of terms... You'll be fine..

But then your better off saving the $349 and doing it manually! :) Thats what I realized. The other features (besides rank checking reporting) are garbage and I wouldnt touch them with a 10 foot poll...