Welcome to WebmasterWorld Guest from 184.108.40.206
Forum Moderators: buckworks
Bright webmasters. I need your opinion:
Is it low memory on my shared Host?
Is it the Un-Zenlink programming of Zen cart?
The Zen report:
Parse Time: 24.593 -
Number of Queries: 2633 -
Query Time: 10.733885148804
The server performance:
Current Memory Usage (k)
total used free
4076300 4043220 33080
It's definitely not the right solution for products with many attributes.
Through more investigation, I have seen that hosting does make a huge difference though. If you want to do a lot of Zenning, get a certified Zen Cart host.
I switched to cubecart 1 week before launch (a risky move!) and had it up and running within a few days. Not as feature rich out of the box, but fast and VERY easy to tweak, not to mention standards compliant out of the box. Was a great move. Cubecart isn't perfect, but I think I made the right choice.
Either it is a ZenCart feature, or a bug caused by your tweaking.
1. Try count queries on an untweaked cert. If this is a feature, do not spend you time on this product.
2. If this is a bug, try to fix it: log all the DB queries and then try to define what is problem source. There can be a buggy loop statement, for example.
Another performance eater might be indexes. Better to say, their absence. Be sure you have an index on every table record that is used in "where" clause (if table has more than 1000 records), or that is used in "on" and "using" join clause (even if table has less than 1000 records). But it does not have anything in common with 3,000 queries.
Hope this helps.
p.s. A host usually do not has problems with performance until there is about "0" of free memeory. I do not think these numbers show memory problems. But 3000 queries pro page definitely are a problem.
Parse Time: 0.280 - Number of Queries: 638 - Query Time: 0.18223529470825
Large Product Listing (83 attributes):
Parse Time: 1.181 - Number of Queries: 3017 - Query Time: 0.88153500108337
Hmmm, I am doing over $200,000 in sales each month with Zen Cart on shared hosting and it flys like a rocket!
I guess I need a new cart too? :)
The high amount of queries is due to product attributes that are added on. Zen cart is highly reliant on database storage and configurations, hence the amount of queries.
I would say it iwould be better to customize my own ecommerce system for this certain application, but I don't have the skills, so Zen Cart is a good band-aid this year.
There have been over 200,000 downloas of Zen Cart. I search "powered by zen cart" on google and get 2,060,000 results. There are nearly 700 stores featured in the Zen Showcase and only about a handful of people have ever complained on the forums that I have seen about speed and it was usually due to the web host.
Mentioning sales figures on a public forum is not only crass, but irrelevant.
3000 queries for one page rendering is horrendous, however you try to spin it.
I get page rendering times of around 0.01 secs with less than 10 queries per page on my custom coded cart.
Page rendering times of >1 sec are hopeless.
Open source carts like ZC and OSC are sublime if you are selling cd's, books, or a basic commodity.
When highly customized (especially with over 10 product attributes), Zen Cart is bearish. This is unanimously agreed.
If you choose to develop with Zen Cart, make sure you are poised to switch hosting to a Zen Cart Certified Host, just a word of warning.
I tried a $35/month host and they were crap when it came to sql query times and it was very slow. I have run it on a $7/month host and it was very quick.
It just hit and miss to find a good one and you know the Zen Certified hosts do the job right and will have quick servers
Well I do not agree with you at all, so how is that unanimouse?
This is the stats of a product with 85 attributes and 67 thumnail images:
Parse Time: 1.181 - Number of Queries: 3017 - Query Time: 0.88153500108337
I can't see how you figure 10 attributes is "bearish" unless you have a poor server or don't know how to set it up properly.
Zen Cart runs about 4 times slower than the average PHP application. Run some tests yourself if you don't believe me. Numbers alone are meaningless.
3017 queries IS too many for one page. anybody that knows anything about programming knows that. The Zen Cart team will even admit it [though they are slow to do anything to fix it].
Check what load that places on the server. How long do you think it can sustain that? What is the performance when there is actually traffic on the server? What performance do you get when there are 100 concurrent connections to the site? what about 1,000?
1. Headroom - This seems to be the most critical feature. Since Zen Cart is bearish, it needs lots of server space to operate. You won't get great results on a massive shared server. Like madmac stated, 3000 queries might be fine if you have a handful of visitors a month, but not for a heavy sever load.
2. Special Zen Cart services - Some of these hosts will install the latest release of Zen Cart for you. Some will add popular community mods. Others will even do customization work for you.
3. Giving back to the community - Some hosts will donate a portion of your hosting bill to the Zen Cart community. This way you know some of your investment is going to the community to make the application better.
You are right, numbers alone are meaningless, 4x slower is meaningless.
If it runs fast and is snappy to load is what counts.
My site is fast and snappy.
I have run cubecart, xcart, and eshox on my server and there is no perceptual difference in the speeds, although I am sure there are several milisecond differences.
[edited by: Peter_Cornstalk at 3:15 am (utc) on Nov. 24, 2005]
I have run it on ipowerweb which has massive shared servers and it runs very quick and is hardly bearish. It is jut hit and miss to get a host of that kind that is configured properly to handle it.
But I don't recommend them since you can get better hosting for around the same price.
"1. Headroom - This seems to be the most critical feature. Since Zen Cart is bearish, it needs lots of server space to operate. You won't get great results on a massive shared server. Like madmac stated, 3000 queries might be fine if you have a handful of visitors a month, but not for a heavy sever load."
I get 1000 to 1500 visitors a day, no problem.
Hi I've not really done much as yet with Ecommerce but I have been looking at ZenCart/osCommerce and wonder what makes a host ZenCart certified. (other than ZenCart authors give it a certificate). Obviously it would be someting to do with server speed - but is there anything else?
this is being address through out the 1.3 series. the developers have promised an 80% or so reduction in queries.
is from a single product with
53 options and almost as many images. the number of queries is high however the speed isnt an issue
[edited by: lorax at 3:28 pm (utc) on Nov. 24, 2005]
[edit reason] Please, no URLs - see TOS and Charter [/edit]
the high number of queries can be knocked down by using indexes, and turning on things like manufacturer box
Zen Cart recommends turning off the manufacturer box. Do you mean to turn it off or on? How do you use indexes to knock down queries?
Any other recommended measures to boost ZC speed besides the Zen Cart recommended methods here [zen-cart.com]?
I have seen Query times spike from 10.00 to .70. That can go to server performance. However, I am using an older installation of Zen Cart. 220.127.116.11 to be exact. How much would an upgrade decrease query times?
having the server setup specifically for zen
In what ways would you setup a Zen Server differently than any other linux/apache/php/mysql server? Do you need to tweak apache or php?