Forum Moderators: buckworks
Order from / Ship to Nigeria
Payment by bank draft
Requested air shipping
Want's the merchandise quickly
What do you think? I never have complete confidence in an order until the money's in my account. Should I proceed with this order and see what happens? What 'flags' should I keep an eye out for?
Would it be possible to talk to the bank from which the draft is to originate? If you try it, make sure you talk to the client first. Tell him it is just your company's policy to perform a preliminary investigation on international orders of this size.
Congrats if it's legit.
Sucks that you didn't get a big order, but I am 100% sure it's fraud. If the money does come in, it's stolen money and it will eventually come back out of your bank account - a month or two after you've shipped the product.
The other possibility is that they just want to get YOUR bank account info so they can withdraw money instead of put it in, so don't even give it out.
But assuming thats not the case, remember it's actually easier to do a fake bank draft payment than a credit card - there is no validation or address verification: the name on the account doesn't even have to match. And as long as the money is in the account you are drafting you will get it, but when the account owner figures out its missing and does a dispute you'll lose it real quick. It would be very easy for someone to get an account number of a company that has enough money, all they need is a check FROM that company and they have everything they need.
[edited by: ogletree at 9:27 pm (utc) on July 15, 2004]
Always.
Without Exception.
And I apologize in advance to any Nigerian members, but 100% of my nigerian orders have been fradulent.
Want's the merchandise quickly
Dead giveaway. The bank draft will take roughly 20-30 days after you've deposited to come out as fradulent.
This is also the first red flag for fraud in every country.
Potential Fraud:
-larger order than average
-needs it yesterday!
-free email address
This situation always triggers taking a second look at an order. No matter which country.
I wouldn't take that order if Alan Greenspan showed up at my house with a suitcase full of hundred dollar bills.
I would! Can I sticky you my mobile number on the offchance that he does show up?
I agree and understand it'll be a cold day in hell if this order was kosher. However I have nothing to lose to pursue it to a point where I have nothing invested.
So I plan to atleast inquire and see what I am fed back. What sort of methods should I employ to reveal if it's a scam? What methods should I require them to take if they want to order from me? What should I research regarding them? What questions should I ask? Such as requiring a 90 day clearance period, different payment method, company profile, etc, etc,etc.
Regards
(1) Require they send you a SIGNED CHECK instead of a bank draft. Then when you receive the check, take it to your bank and have them authenticate it. They can contact the bank based on the routing number (not the phone number on the check because that could be fraud) and/or fax a copy of the check to the bank it was drawn from to make sure everything matches up. That bank can then call their customer, based on their records not the contact info on the check, and verify that the person who owns the account is the legitimate sender. If you tell your bank that you suspect it may be fraudulent they will gladly check it out.
(2) Tell the person that an expedited order is impossible due to the value of the order, but that you will gladly ship their order out immediately once you have verified the authenticity of the check, minus any holds, etc.
I really wish you would pay attention to what everyone is saying on this though, the entire e-mail has all the makings of the typical scams we see from Nigeria. It's a pretty standard practice to authenticate transactions of that size, online or not, and anyone who does that volume of business knows this. If I were to buy $500k worth of a product from a vendor across the STREET I would expect them to verify the check first. Never once has a customer who ordered something from me in the 6 figure range asked for expedited shipping because everyone who does that volume of business knows they have to wait for authentication.
Use your head - if they were really in a rush to receive the items they're talking about, why would they have e-mailed you and asked if it was possible vs. just putting in an order? They obviously have time to wait.
If they are unwilling to provide a check and wait for you to authenticate it before shipping for ANY REASON, don't mess with them. If they respond with anything but "Yes, that will be fine" don't waste any more time on them. Any legit business would be more than willing to meet your requirements.
And if they DO provide a check and it turns out to be fraud, send me a copy of it so I can put it up on the wall in my office next to the other 5 and 6 figure checks from fake Nigerian companies that I kept as a novelty. Not joking :)
[edited by: digitalv at 2:56 am (utc) on July 16, 2004]
As for their 'want it immediately' statement, they're talking about a month not just a few days.
So for nothing more than to get my fraud check for framing, I should require a longer clearance period, have my bank check it out, request a signed check, anything else?
Even if they confirm our suspicions by not complying with my request, I'll still pursue it to get that check! I have a nice place on my wall for it, can't hardly wait!
Hope my competitors have that much time on their hands. Dude, walk away & spend some quality time with real customers...
OR don't touch it ...
I can go as far as receiving and checking out the check without any risk or inconvience to me.
Actually - you'd best not. They will want your bank details before doing the draft - and if you give them your bank details they will woprk rapidly towards getting enough infp for identity theft... or rather for bank theft, of your account.
We do that too. A good business practice.
I received a very humorous response from their 'bank'. Who by the way uses a free email address.
They say they are issuing a bank draft through their coorisponding bank in the Netherlands.
I asked them for complete contact information, so I can call and confirm the transaction with each bank. I expect it'll end real soon...
