Forum Moderators: buckworks
The customer phoned up a week later and asked where the product was. I explained that it had been sent out. However I sent another copy just incase it had got lost (very unlikely). This time I sent it out by recorded delivery.
He has just emailed to ask where it is and is asking for a refund. I get the impression he has simply copied the data and now wants a refund. I have said 'sorry we don't do refunds, we only exchange faulty items', as it says on the website.
So what would you do in this situtation? Luckily he didn't pay by credit card otherwise I would have no option but to refund him. However he paid by cheque so it is different.
Regards,
Tim
I once had a video sent 3 times before I finally got a refund. It turned out that there has just been built a house on a street with a very similar address to mine, in the same area, so some one else had signed for my Ali G. video!
I would check his address. There could be a minor error. You should also call the local post office. You could also post the product again with registered mail.
If you haven't done it yet, update your your Terms and Conditions regarding refunds and posting.
good luck,
Ivana
[edited by: Ivana at 3:20 pm (utc) on Oct. 16, 2003]
explain the situation
they are very useful people to know if you have them on your side, moreover the advice is free
You left yourself open to scams by not sending the item using a trackable method. We all play the odds to save money, assuming buyers are honest. It is also your responsibility to make sure the buyer receives their product. If the buyer is lying, you have no way to verify.
If you feel the buyer is lying, you can sometimes refund the buyer's money as another option.
You'll then.
Recorded Signed for automatically provides you with a receipt to prove that the item has been posted and requires a signature on arrival. It's ideal for sending important documents such as legal papers and job application forms.
Confirming the arrival of an item is quick and easy. You can either use our online Track and Trace facility, or call the enquiry line on..."
(from Royal Mails website)
It is not legal to say that. Trading Standards would really get on your case if you disclosed that to them. They don't exist to protect traders, no matter what anyone says.
Believe it or not, you can't say that you don't do refunds. Sales law is very much in favour of the customer. And they are legally entitled to refunds in several defined situations. Statutory rights and all that. So if you want to say that you don't do refunds you've got to word it very carefully and then also add all that yadda yadda about statutory rights not being affected.
Get a POD (Proof of Delivery) from RM and send it to him. Keep all correspondence.
It was sent recorded delivery, so I can check on the signature to see who signed for it. What I am concerned with is that how easy it is for someone to just rip us off. We never get any complaints from people about the quality of the product.
I hear what you are saying about trading standards etc, but I think it is harsh. One of my hobbies is magic and I have bought many products from magic sites in the past. Magic sites will not offer refunds because you are paying for the secret. Everyone knows this. Our product is similar to this (it's not magic but similar). So we can't have people buying then copying the info and just getting their money back.
Surely the seller has rights aswell!
Thanks for all your input.
In the UK unfortunately it's not a lot.
Customers often use the threat of a small claims court action in the knowledge that most businesses will pay up rather than go through the cost and time of a court case.
You could take a stand on a point of principle if the customer is blatantly trying to rip you off. You can spend several days and a few quid, go down to HIS local court (because that's what you'll have to do), face a judge pre-disposed towards the customer and fight to save giving the £90 refund.
Get used to unfair in business. As a separate example, you agreed to the merchant provider's terms for credit card transactions, didn't you? Have a look at them again!
If it was by credit card then I know I would have no chance.
Tim
Do truly disagree with your statement:
"Trading Standards would really get on your case if you disclosed that to them. They don't exist to protect traders, no matter what anyone says. "
They may not give you the answer you want to hear, but they will give you the "legal" answer. They are a useful body to have on your side. I have had many situations where they have defended our company in tough times. Hard but fair is how i would describe them
Agreed
>> They may not give you the answer you want to hear, but they will give you the "legal" answer
I'm sorry to say the extent of your trust in them is misplaced. I've dealt with various Trading Standards across the country and can guarantee you that on several occasions I've had to explain to Trading Standard officers salient features of Distance Selling Directives and amendments to the SoG Act. Only one of them was ever gracious enough to admit their serious mistakes in writing.
As a businessman if you want unbiased advice then rely only on your own knowledge and judgement. Read the legislation yourself, know it inside out, and get a feel for how it is interpreted by the courts.
If it was by credit card then I know I would have no chance
I realise there are laws to protect the consumer and rightly so. But surely businesses, especially small businesses like mine, should also be protected from potential abuse.
We have to accept the conditions of credit cards otherwise we would have no business on the net. 99% of sales are via credit or debit cards. I still think it is unfair but this is mainly because of the widespread abuse of credit cards. If there was no protection then people would not use them on the net. I guess you could say it is a catch 22 situtation.
i am completely with you on this. We should be protected from the customers as well as vice versa.
But we are not so we have to move on and deal with it. I've had too many sleepless nights worrying about problem customers to let them affect me any more. Just use them to learn from. Dont let the bu**ers grind you down!
I know this sounds obvious but always seek the best legal advice too. No matter how much you think you know on the latest regulations it is hard and not very cost effective to try to be an expert lawyer as well as an expert businessman.
In this day and age this protection is sadly becoming more necessary for every business. The "Me" society is unfortunately eroding common decency. It's very often a case of "what can I get away with?" rather than what is right.
From inflating insurance claims ... to jumping on the bandwagon where an e-tailer has made an obvious pricing mistake of a TV set at £0.99 ... to encouraging visitors to click on Adsense ads - it is everywhere in different shapes and forms. It's amazing how many people often intentionally do little things that end up cheating or exploiting someone, somewhere of something. The sad part is that many of them genuinely believe they did nothing wrong. If the victim is a large company/inland revenue/bank/nasty employer... people somehow see it to be a victimless crime.
All businessmen are also consumers. Let's bear this in mind when we are dealing with other people as their customers.
Sorry for the sermon.......Rev. Macro :-)
Most of our orders are now sent by ordinary post. We have an unofficial 4 weeks no questions-asked resend policy. So far, there has been very little problems from customers who were potentially dishonest. If we do resend, it will be by registered air mail.
Tim
Absolutely, but at some point you will lose out from customers. And you must not let it chew you up too much ... put the energies into future prevention and growth.
I really dont know whats becoming of society.
Christ I could go on forever about this but Ill save you all.
This is based on conversations I've had with Trading Standards, whom I've always found to be very helpful when in dispute with the customer from hell..
it specifically excludes digital media such as software
For the several UK businessmen out there ...the above also excludes a whole load of other stuff including perishables, bespoke goods (eg: built-to-order PCs) and livestock. Check with trading standards but my advice (as you would have guessed from my previous posts :-)) would be to also read up on it yourself or get independent advice.
Then they could not get the CD *and the data* then claim they had not received it.
I'm sure I'll find all the advice I need on these excellent boards.
Cheers,
Tim
Have been making up some plans to deliver updatable hard disk content to people that way for various clients for a while, with updates via the net. Have not actually gotten round to doing it yet but will do someday and if they want it of course sooner :-)
That is a great idea. I never thought of doing that. I was thinking more along the lines of letting them download the whole lot via the web. But your idea sounds really good.
Thanks,
Tim
