Alternative Search Engines - they're listening

[jeremy goodrich]

From another thread, member peewhy said:

I was just thinking about this thread [webmasterworld.com] and about how much impact it could have on these search engines if it was in a worldwide journal.
People reading the results and looking at the various search engines mentioned.
Can you imagine the shifts in their traffic depending on the trends published?

Very brilliant insight, and worthy of discussion. Gigablast, SearchHippo, Kartoo, OpenFind, WiseNut - they've all got people that read here, the authors are here, they take notes. We tell them things, and they listen. *if* you like the idea of more competition = better for everybody in the search engine space, show your support: What would you like to see, implications for the current state of affairs, is there someplace nobody else is going that you would like a search engine to go?

[papamaku]

What I think a lot of people are crying out for here, is another forum (or 2)! with maybe slighly less strict rules and more freedom for smaller SEs to discuss!

Brett, Jeremy et al, what is so hard about making another forum? I'm sure there's plenty of people here who would be happy to moderate

Should we start a campaign for it? :)

[martinibuster]

papamaku, consider this:

An hour ago, cornwall started a thread about an alternative search engine and so far nobody has contributed to that discussion.

If that's the level of participation a new forum will attract, in my opinion, I think it would be a waste of time.

[DaveAtIFG]

So, why does AllTheWeb have a slot and not Inktomi nor Altavista?

Once upon a time Ink and AV did have their own forums. But as Google emerged as the search leader and the dotcom bust forced many SEs into pay-for-play for financial survival, they were grouped into one forum and relagated to a backseat role, as befitted the amount of free traffic they could generate.

As to AllTheWeb, they were the last to include pay-for-play and they introduced it in a style similar to Google's, the ads were clearly delineated as ads and not easily confused with unbiased SERPs. Further, this was done to enhance an adequate revenue stream, not as a desperate act of survival.

Recently, Overture acquired ATW and AV, Yahoo acquired Ink, and MSN is rumored to be spidering. When another leader emerges in the search biz, I'm confident the forums will be rearranged accordingly.

[cornwall]

>>An hour ago, cornwall started a thread about an alternative search engine and so far nobody has contributed to that discussion.<<

Two days later, and we are having an enlightening discussion on Search Hippo on that thread

[webmasterworld.com...]

Kevin Marcus has given us a lot of information on what he is doing and the direction he hopes to go.

But in general I agree with martinibuster's thought that there is not enough interest to have separate forum's on any other search engines. However is is certainly worth my time looking at the "other" players, to see what their ideas are and the direction they are heading.

Bottom line is Google will have to work hard to remain dominant, and anyone not knowing what is happening what other SEs could be vulnerable in the long term

[bobothecat]

I think the biggest problem is censorship... you can barely post anything 'negative' about Google any longer - seems that most of the Google forums must now have 'posts approved' - I wonder why?

I'm with Kartoo4u - Webmasterworld seems to be more interested in pleasing the Google 'gods' more than anything else - again has to make you wonder.

Though I'm sure this post will be removed 'ala Brett' or some Moderator, I just wanted to vent how frustrating it is that making Google sound good, seems to be more important than real 'open' communication/discussion.

I am a 'paid' member and must admit that I regret doing so ( good tax write-off if nothing else ) but, the censorship to please Google should stop. If this Website is truly interested in the 'webmaster', we should allow Kartooguy, Yahooguy and any other search engine guy/gal to be able to post as 'freely' as the mysterous Googleguy.

Lastly... if Google can have multiple forums... I can't imagine that it's asking too much to have 1 or 2 for the 'others'.

Enough of my rant... my apologies to anyone that may be offended. ( assuming this post doesn't get censored as well)... and no, I'm not affiliated with any search engine - just tired of the blatent 'pansiness' towards Google.

I just wanted to add that I have nothing against Google, think it's a great engine ( hopefully I won't get a pr0 for this). :)

[jrobbio]

Marketing Guy:

"There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about." -Oscar Wilde

[cornwall]

>>... if Google can have multiple forums... I can't imagine that it's asking too much to have 1 or 2 for the 'others'.<<

The reality of life is that the chattering classes have a lot to say about Google, and not a lot to say about the others. You cannot give them enough forums to chat about Google...

... on the other hand few are interested in posting about engines that are not delivering browsers to their web sites.

The same situation exists in "Directories" , the vast majority of posts are about DMOZ, usually with a tie in to Goole links. You do not see much interest in JoeAnt, GoGuides, etc.

Its a grim old world out there ;(

[mrdch]

The same situation exists in "Directories" , the vast majority of posts are about DMOZ, usually with a tie in to Goole links. You do not see much interest in JoeAnt, GoGuides, etc.

I have applied the rule 'three strikes and you're out' to my posts in WebmasterWorld. I tried three times to provide what I thought was relevant information about a (then) new directory - and they were all pronptly removed.

I could have replied to all the points raised in drfence of the current TOS - but I don't feel it would make any difference. It seems that the high ranking at Alexa is a solid proof that 'we must be doing something right - so why change'. This is a vanity symptom that, sadly, befalls many succesful companies at their prime, with predictable consequences. The examples are just everywhere.

For me, the irony is that WebmasterWorld gives all the publicity to the big guys (read 'Google') and vigorously denies it from the small ones - yet claims to encourage discussion and help promote competition.

Finally, the real sad thing is that bobothecat was quite sure that his post will be deleted or maimed. So am I. Shouldn't that ring some alarm bells?

MC

[raven]

I have gotten to the point where I only come to this forum once or twice a week to read, although I have been a member for many many months. I no longer attempt to post for fear of having my message either edited or removed. Thus, I only post on other forums where I feel much more at ease. I see it as their loss, not mine :)