Forum Moderators: bakedjake
I didnt go so far as to look at the search engines they are using now, but notice espotting ads on the side now. Anybody else noticed this and are PPC listings being used in their main index now?
I remember reading somewhere of changes to the company that owns it. and maybe financial problems - dont take my word for it.. just a very vague memory.
but notice espotting ads on the side now
Its not just on the side that they have the espotting links
If you wave your mouse over the main mapped entries, you will see a considerable portion are espotting affiliates too.
Craig
what does this mean for the crdibility of Kartoo's map of the web where before you always got a great idea of what websites were related? Seems the whole map thing now is totally useless. Hoepfully someone may buy their technology.
Nothing against commercial sites. Just liked seeing a fairly credible map of relationships before. Now that has gone bye byes.
before you always got a great idea of what websites were related? Seems the whole map thing now is totally useless.
The link map is pretty useless as presented with all the espotting paid links.
However if you use the "plus" and "minus" bottons you can remove the espotters and get back to what you wanted in the first place.
It seems very silly to supply the espotting links, as anyone wanting to use the link information will want to cut them out anyway :(
I can't imagine 'joe surfer' or 'jane surfer' actually using the thing the interface is just a bit too complicated.
Suddenly there are small "sales" type sites sitting on the "top maps" that have very poor exposure in the Web and poor linkage to other sites. You can buy listings, but you can't buy linkages as easily. And to some extent PPC listed sites, are sites that cant get exposure by mainstream link popularity.
BEforehand in Kartoo, there were many commercial sites, but they were there because they did have good link popularity and had enough "related" info to get them in the map. But now espotting or Overture "ads" (I say ads rather than sites), are masqurading in the maps as legitimate sites. They are there because they are in espotting/ov, not through their natural "importance" to the "web map" as a whole.
Commercial sites with their own earned link pop - no problem I agree.
And funding the thing - hm...how are they supposed to make money, if they don't put the ads in the middle...? It's too fun playing with the connections between terms / etc to not use what's in the middle.
If they did put the ads off to the side - I think the CTR would probably be terrible.
Dunno how the people behind it planned on making money - but as long as it's useful, I'll still use it for research.
Though I'd hate to even attempt it with a dial up connection - no way.
If they did put the ads off to the side - I think the CTR would probably be terrible.
The exact mantra of the naysayers a few years back when Google launched AdWords. They were wrong.
Google's strategy team understands one universal marketing law...
Don't compromise the value of your core USP if you want to foster loyalty.
For Google it's main SERP relevance. For Kartoo it's the relevance of their relationship mapping.
Degrading the value of their Unique Selling Proposition to try and make a quick buck is pure folly imo. It shows a lack of long term vision and business savvy.
I'm on dialup and I used to use it as a backup to Google. Guess I'll go and use another meta SE now - one that works.
(Oh yes, and I'll be replacing the link to kartoo with the link to whichever one I choose on the home pages of those computers I run unofficial tech support for as well)
The Overture ads are on the left hand side so they don't intrude on the results in the centre of the page.
I am on dial up (at home) and have no problems with using Kartoo. It is Sunday afternoon here though. :)
The Overture ads are on the left hand side so they don't intrude on the results in the centre of the page.
It's the espotting paid results that are intruding on the results in the center of the page for any commercial keyword searched.
As mentioned above they are displaying a small green dot on all of the paid inclusions in their graphical results.
The default AV search is AV UK. This databases seems to be very poor compared to AV worldwide, with lots of small unknown comemrcial entities in it.
They dont seem to be using Google anymore, though they are using Yahoo.
But as said before, going to the Search engine list (there are around 20 SEs they use) and turning off all those strange SEs that you have never heard of plus AV and leaving just say All the web, Teoma Lycos etc, returns results that look far more useful.
I am international marketing manager at KartOO. Some of your messages were really interesting...but we do not have money problems...so do not speak about things you do not know...thanks for that. Our commercial links will help us to provide better services to you...our customers.
I wish you all the best for this new year.
Well, I'm glad to hear your not having any financial trouble. I don't think anybody was implying that though.
The question anyhow must be allowed what business model Kartoo is based on.
It's a great engine anyhow, very useful for many webmasters.
Our commercial links will help us to provide better services to you...our customers.
petitbelou, welcome to the forum, aways nice to see the "horses mouth" so to speak ;)
Not sure that any (many) of us would necessarily agree with that statement of yours that I quoted above. Perhaps you could expand a little to explain.
In general the beef here is that the espotting results confuse the very laudable results that Kartoo produces, and that they only work when one filters out the espotters.
I am not sure how the commercial links provides a better service, apart from generating revenue, which I appreciate we all need to keep going.
I must admit that i was the one to cast doubt on the financial wherewithal of Kartoo's corporate relationships.
Ive been a naughty person.
However please note that i did have a disclaimer that it was a vague memory, maybe something to do with some French telco, so please consider my rude suggestion withdrawn. It is enough that a senior manager from Kartoo had denied it! But please dont tell me that i dont know what im talking about, when i was quite careful to tell people not to take my word for it!
I am a great supporter of Kartoo, and have participated on many threads on it always in the positive.. and heck im on the slowest of dial ups from a third world country!
That made the latest changes even more painful for me. I just couldnt see how inserting paid ads in your main map could do anything else than render its whole credibility a painful blow, and this was reinforced by the curious maps on some terms, bearing little relationship to what i know of the relationships and exposure of the real players in each keyword area from other meta engines and google and all-the-web alone.
Strangely enough, i checked today again, and the maps seem much more realistic. im not against making revenue and adverts - i do PPC myself - but when it gets in the way of the product itself, you run the risk of killing the reason people go there! One of the many conclusions to the casual user, is that since it seems the product was being devalued, Kartoo was simply using a "milking the dying cow" strategy. Though i see one revenue stream could be the sale of your product to corporates.
If there was a way to make revenue without reducing the massive utility of your mapping, I would be on happy puppy! And if the maps keep getting better, II'd be very happy to sign up for your new site search bar.
Cheers!
I am not sure how the commercial links provides a better service, apart from generating revenue, which I appreciate we all need to keep going.
I believe this was meant to suggest that the revenue from the commercial listings will help them to provide better services, not that the listings themselves are doing so.
