Forum Moderators: martinibuster
Personally, I don't understand the obsession with links. I find this obsession very similar to the super seo practiced by others, where they shake in their boots and ask permission about everything they do, in fear of pissing off Google or Yahoo.
I find this attitude unhealthy. I create my sites for my customers and my company. I don't create sites for Google, Yahoo and MSN.
Back to links. I understand that Google's way of indexing sites is influenced by the number of links a site has. It seems that Pagerank and that Google bar, which I don't even check anymore is what is driving most link requests.
When I say that only <poor quality> sites request links, I mean it. I rarely receive link requests from real sites. I only get requests from directories and sites with no relation whatsoever to my contents. Why would I link to a gardening Web site when I'm about, say cars?
This is what annoys me and why I want to understand why people obsess over links. Apparently, you get better ranking on Google. Ok, but what's the use in being Number One, if you only have crap to offer visitors, once they land on your site? Unless, you want them to click on the Google Ads....
I would really like to understand what drive people who request links. Educate me.
[edited by: martinibuster at 4:11 pm (utc) on Dec. 16, 2004]
[edit reason] politeness [/edit]
The only thing to do is try and get as many links as you can. Granted a lot of the link requests are crappy, most people will take a reciprocal link on my PR4 links page.
There is no other way to start. Most people aren't going to notice your site in position 600 to give you free one way links. Unless you visit a lot of forums or are very active in your industry, no one is going to hear about your site unless it is in the top of google. With that said, a lot of times the number of links is a large factor on getting to the top.
Google created this method, now they're trying to destroy it.
...what's the use in being Number One, if you only have crap to offer visitors
Money. As long as there is money to be made in the natural serps you will continue receiving link exchange requests from poor quality site and irrelevant sites.
The high quality relevant sites will continue to flounder, nowhere to be seen, because they don't have a clue about sending out link exchange requests (according to you, as you aren't receiving them).
That's life, though, isn't it? If you don't put any effort you won't get anywhere, whether in romance, business, or link development.
When I say that only crappy sites request links, I mean it. I rarely receive link requests from real sites. I only get requests from directories and sites with no relation whatsoever to my contents.
Why do you think that is?
Anyhow, that may be YOUR experience, it's not the experience of everyone.
I rarely get link requests from the kind of sites you describe. But I wouldn't link to them if I did get a request either.
As I said in the other thread...
I get few link requests, but the vast majority are right on target, written by the business owner, or at the direction of the business owner. They are usually sites that I would have linked to anyhow, if I had found them before they found me.
They may not be the most elegantly designed sites, they may not rank well, or have much PR. But they are sites that my visitors would find useful.
I don't bother asking for a link back. If they do link back, fine, if not, that's also fine.
Many of the sites I link to are business sites, I wouldn't expect them to link out to hobby sites like mine, or to their competitors, some do, but not all.
I'm linking to help my visitors.
How about simply submitting a new link to search engines?
You are who you know ;)
Is that enough? The answer is YES for less competitive or weird terms but NO for competitive ones. After REAL contents, good on-page opt. and good site structure, you need "LINKS" to back up somewhere on your site to gain maximum exposure.
>>> When I say that only <poor quality> sites request links, I mean it. I rarely receive link requests from real sites. I only get requests from directories and sites with no relation whatsoever to my contents.
Link exchange is like gold mining. There are a lot of dirt and dust that you have to weed out in order to get the real ore if you want to be in this game.
A crappy site is one without links.
The irony is that in the face of all this supposedly fantastic, ultra-intelligent automated ranking, the "old fashioned" Yahoo directory can often yield a cleaner set of sites to a query, whereas given time and ability, organic search can be actively screwed around with.
Meanwhile, Yahoo is left tweaking their organic search ad nauseum.
Because if i get you to put a link on your site (which I won't ask for if its non related) and somebody sees it with the descriptive anchor text, they may be intersted, click on it, and visit my site. Do that a thousand times and if I average 1 targeted visitor from each site every four days, thats 250 targeted visitors per day. Now suppose each one visits 4 pages and my overall epm averages about $30 I am making $30 a day (every day) for those thousand links. Plus I hear it used to help with some major search engines.
It isn't an obsession, it's a reality of survival. When was the last time anyone paid to have a party catered and didn't invite any guests?
Site A has content on a subject. Site B copies this content and modifies it. Now we have 2 sites with on topic content. Which one should be at #1 in google?
Get it? Content is easy to make and anybody could be at #1. There needs to be some other factor to determine which site should be there. Google tried and failed to implement a new algo last November and they had to back track. If you are our getting links you are also promoting your site which means that you(probably)care about the content too and the user is not going to find a site with missing graphics that has not been updated since 1999.
People link to WebmasterWorld because there is a lot of good content here, so that means it must be relevant. So if you think you can build your site on content alone you are making a serious error!
From hdpt00 - I feel there's a lot of anger and that you feel link spamming is the only solution. Some of the things you mentioned like participating in forums and be active in your industry might be better in the longer run, than spamming/begging webmasters for links.
By the way, Google did not create anything. They used link popularity as a measuring tool. It's SEO obsessed Webmasters who screwed up the soup.
Graywolf, non relevant links/business cards, whether in a live pet shop/hair dresser or a Web site while effective for some, are don't necessarily makes your own business very profesional. You won't find a link's page on the New York Time or your local bank. You'll find other types of ads though. I feel that a links' page for some sites, like a hobby spot is dead right. But for other type of small businesses, it looks like the guy is working in his garage. Not many people want to do business with those types.
Neuron - a crappy site is not a site without links, that's a funny one. If the links are of no use to a site, why have them? I would expect a links' page from my local chamber of commerce, but not from my local bank. Not all sites needs links.
To Marcia and Crush, I'm not sure that sites without an active links' strategy are buried deep. If it were true, I'd be buried too. Not to say that there isn't place for improvements.
I think I'll give this linking thing a try, but only with related sites. I'll see if it helps, and if it does, we'll all be happier.
