Giving up

[JorgeV]

Hello, and bye,

I am fed up that in almost every single topic, it ends being filled with conspiracy theories from guys who love playing martyrs, ... this is soon going to look like Twitter...

So I am giving up, so bye to some of you, and screw up to the others ...

[brotherhood of LAN]

Anything in particular bothering you?

Always found your posts welcoming to existing members and new alike, would be a shame that you didn't want to continue contributing.

[not2easy]

Say it ain't so, Jorge. So often you are here to help out. I hope you'll not let a pessimist or six spoil the day.

[iamlost]

Please stay.
You are one of the few bright lights, thoughtful persons, that keep me from leaving.

If you need to vent feel free to PM me... be warned that I may vent back as I do find the general angst and associated ‘why should I change, change is hard’ tone a death of a thousand drips.

Unless I’m part of the problem... in that case please definitely PM me and let’s have a conversation.

[robzilla]

It's gotten worse a bit, hasn't it? Your responses, however, I've always enjoyed reading, and taken seriously. The fact that for every 5 posts you've gotten 2 upvotes is proof of how helpful you've been over the past two years. But I can understand that all that stubborn negativity (and lack of common sense, critical thought, research, etc.) can get to you, as it often does for me as well. Sometimes it's better to surround yourself with positive things, with things that challenge you in a good and healthy way. Although there's still lots of good stuff here, of course, it just gets drowned out sometimes.

You can't help everyone, but you've helped lots, so thanks! Wishing you all the best.

[lucy24]

Just stay away from all SEO-related topics. (And abandon any thread that unexpectedly veers in that direction.) You’ll feel better.

[lammert]

Id. @JorgeV

[blend27]

@JorgeV

Buddy, watch a show called StartUp, now on NetFlix, then comeback and perhaps the over-polite attitude will change, it is a good thing.

....and remember NOTHING Compares to You on this forum or any other. We all learn how to deflect 'flying effs' as we go. Don't burn the bridges is the most important.

[lammert]

This will also be my last post here.

Conspiracy theories on this board have been of all ages. In the past, the moderation team did a great job in steering the discussion, and adding valuable insights from other perspectives. Moderation virtually stopped in the SEO topics some years ago. But a few days ago, a new low has been reached by the owner of this board actively questioning the intentions/capability of the Google search PR team in an SEO thread [webmasterworld.com]. To promote his claims, he promoted the thread to a homepage topic with a subjective subtitle.

If have no problem with the owner of this site engaging in and promoting conspiracy theories, but it crossed a line for me personally. I am leaving, for good.

After thousands of posts here, many to help other members and a period of moderator here in some of the forums, it is time to say farewell.

[yollo03]

What is the conspiracy? Google favoring large companies that spend on ads or something else?

[NickMNS]

What is the conspiracy?

There is no one conspiracy, it is that nearly every conversation on this forum devolves into people making either outright false claims, claims that are based poorly researched facts, or claims that are vague yet incendiary. I must assume that because this is how conversations go in general on the web, people have grown accustomed to it and thus accept it as normal. But it is not normal or nor should it be accepted.

There are only a very few members on this forum that do not engage in these practices, and to loose two of them in one week is a great loss. Moreover it means that there a fewer people to support and lend credibility* to those that try and stand-up for positive and productive discourse. If we conclude that the answer to every thread is some variation on the theme of:

Google favoring large companies

Then there really is no point of discussing any longer. After all, in that case we already know the answer before the conversation has even started.

* I do not mean to say that one group of user is always correct or that we always support each other. To the contrary I have often disagreed with these "supportive" members, but the conversation has always be respectful and generally all involved have gained something from the discussion.

I added a like to @Lammert's point not because I "like" what was written, quite to the contrary, but the concerns that were raised, are valid and need to be addressed.

[robzilla]

@NickMNS, couldn't have said it better.

@lammert, shucks! What I wrote to JorgeV certainly applies to you as well. And I was enjoying your site revival posts. But I share your concerns and disappointment (though I'm not surprised by that incident), and understand your motivations; it's weird to be the sensible one in the middle.

Het ga je goed :-)

[keyplyr]

This will also be my last post here.

[topr8]

@keyplyr

i'm sorry to hear that, i've missed your input here over the last couple of years.

but just fyi ... you have been a massive influence and help to my webdev efforts over the last several years. ... so if you are still reading ... thank you very much.

[coothead]

If members carry on jumping ship then WebmasterWorld
could very well end up like this forum...

http://www.htmlhelpcentral.com [htmlhelpcentral.com]

birdbrain

[tangor]

@JorgeV ... just take a break ... as I have been doing.

Wait for saner times and less politics. The webmaster has to weather these times, which come around on a regular basis.

Also, avoid reading the click bait subjects ... most of the time there's little value...

[lucy24]

WebmasterWorld could very well end up like this forum...

I still have the RMCA forums on my bookmarks toolbar, although there hasn't been a post in years. Ah well.

[Webwork]

It's always a bit sad to witness intelligent and valued contributors announcing that they are taking their leave.

I know the feeling, as in "been there, done that" . . and I'm still hanging out / hanging on.

Sometimes it's helpful to make the declaration - a la "I'm outta here!" - be it an expression of utter / unbearable frustration . . or an attempt to draw attention to an issue or an attempt to inspire or incite action . . or to simply express exhaustion.

Whatever the reason it's sometimes a good idea - healthy - to walk away.

Just remember: the door is always open . . and valued members, a/k/a members who contribute and create value - as y'all have - are ALWAYS welcome back . . at least several times. ;)

So, don't stay away too long . . and here's to hoping that things are going well in your life and that they will continue to do so.

[blend27]

RE:

If members carry on jumping ship then WebmasterWorld
could very well end up like this forum...
[htmlhelpcentral.com...] [htmlhelpcentral.com

Just looked:

» Online Users: 127
0 members and 127 guests
No Members online

.. guess we were there!

[blend27]

@ Webwork: --- ..healthy - to walk away.

So true, so true! and at the end, as an old saying goes: You are who you hang out with..

There has been a lot of negativity on the net in the past few years, mostly what I would assign that to is political noise, not that I am an expert at any, but there it is.

Political comes from policy, policy is how people understand it or try to at least. When in favor, it's a good thing, understanding I mean. and then there is an opposite, AND a third option - cherry on top - when there is no need/inspiration to deal with reality. Reality is the Web, not really really reality but it is what it is.

That all comes and goes in waves, al of it. It is just a matter of time when the proper wave comes roaring in/over!

Like Like.. Chuck Norris never sleeps, He waits!

Blend

[blend27]

@keyplyr --- ?

Yo?

[JS_Harris]

This site has caused me to grind my teeth more than once in the past but you know what? It's helped me more times than I can remember. People come, people go inactive, one day perhaps years later they return, that's the beauty of a community.

You don't need to announce a departure, come, go, share... it's all good.

I'll tell you this much, you won't find a bigger concentration of old battle-proven webmasters who have seen it all than right here. If you're in it for the long run it's good company to keep.

Look at who is responding here, check the date they joined... It's safe to say they've figured out a thing or three along the way.

P.S. If you have a question you can find an answer here. On Twitter once a post is 3 days old you can hide a dead body in it, nobody is going to go read it again.

[zulu_dude]

Sad thread, so many top names I remember from my learning journey.

Agree with JS_Harris, don't make it a "goodbye", make it a "see ya later (maybe!)".

[Dimitri]

I've been considering several times quitting too, for the same reasons as those exposed above, in fact, I sort of did. Then I come once in a while, drop one or two answers, then leave again.

[iamlost]

I expect many of us have left or switched to lurking only to return. I certainly did.

I switched from active to mostly lurking between about 2007 - 2015. I returned to fuller participation for two reasons:
1. engine reached out over a specific post content and the discussion convinced me that certain specifics had changed.
2. Cre8asiteforums was dying (and finally did in 2018) leaving WebmasterWorld as the last, IMO, competent public webdev forum.

I never have trialled the pro membership, perhaps a mistake, as already long a member of several private webdev groups; I liked the public communities, extremely helpful and welcoming, paying forward seemed appropriate.

However, the Google-centric focus to the exclusion of all other aspects of webdev... if it weren’t for a few folks still here I admire, respect and a sense that WebmasterWorld is the last of the great webdev fora that dominated so much for so long... the thought of leaving is, sadly, not a stranger.

Many even most of the people who dominated here back when have died, retired, taken up other pursuits; too many of their replacements haven’t the breadth of interest and competence. Or enthusiasm.

Perhaps I’ve outlived my generation.
Cue Lonesome George.

[lgn1]

I have been here for close to 20 years and I feel the same way. Back in the early days, there was a lively discussion, but now you are lucky to get a few responses. I'm not sure if everybody is to busy running their business, or if membership is down.

What really peeved me off the other day, is that I posted a humorous post about the petition that was circulating to deny Jeff Bezos return to earth here in Foo, and the post was deleted without any acknowledgement (which i always would receive a polite notice in the past for the few times that it happened). I don't know if I offended some snowflake, broke a rule, or if it was a system error.

[Marshall]

Come this September it will be 20 years since I joined WebmasterWorld. A lot has changed in that time. The forum has gone from questions and answers on how to build a better website to, collectively, how to make a buck. Seems most are no longer interested in the true skills of web development and design. More and more people want short cuts, whether your basic plug and play website or tricks on fooling SEOs. I am old school like most long term members here having started building sites when standards were lacking, having to make everything fit an 800x600 screen, accounting for the fact mostly all users were on dial up, and coding by hand. Bluntly, it seems no one wants to do a little research and ask "why is my site slow" when they are using a 3000 pixel square PNG image for a 300 pixel square thumbnail. Couple that with every topic seems to revolve around 'G', WebmasterWorld is not what it once was. That is not to say there are not important topics and great responses, but they are becoming fewer and far between. Frankly, if you are primarily concerned with 'G' then join a 'G' forum. That all said, that is why I lurk more than I contribute any more.

[NickMNS]

Seems most are no longer interested in the true skills of web development and design.

I'm interested in the "true skills of web development and design" but most discussion here regarding dev topics tend to focus on a WAMP stack paradigm, which is not my thing.

There is basically no discussion about React or Vue or Angular (there was on brief thread a few month ago), very little discussion about Python (Flask/Django/Bottle and all the subsequent Async variants), nothing on Node.js, no discussion about MongoDB. There has been a few mentions of Redis, but no real discussions. There was one thread about websockets a few month ago, with maybe 3 posts. No Rust, No Golang etc...

On the other hand you can head over to Reddit and find communities for all these different languages, you can go to youtube to watch tutorials and you can go Stack Exchange for answers to specific questions, none of these existed 20 years ago.

[tangor]

the post was deleted without any acknowledgement (which i always would receive a polite notice in the past for the few times that it happened). I don't know if I offended some snowflake, broke a rule, or if it was a system error.

Heh, thought I was the only one. :)

All in all, WW is still gold, and a better standard than other forums.

@NickMNS ... if you want to chat different languages, etc, lead the way. I might not delve in those, but I do like to read about how others are doing things. Who knows, might stir me to investigate.

[edited by: tangor at 10:54 am (utc) on Jun 23, 2021]

[Dimitri]

Seems most are no longer interested in the true skills of web development and design.

To me, it looks like, today, most of "web devs", are just "web plug-n-players". They install wordpress, select plugins and themes, Google Analytics, Google Adsense, and that's all. Then, when things are not successful as they wish, they come to ask which other plugins they can install, or button to press, to achieve better ranking.