Paying moderators

Under consideration

[trillianjedi]

But I have no idea of what to offer, having never paid them before nor ever been paid as one before.

Any thoughts on what paid mods should be paid?

Can you gauge this based on the amount of work they do and work it back into an hourly rate?

Or is it more of a "gesture" - £50 a month type thing?

TJ

[pleeker]

If you have mods that are currently volunteering -- doing it because they want to, not because they expect any financial benefit -- then I'd say a small "gesture"-type payment would be appropriate. And I'd keep it small. Why? Not to keep your own pockets lined, but because when you start paying people, especially if it's a useful sum of money, they inherently start to view what they're doing as "work" instead of "fun". It becomes a job, and that's when you risk losing valuable people. Keep it small so that money never becomes a reason mods come, stay, or go.

[trillianjedi]

Thanks Pleeker - that's useful insight - I hadn't considered the possibility that psychologically it becomes "work".

They're not being paid currently. They deserve something.

Would you consider a gesture of something between £25 and £50 a month too low to be worth bothering with? The converse to your thoughts is that you make it too low and it's considered taking the p***!

How about if instead I put aside, say £25-50 a month, and buy them a gift (or vouchers), unannounced, once a year or something?

Or do you think people would prefer the cash, even if it's only a nominal sum?

TJ

[The Contractor]

why not just make it random instead of monthly? Otherwise you still fall into the same trap..."hey, did you get your £25 this month?"

I would send certificates randomly at varying amounts..

[pleeker]

I can only speak from personal experience, which may or may not work for you and your site....but hopefully it helps, so here ya go:

My main hobby site is about a rock band. It's been online for almost 10 years and we've grown into one of the (maybe THE) pre-eminent sources of information about this band. There are now more than 30 fans worldwide volunteering to work on various aspects of the site. (None are forum mods aside from me....)

I don't pay these folks. Couldn't if I wanted to, really. But we do accept PayPal donations and get very small revenue from Amazon links and such. I use that money to "pay" the gang by buying them things like "staff" t-shirts or sweatshirts, or sending them Amazon (or CDNOW back in the day!) gift certificates. And when they incur expenses related to their work on the site, I try to help defray those costs.

Since there's no salary, everyone knows they are free to un-volunteer if more important things come along that require their time and attention. And everyone appreciates the gifts/gestures that we are able to share.

This works for me. If your site is a more commercial venture and you have enough revenue to hire a paid staff, it might be worth it to do so..... but I'm a fan of having dedicated volunteers and thanking them with appropriate gestures when possible. It seems like a better way of saying "thanks" than giving them a paycheck, y'know?

[digitalv]

Set up an AdSense account and pay your mods based on how much revenue the site generates. Set a cap on it of course, but that would be a cheap way to get some mods :)

[Goober]

Pleeker has a great idea. I think some kind of recognition: shirt with a funny saying related to the site, or to the job they do is a great way to start. Not too costly, but let's them know they are appreciated. Anyone can give money, what do you really like about them (mods) that you can capture on cloth? Time that you put into something is worth more than cash. You know, what hobby do they have?

Goober

<tried to make it cogent>

[pleeker]

Not too costly, but let's them know they are appreciated. Anyone can give money, what do you really like about them

Yes, and it also becomes a matter of pride because they feel part of a successful team and can wear the shirts proudly to concerts and similar events and get recognized. For me, it boils down to wanting the volunteers to have a sense of ownership in the site. I don't think a regular paycheck (if it were possible for me) would do that.

[trillianjedi]

For me, it boils down to wanting the volunteers to have a sense of ownership in the site.

Yes, you've nailed it Pleeker. I think our respective sites are probably similar in terms of overall vibe (different theme).

would be a cheap way to get some mods :)

I don't want anymore mods, I just feel the mods that are there (who create content of unbelievable quality and probably therefore represent 50% of the sites value) deserve some recognition.

Many thanks for the help everybody, I think I'll go with the t-shirts/CD vouchers idea and keep the gift "interval" random.

TJ

[rogerd]

I think that's a good approach, TJ. You really can't compensate a good mod for the hours put in, particularly when a mod may pop in many times during the day, for example. Keep them volunteers, publicly extol their generous contributions of time and content, and toss random benefits their way to show that you are more than just talk.

[trillianjedi]

You really can't compensate a good mod for the hours put in...

That's very true - if I did compensate them for what I feel their true "value" really is, I'd end up with nothing left ;-)

toss random benefits their way to show that you are more than just talk.

We already do that to an extent. The site is about widgets and the manufacturers of widgets send us their wares for review (which the mods do in general). A lot of the time the larger manufacturers (the big name brands) say to me "don't bother to send it back" so we let the reviewers keep them. We had to be a little careful about that and make it absolutely clear to these people that, although it's appreciated, it won't affect the outcome of the review. If we think it's a rubbish widget, the public get told it's a rubbish widget. So far, we haven't had any problems with that.

It's a benefit of sorts, but the main point is, and this is the way that I personally feel about it anyway, it's not something that's come from *me*.

So I'd like to top it up with something else, but it is a gesture of thanks, and not a move towards any kind of salaried "job".

What I think has focused my mind in this thread is that the idea of giving people "cash" is a step too far in the direction of "salary" and/or "job".

TJ

[rogerd]

Site-related stuff makes nice rewards (up to a point, anyway). Rather than doing cheesy silkscreen t-shirts, for one site I just had nice quality, brand-name polo shirts made up. Very professional looking.

If your budget is tight, find a local embroidery firm who will put your logo on items you bring in. ($5 per item is a typical rate where I am, once the logo is computerized.) Pick up shirts, hats, etc. at your local warehouse club or department store - I just bought some decent golf shirts for $6 in an end-of-summer sale. (No idea if such bargains are available across the pond, TJ.)

You can only do so much logo stuff before the appeal wears thin, but it's great for mods to have a few items that they will use or wear in public. It's a conversation-starter for them, and marketing for you.

[vkaryl]

tj, the one other thing you need to consider in depth is whether paying your mods effectively grants them "employee" status. I think you're UK based so laws will be quite variable compared to the US. But here, you just DO NOT WANT to go there....

Here, if this were me, I'd be digging around for some way to reward them without working their putative employment status into the equation; or trying to figure out how to show them as "sub-contractors" for tax purposes....

[Edit: one of the big problems here (meaning in my particular state - and it's the only one I really have info on) is that "payment in kind" opens up the same can o' worms that "real money" does as far as the employed-or-not status.... and all it takes is for the State Tax Commission to get one tiny little taste of a "maybe" employee for them to dog you the rest of your days....]

[trillianjedi]

vkaryl,

Thanks for the heads-up, but it's ok, I'm a lawyer ;-)

The employment (or not) issue I can deal with.

TJ

[vkaryl]

tj - that's good! I think only attorneys are "safe" any more... *laughing*

[rogerd]

TJ, one of the challenges of paying mods is the odd hours they may keep. I know some mods who log many hours each day. Others may peek in. I know that I have notifications of activity (new posts, technical problems, etc.) on various forums. I may be working on one project, get an alert, check it out and perhaps take some action, and then go back to what I was doing. If I monitor a forum for 8 hours but only spend fifteen minutes actually posting, editing, etc., what goes on my "time sheet"?

One solution is a flat fee of some type; then, of course, you get into unequal mod performance - is the fee for a mod who puts a lot of effort into posting, stimulating discussion, etc. the same as for one who does the bare minimum? Then, of course, you could run into employee-type issues, minimum wage problems, etc.

It would seem like the only way to really make paid moderation work is to have mods who really devote their full effort to moderation during working hours. Clearly, a mod who works continuously for eight hours could handle the load of multiple volunteer mods. If you adopted this model and had sufficient staff to cover the 24 hour day, it might work.

[musicales]

For my part I've run a community site and we recently decided to pay mods £50 a year. As suggested earler, this a joke in terms of the amount of time they actually spend on the site, but without exception all were absolutely delighted to receive something they saw as 'getting paid for something I enjoy'.

[trillianjedi]

Clearly, a mod who works continuously for eight hours could handle the load of multiple volunteer mods. If you adopted this model and had sufficient staff to cover the 24 hour day, it might work.

That would work for the moderation side Roger, but the mods do more than that. They create great content for me. I'd prefer for that reason to have lots of mods each doing a little bit, than one or two doing all the work.

It covers a wider breadth of subject matter (and opinion).

TJ

[rogerd]

It's VERY difficult to match the results of a great volunteer mod with a paid individual you recruit for the job. Your job specification would really be more like a "content writer with moderation duties - must have strong industry knowledge, plus excellent writing ability and people skills." Not impossible to find, but not trivial and perhaps not cheap.

[trillianjedi]

Not impossible to find, but not trivial and perhaps not cheap.

Yes and it's a possibility. But I think I prefer the idea of lots of little ones rather than one big one.

It's about breadth - that encompasses varying opinion as well as writing style etc.

Changing current format (or even starting a new site on this philosophy) I think could end up creating something a little "flat".

Bear in mind I only create community sites. So I guess in part this is just what I'm used to (lots of people creating content).

TJ

[rogerd]

TJ, have you had any forums where you just couldn't find volunteer mods?

[trillianjedi]

TJ, have you had any forums where you just couldn't find volunteer mods?

Nope, never.

Is that lucky?

TJ

[rogerd]

Is that lucky?

Maybe it's not luck. Upon reflection, the need for outside moderation implies that the forum has already achieved some measure of success and a moderately high volume of posting. In any large group of people enthusiastic about a topic, I suppose it's likely that one or more might be moderator material.

I'm sure there are exceptions, like forums attached to for-profit sites that are mainly for support, etc., but your experience probably isn't unusual for most other forums.

[trillianjedi]

In any large group of people enthusiastic about a topic, I suppose it's likely that one or more might be moderator material.

Yes, we have a large number of people who are moderator material. I think that's partly luck and partly the subject matter of the website (specialist area).

[grelmar]

My two bits (and no, you don't have to pay interest on them ;)

On one forum where I'm a moderator, we have an excelent compensation package. As follows:

Random Free LogoWear: The site's owner sends out a t-shirt or basebal cap, maybe a mousepad or something, on a pretty much random basis. Take it from the guy on the receiveing end, it's much appreciated. There are a few mods, and we started doing it because it's a topic we're interested in, and enjoy participating in. Getting the odd "perk" randomly in the mail can really make your day.

Links to our sites from a high PR site: This particular forum is attached to a site with PR 8. For being an active moderator, we get a nice front page text link (descriptive) back to our sites. Also, from time to time, a subject comes up on the forum that begs for a "mammoth post" - You know, one of those great posts where you go into great detail on a given subject, essentially an essay. It invariably falls to the mods to write the essays. If you do, and it's truly informative, then the essay gets both "stickied" on the forum (with our signature at the bottom, including a link to our own site, natch), but also gets encoded as a static HTML page in the help/information section of the main site, with our siggy and good linkage back to our own sites included.

That second perk is pure gold. Prominent linkage from a PR8 site back to my wimpy hobby site... I literally couldn't afford advertising that good.