When to say you know it...

[davis]

Hey peoples...

Okay, I'm currently a student for new media, and im curious to when you think its apporpriate to say you _know_ something.

So... when do you really _know_ something. At what level of knowing a program, or a programming language, is it appropriate for me to say I know it. (yeah, I'm getting confusing =)

I'm finding far to many people out saying they're experienced in a lot of programs, but when you look at their actual work, its not very good.

What do you think? Opinions? Comments? Rants? Raves?

-Davis

[BlobFisk]

There's always something new to learn about a technology/language.

There will always be people who say that they are proficient in a technology and are really just chancing their arm. The best way to say that you know something is to prove it. Demonstrate that you have gained proficiency and put it to practical use.

If you think that you know JavaScript for example, you should be able to write functions with ease (syntax, structure, conditionals etc.) and understand the basic principles of the language.

It is a difficult one to quantify - but you really do know yourself if you know something.

[Brett_Tabke]

>The best way to say that you know something is to prove it.

case closed. ;-)

[Marketing Guy]

You can use_something when you know enough to either complete a task or quickly learn how to (without having to learn fundamental concepts).

Ie, I can use HTML, although offhand I cant recall xxx tag. I could quickly find how to use xxx tag though and apply it to a task.

You know_something when 90% of the time you donīt need to look up references to complete a task.

Ie, I know HTML, therefore I can complete a task without referencing to other sources.

Scott

[Mardi_Gras]

I think once you're not interested in claiming that you know it...:)

[txbakers]

There are many different levels of "knowing" something.

You can know about a topic.
You can know some of the terminology of the topic.
You can know some of the techniques of the topic.
You can know how to work through problems in a topic with help.
You can work through problems without help.
And finally,
You really know the topic.

Whether programming or plumbing it's the same.

When I studied to be an orchestra conductor, my teacher used to chide us for not knowing every detail about a score. His response was "Either you know it, or you don't." And if you don't, you have no business being there.

However, step 5 above is usually sufficient to be a professional. Even a top professional will run into situations where he needs help from time to time - whether from a reference book or a colleague. The world is way to diverse to fully know everything about every topic.

And as thinking humans, we are continually developing new ways to do things, so the learning never ends. I like that.

[tbear]

Quote from Ouspensky:
"I hear, I remember,. I see, I understand. I do, I know!"

[rfontaine]

The more I know, the less I understand....

The thing is, unless you know you don't know then you don't know you don't know. Get it?

Its like the old hand-coding vs wysiwyg editor arguments. Unless you know how to hand code as an expert you may not believe hand coders when they say that not relying upon FrontPage or DreamWeaver opens up possibilities.

Many a point and click website maker will say they "Know" HTML when in fact they could not create even simple nested tables in a text editor.

[TheWhippinpost]

Good question.

It was Aristotle or Plato that said, 'I know Everything because I know Nothing'.

I personally don't believe you can say 'I know x', you can say, 'I can do x', which is a different thing I believe.

...bit like saying, 'I don't know how to build a house, but I could do it (E&OE)'.

[edited by: TheWhippinpost at 9:32 pm (utc) on May 27, 2003]

[RainMaker]

I agree totally with Wippinpost. I have read some philosohy in the past and I don't know which one it was but it was one of the socratic philosophies. I don't know if it was his students or what like plato, but I do remeber that knowing everything or having a sense of knowing, is knowing nothing. I will be the first to tell someone that I know nothing. In a programmers sense there are alot of people out there that have been writing forloops all their life and that is all and they say that they are experienced etc. I think we all know something a little more each day, and there is someone out there that will ALWAYS show us up. There will be someone out there that will always know something that we don't and it will seem like we know nothing. That isn't my point. If you can admit to not knowing then you are willing to accept what you can know and about to acquire. Willing to learn what others know with the right kind of pride is a good process of knowing. These forums are a perfect example. We are all willing to admit that we have faults and have a sense of 'not knowing' when we may consider ourselves as experienced users. To be part of this forum or any admits that you have things that you don't know. I think that this is the first step to being looked up to, in a sense. All in all, DO NOT go around thinking that you are the best in something because you are not. Coding has it's versatilities and so you must have versatilites also with people and how you project yourself. I hope that I have helped....just a little.