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adsense block stays in place

its like a frame... but not.

     

nippi

11:01 pm on Apr 21, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



I've seen a site recently that uses a 3 column design. The 3rd column contains only a 160 x 600 skyscraper AdSense block.

They could have just used a frame on the right hand side of the design for this block, but instead, are using JavaScript to make the right hand column work much like a frame... the AdSense block stays in the same position when the site visitor scrolls down.

It does not cover anything the user may wish to click on, as the right hand column is otherwise empty....

I've asked Google, they have replied with a form response... referring to floating AdSense. Well... this is not the same. This is not a popup that floats down the screen covering text and links; it’s a JavaScript alternative to a frame navigation.

Anyone got experience with this?

Bddmed

11:44 pm on Apr 21, 2007 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



You may want to read this on the Adsense blog:

As you may know, our program policies strictly prohibit altering the layout, behavior, targeting, or delivery of Google ads or AdSense for search boxes for any reason. Some examples of these modifications include:

- Implementing the AdSense ad code in a "floating box script"
- Manipulating the ad targeting using hidden keywords or IFRAMEs

[adsense.blogspot.com...]

nippi

4:23 am on Apr 22, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Bddmed

This does't help me. I am thinking the floating javacript refers to floating it down, over the content, as opposed to simply keeping to static on the page as if in a frame.

I can get virtually the same effect with frames(but don;t wish to use them).

Many sites forgo using frames, by using javascript to keep their navigation visible as the user scrolls, and i don;t think this is what is referred to by the term "floating javascript box"

jomaxx

4:33 am on Apr 22, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member jomaxx is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



Ths is actually a grey area. I've heard of this being turned down, I was later surprised to find that Google had approved this kind of implementation on a different site. Two suggestions:

1. Don't do it without Google's express approval, and save the email.

2. Do a cross-browser and cross-system check to make sure the script works correctly in a wide range of environments. I do this exact thing on one of my sites (although not involving AdSense), and all the different scripts I could find that accomplish this have certain drawbacks.

nippi

7:00 am on Apr 22, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



jomaxx

Agreed on express approal, it appears however, Google are not yet ready to expressly approve, or disapprove, as i've sent them an exact example, and got a form letter response, no reference to the example sent.

Personally, I see no reason for it not to be fine. The block acts in every way like a frame... there is no obvious floating effect, but clarification one way or the other would be great.

ann

10:38 am on Apr 22, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member ann is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



<<<As you may know, our program policies strictly prohibit altering the layout, behavior, targeting, or delivery of Google ads or AdSense for search boxes for any reason.<<

Excuse me? But what part of the sentence above do you not understand? Only a couple of examples were given to clarify.

Ann

jomaxx

4:56 pm on Apr 22, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member jomaxx is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



Well I do recall at least one case where approval was given. This would be quite a while ago, maybe a year or more.

It may even make a difference whether the frame is horizontal or vertical. A horizontal frame would, technically, be covering up site content. A vertical frame, as described here, would only be displayed over top of blank space. Seems like that would draw less "undue attention" to the ad and would be unlikely to generate accidental clicks.

ann

7:22 pm on Apr 22, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member ann is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



It's not that Google is covering other things but rather that Google ads themselves are not obscured. key here is Altering Behaviour.


Ann

nippi

10:37 pm on Apr 22, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Ann

<<<As you may know, our program policies strictly prohibit altering the layout, behavior, targeting, or delivery of Google ads or AdSense for search boxes for any reason.<<

I have not altered layout, behavior, targeting or delivery, I’ve mimicked a frame, using JavaScript.

Its far from ground breaking, thousands of sites use a static left/right block using JavaScript to keep their navigation on the page, and do it to avoid all the problems frames bring. My JavaScript frame does not ”float” is is statically positioned… though with a low browser refresh rate you can see a flickering at the edges if you scroll down quickly. If you click down, you see no movement at all. At no time, is ANYTHING obscured by the navigation staying in the same place.

If it were a clear black or white situation, I would expect Google to have expressly responded with the adivice that what I was doing was wrong. They have not, and have responded with a form letter, I am awaiting clarification on my usage, now 5 days with no further response as yet.

I remember getting the same style of vague response when questioning the combined use of adsense with Kontera/Intellitext Google finally changed their terms and conditions for use of adsense to specifically allow their combined usage.

I don't agree that its as clear as you make out Ann.

ann

11:26 pm on Apr 22, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member ann is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



your option. see you around the banned threads.
ta-ta

starchild

12:31 am on Apr 23, 2007 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



I agree with nippi, 100%. I think you are being a tad harsh Ann.

What is the difference between leaving the AS block in a static place, whether or not you use js or a frame?

It is certainly not obstructing code or text ... and can not be seriously be compared with "floating" ads of the type that the recent email from Google has referred to.

The "impact of the ad" (read into that further if you will) is nothing like what is trying to be prevented, as those are certainly outside the TOS.

My 2.4 cents.

nippi

2:40 am on Apr 23, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Ann

A google tech has now replied saying

"I've had a quick look at the implementation you sent me, and I do feel that it may violate our policy regarding modified ad behavior. "

Hardly definitive

I have responded with another email, asking for a clear decision, and have been advised the issue has now been sent up the chain, to someone more senior.

Will keep the board posted.

ann

7:59 am on Apr 23, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member ann is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



I would say it is about as clear as Google ever gets....do it at your own risk.

Ann

nippi

9:10 am on Apr 23, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Sigh

Ann

A low level google adsense tech support person has advised me they are sending the enquiry to a higher level support person, and that I will get a more definitive answer shortly than

“I do feel that it may violate our policy”

So I don't understand your statement

“ it is about as clear as Google ever gets....”

Do you mean you expect Google will not do as they have said, and clarify on this issue, when they've stated in writing to me that's exactly what they are going to do?

What is your basis for this position?

Does google rarely respond to your enquiries?

ann

9:12 am on Apr 23, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member ann is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



Certainly be happy if they did. Post here if you get a definitive answer.

Ann

ronin

9:31 am on Apr 23, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Even if it were allowed, how would such a setup reduce rather than exacerbate "banner blindness"?

jomaxx

6:24 pm on Apr 23, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member jomaxx is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



The idea is simply to keep the ads viewable at all times as the user scrolls down the page. But that's an excellent point, it could backfire by being even easier to mentally filter out than a conventional ad block.

nippi

1:44 am on Apr 24, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Well, its good news and bad news

good news is Google has advised the keeping the ad static using Javscript to mimick a frame is ok

bad news is is... it must do exactly that.

Any visibly noticeable movement of the adsense block, would be construed as having interfered with the natural behavior of the ad, drawing unnatural attention to it so is not permitted.

So the problem is now a technical one. I do not have a cross browser solution that allows me to keep the AdSense visible, without some minimal appearance of movement.

I have an IE version of that works, but of course, solution must be cross browser compatible.

Have handed it over to the programmers but initial report is, it may be impossible

Anyone seen a cross browser solution to keeping a div statically positioned… that does not jump slightly as the user scrolls down?

ann

3:10 pm on Apr 24, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member ann is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



You are just too busy looking for loop holes and work arounds. Oh well, penny wise and dollar folish...

What is wrong with going along with the terms of service. That's what you signed up for and really, do you think a few little "tricks" on the page is going to fill your 'bucket'.

SuzyUK

3:24 pm on Apr 24, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member suzyuk is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



using CSS
position: fixed;
should do it, IE doesn't support this properly and requires a javascript solution which it sounds like you already have!

jomaxx

3:30 pm on Apr 24, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member jomaxx is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



Stickymail sent.

Leonard0

5:29 pm on Apr 24, 2007 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member



Thanks for starting this thread. I've always assumed that static ads were against the TOS since I've never seen one on any site.
I think that will be difficult to avoid the skipping effect on an old computer but it will probably look OK on newer models.
If it works be sure to let us know how it affects your CTR.

ann

6:25 pm on Apr 24, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member ann is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



While everyone is lining up to be a Google hasbeen I am outta here...Let the blind lead the blind!

Ann

nippi

10:40 pm on Apr 24, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Thankyou Ann, I have my guide dog and cane, bless you.

ann

3:42 am on Apr 25, 2007 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member ann is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



Right back atcha big guy! :)
 

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