Google September 2019 Core Update

[MayankParmar]

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System: The following 22 messages were cut out of thread at: https://www.webmasterworld.com/google/4962430.htm [webmasterworld.com] by brett_tabke - 9:39 am on Sep 24, 2019 (cst -5)

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Holy #*$!, official core update will be rolling out later today!

[twitter.com...]

[zeus]

Well I would never ban such thing, freedom of speech. Then you could also ban chemo where the side effects is HUGE. Well thats another topic, I do understand what Robert means. I would also never start a new site about Health or a ecommerce site, if Google dont get some competition.

[whoa182]

Yes, the serps are related to this disease but the users were searching for a forum and not for an article and NOT for a website with a hotline.

This is just one of many things that have been very annoying over the past year. If you try to look for discussion on health topics and add on "forum" at the end, it's often the case that no forum results show up at all, you just get sites like Healthline.

This is a clear example that Google is ignoring you and hand-holding, trying to be guardian, protector.

It almost feels like my hands are tied and I can't reach for the things I want anymore. I've wondered to myself if this is just my own perception because I'm aware of what happened, or if regular people who don't know SEO and not involved in building websites notice the same thing.

[zeus]

Well I do see more and more websites, have a little pop up or a little box on there site where it says we support duck.com and ecosia.org as search engine. on all our site we also do that and dont use any google related tools on our site for user Privacy. I feel I can not talk about I want competition if I dont do anything for it myself. As said I have seen that on a few sites now.

[browndog]

I just tried another search with Google, looking for my own article because I need some information. I used to rank no. 1. It is a very specific search for a particular anatomical part, but G returned a general anatomy result, which is not what I was looking for, especially when I was so specific in my search. They did show my image in the answer box alongside the irrelevant article.

DDG managed to give me the result I was looking for, even if it hadn't been for my site (which it was), I still would have found the information I was looking for.

This is beyond frustrating that G will no longer provide relevant results the searcher is asking for.

[zeus]

well it will not be possible to deliver good results anymore if you censor specific content in a few categories. That will impact the general results.

[Jori]

We are not average searchers.
Google is a search engine for average Joe.

Think about it.

[TeresaD]

I am a day or 2 behind some of you but human hits are up, sales are down, this time last year I was in the middle of the site update so only 45 - 80 hits a day with 1-3 sales, now 300 hits a day with none to 2 sales.

My ppc €2 a day with max 0.08c is interesting I have had 4 conversions in 7 days and 2 phone calls leading to off site conversions and noticed that a cpc click in analytics look at my about page then shipping both in a different window from shopping, that is followed by an email facebook or live chat message.

Is this a user version of E.A.T without them knowing the SEO terms or are searchers now verifying sites are legit before they buy, I am now getting phone calls instead of emails to check where I am based and general chit chat to check me out which is new behaviour.

[Robert Charlton]

zeus, it looks to me, from a chart in the site whose articles you want us to see, that what almost all of the med sites that lost traffic since the "medic" update have in common is bad SEO.

They appear to have used third party metrics, which had been calibrated to correlate with high ranking sites that used out-of-date, spammy techniques to achieve rankings. Commentary on the chart by the owner of the publishing site shows a complete misunderstand of what's being shown.

The ecommerce aspects of the sites may also raise some questions about conflict of interest.

I see all that as a separate thread, about the aftermath of "medic", which may or may not relate to the current update. These topics, and discussion about censorship and free speech would certainly overwhelm the current topic.

Our mod squad will look into linking to key articles in a separate thread about the aftermath of medic.

Not that we will never allow a "search" to get around our linking guidelines, and I should add that the mindset behind that thought is what, IMO, gets many members in trouble with Google in the first place.

Right now, though, this volunteer mod is trying to get out to take a walk while it's still sunny outside, and I then need to shop for some fresh produce. Both of these should be recommended by medical experts of any stripe.

[grainofsand]

I've switched to duck, and will start recommending it to others. In my field of expertise I can clearly see the results returned are better than G. I also did some medical searches recently and was pleasantly surprised by the results (seeing alternative view points early, which I want to know about).

Google's days of total search domination are numbered, that's for certain. 10 years from now their dominance will be gone, and 20 years from now search will be a completely different experience than it is today. They're being crushed by their own greed and hubris. Of course their execs don't care, by that time they'll have cashed out. 10 years ago Google and it's "do no evil" mantra was being worshiped by most. I think that facade is gone, and although the average joe may never clue in, people in tech will eventually.

Internet search is a vital component of life and that will only increase in the future. Humanity needs an unbiased and transparent interface to the world's information. This is actually something that AI can accomplish in our lifetime (compared to the many other fantasy notions of AI that ain't happening anytime soon). Once the AI gets there, it will become cheap enough that even small players can participate. I bet governments, NGOs, and many private variants will emerge.

[mosxu]

@TeresaD

0.08 c per click bid may be the reason. When running ads and sales disappear most webmasters put the bids up cause they think competitors outbid them. But no the problem is the traffic.

[browndog]

I really like DDG, I even changed my phone over to it today...not as a protest against G, but because I genuinely like it.

I do agree with grainofsand that ultimately, G will push visitors away, but it may take some time. I do understand why they are doing what they are doing, trying to stamp out dodgy medical advice, apple cider vinegar to treat pretty much everything, antivaccers etc., but they've gone too far.

As for my site, I dropped significantly, had a rebound, and have dropped again. But I do think these core updates can take several days to settle. I'm not going to hold my breath, only time will tell.

[shakiramarkk]

I have to read you services briefly that is more informative for me. This would helped me a lot. i would be awared for your new updates. Thanks alot.
Google announced this morning on Twitter that it is releasing the September 2019 core update later today.

[BushyTop]

Has anyone seen a dramatic change in SERPs or Traffic BTW or are most seeing a slow delivery. We seem to improving, but the changes are really slow. I'm wondering whether it will peter out into just a marginal improvement.

@MayankParmar have you seen a dramatic surge in your recovery. or is it slower building? Are the changes you have seen to new content that you have published and are you seeing that rank better than previously newly published content, or has the now older stuff surged too?

[TeresaD]

mosxu + I deliberately put the bid so low to see what would happen as my paid sales fell off a cliff.

My (unproven) theory is that if my ads are shown at that price I must have unique widgets or keywords that the competitors do not have or are not bidding on.

If I have unique widget keywords my sales should not have fallen off a cliff so my campaign that was very successful and died overnight is somehow broken.

[samwest]

Right back to zero again. This after what appeared to be a magical recovery late last week as the predicted filter wall fell, albeit temporarily. Robust traffic and conversions restarted but now have died. If you don’t believe in these filters, you will in 3, 2, 1....

[zeus]

see all this suffering over the last years in SEO business / website owners thats why it is so important to let your user know you support other search engines, if you still dont do anything to get some competition on that field, you are not allowed to complain.

[TeresaD]

@zeus + that leaves me stuck, Google is by far the biggest search engine

Search Engine Market Share in Ireland - August 2019
bing1.6%
Yahoo!0.99%
DuckDuckGo0.5%

[zeus]

TeresaD - yes I know - what I mean is we have to spread the word that there are other search engines, who else as the webmaster can do that. That way we maybe over time see more competition and you are not so reliable on Google. I miss the good old times where Alter Vista and Yahoo was king and google slowly getting there. The we had 3 with almost equal share of the market.

We have :
Duckduckgo.com (duck.com)
Ecosia.org (they plant trees from the income)
Qwant.com a European search engine.
Bing.com


ohh Im not sure if Robert once again is after me on those recommendations :)

[Histerius]

@zwus + Interesting. Been searching for my domain, exactly same results on all search engines. The "authority" of the site before anything else. It seems they all use very very similar algorithms.

[sofie77]

This is just one of many things that have been very annoying over the past year. If you try to look for discussion on health topics and add on "forum" at the end, it's often the case that no forum results show up at all, you just get sites like Healthline.

This is a clear example that Google is ignoring you and hand-holding, trying to be guardian, protector.

@whoa182 +

Yes, thats the point.

In our case (Forum for a specific disease) we do NOT sell any alternative medicals, e-books, Affiliate or unserious treatments.

People with this disease share their opionion and they help each other in times of pain and frutstration. It helps alot, to know, you are not alone with this disease. But Google is cutting our traffic and refer affected users to a hotline or to a article and this for our main key "disease forum" and thousands of long tails.

When I use DDG or any other search engine we are always on Nr1 for this disease.

I hope that google will rethink their decision anytime. But to be honest, I dont think so.

[samwest]

I think it's time we get a new thread on the "medical site debate topic" - this one is veering wildly.

[Selen]

Webmasters should start using the name "Duck" (Duck.com) instead of "DDG"

[samwest]

Seeing a weird pattern of regional traffic clustering today.

[RedBar]

Blimey, I go away on business for a few days and G goes into another meltdown mode, again!

Webmasters should start using the name "Duck" (Duck.com) instead of "DDG"

I've been promoting DDG for years, along with a couple of others, and I've found that most people seem to remember DDG much better than Duck or Duck.com

I reckon it may be the rhyming of letters DDG rather than Duck which rhymes with something else.

I'm pretty sure someone will explain the "psychological" reasoning for this.

[Selen]

DuckDuckGo made a basic marketing mistake when they used this weird name as their brand. They have recently fixed it by buying duck.com domain. Now they should get rid of the "DuckDuckGo" theme and move everything to duck.com. A regular user has no clue what DDG means ::

[samwest]

still sitting at drip or zero traffic all day. None of the trickle is coming from my #1 and #2 listing pages, all coming in from obscure side door posts. Whatever traffic does make it is total zombie again. This is beyond bizarre. Feels worse that when the internet ran on 300 baud. 20 years later who ever thought it would wind up like this. All smoke and mirrors.

[oldnewby]

Long time lurker, thought I'd offer my observations since I'm now registered. :)

Ecommerce. 16% spike on the 25th, 29% drop on the 26th. Then a climb back up. Weekly visits down 3.4% from the prior week. Bounce rate up a touch. Pages per session down a bigger touch.

Avg Session duration way down on the 25th, from 6.32 to 2.13. Back up to 6.28 on the 26th, climbing through Sunday to 7.58.

Conversions -0- (not including phone orders and other SE's like DDG) for 4 days, from the 25th through the 28th.

All in all, not much of a change yet for us. We have a lot of content and google ranks that much better than our products.

[samwest]

@Oldnewby - the zero conversion thing seems to be very widespread which makes us all wonder wtf they are doing? It's not the population as a whole behaving like a murmeration of birds...its Gorg twisting the knobs and squeezing the proverbial turnip.

Update...now one conversion today, a renewal from a previous customer who signed up in 2005...14 years ago, other than that nothing. Do I get bonus points for that level of customer retention? Lol.

[ybendiks]

Hey guys,

I'm trying to corroborate some data and theories I am seeing.

Can anyone confirm ranking improvements on sites with lots of long form, detailed content? What about sites with lots of long form, detailed content but weak backlink profiles?

[samwest]

So I'm guessing I'm the only one here who at 5pm CST in the USA has got only one visitor on the site from Kayseri Turkey where it is currently 1am and nothing else for the past hour. If this update is done rolling out, then no matter my page one positions, I'm done. GART looks wacky as can be today. Can we trust these analytics at all?

[akusnet]

I have noticed for a while to date, that Facebook advertising is related to the conversations of a person carrying a nearby cell phone. The same happens for WhatsApp in written conversations, as well as commands and voice searches.

I think this latest update has to do with personalized results through voice conversations, maybe that's why traffic on our sites is so irregular, I don't know, it's just a theory.

[Milchan]

DuckDuckGo made a basic marketing mistake when they used this weird name as their brand. They have recently fixed it by buying duck.com domain. Now they should get rid of the "DuckDuckGo" theme and move everything to duck.com. A regular user has no clue what DDG means

I agree, I use it as my main search engine yet sometimes I have have to rack my brain to remember what it is called . I might know it is duckduck? - I just forgot the go bit , or just in general takes me a moment or two to remember. The should just change it to Duck.com or refer to it as Duck Search. I wouldn't be averse to "G Can Go Duck Itself" either but Im not sure that is too catchy.

[seomotionz]

I am getting garbage bot traffic from yesterday. Its direct traffic. In Analytics "Country" is showing 'not set' and "network domain" is showing 'google.com'

[JesterMagic]

My stats seem to indicate that the update is still rolling out? Anyone else see this?

[BushyTop]

@JesterMagic yep, still seeing plenty of movement

[glakes]

Anyone else see this?

Yes. We had a couple days when Google let some converting traffic slip through and now we are back to crap.

[sofie77]

I think it's time we get a new thread on the "medical site debate topic"

would be great.

When I look at the health serps at the moment, I observ something like this:

if ($health)
{ 
 if (($ebook) OR ($ads) OR ($affili))
 $trustscore = $trustscore - X;
 }
}

With the X google is playing.

[seomotionz]

What happened today anyway? Traffic becoming low, these things can happen while an update rolls out. But bot and zombie traffic! again?

[Travis304]

I'm experiencing much of the same thing others are on here: Wild changes in SERPs/rankings, and a random, huge drop in conversions and sales with traffic either bouncing up and down, or falling off. Key words that were historically well-established keep jumping between pages 1 and 2. Some jumped 5 or more spots (up and down) with no rhyme or reason. It's really annoying. I'm in a niche widget eComm market. My sites have decent backlink profiles with lot of new, high DR links, plenty of new, good long-form content that is "E-A-T" as can be, as stupid ole' GooOoogGle likes to spin it. None of it matters.

[Malanje]

Since this update I noticed strange things in SERPS. For instance, if I search for codigo postal, which means zip code in portuguese, I get in the first result the company that has the responsibility of deliver mail in Portugal, witch is correct. But after I get 7 results from another website, all the same, just changing possible locations.

[samwest]

My stats seem to indicate that the update is still rolling out? Anyone else see this?

Rolling out? How about Rolling over.
The only traffic I am getting is return customers.
Regardless of the #1 AND #2 position on page one, and on all the suggested search results pages...I am getting no traffic whatsoever. Naturally no conversions either.
Looks like many are in the same boat, again. This is the WORST batch of Zombie traffic ever. "Visitors" hit one page then site for 10 minutes or more, never traversing the site.
Wonder what "Bill Lambert" is saying.

[edited by: samwest at 6:03 pm (utc) on Oct 1, 2019]

[TeresaD]

It is so disheartening after all of the years, man/woman hours, time and effort that have gone into our sites for it all to be taken away. I have accepted there is not a lot more I can do except wait for my local widget seasons.

[glakes]

This is the WORST batch of Zombie traffic ever. "Visitors" hit one page then site for 10 minutes or more, never traversing the site.

We're getting a lot of one page wonders from Google now as well. One landed on a page and sat there for 54:07 then left. Most just bounce in < 1 minute. Traffic from Google has been poorly targeted/matched with our website for some time, but I agree it is even worse at this moment. Traffic volume is up, but it's just wasting our bandwidth...

[samwest]

The only way I can nudge a little traffic is by using my facebook page. Nothing appears to be coming from Google. Either the entire world has abandoned them (unlikely) or they figured out an even more effective way to circumvent our sites.

[browndog]

This update has had by far the worst impact on my site in the 17 years I've had it. Like samwest, I can get a little traffic via my Facebook page as well as push notifications, but not much from Google.

Right now, should be one of the busiest times of the day for traffic, but it's dead.

The biggest impact is they've demoted my no. 1 article, which brought in a significant amount of traffic. I used to sit at no. 1 or 2, but it's now at 5 or 6. I received notification a few months ago that it was loading slowly, with 300+ comments, I was worried that was impacting on speed, so I deleted all of the comments and turned off commenting, since then it's continued to slide. I now regret removing the comments because they were actually helpful.

[southernguy]

Yup, it's pretty much this way with most of my sites. I am not or have never expected for all my pages to all rank number one. It's obvious every site has strengths and weaknesses, but to completely demote entire sites, keywords etc is just wrong.

I have had a bunch of traffic today to some of my better ranking sites but still no conversions.

@browndog right now it's not about making changes I thought the same thing a year ago but in my case making changes to some of my sites made things worse.

From what I see this has affected thousands of webmasters and small businesses everywhere.

I guess that's why when John Muller began saying if your site doesn't rank any longer "there is nothing you can do" I guess he knew all along this was Google's end game.

I guess in a way they set webmasters up for the boiling frog fable and brought us webmasters to a slow boil so we wouldn't jump out of the pot.

[RedBar]

I received notification a few months ago

Insofar as the #1 rule for G is concerned, never, never, ever, do as they suggest or request ... they do that for only one reason and that is for their own benefit, it never has anything whatsoever to do with being beneficial for you.

Period!

[Selen]

"there is nothing you can do"

"never, ever, do as they suggest or request"

Catch-22

[RedBar]

I guess he knew all along this was Google's end game.

That's an interesting statement ... does G actually have a game plan other than a shortsighted one for its own (directors financial gain) benefit and to satisfy the betting market (read Stockmarket)?

I can't find the quote right now but it was in the last couple of weeks where Google stated "We're an ad platform, not a search engine" ... Please correct me if I am wrong about that.

Surely this should clarify everyone's mind as to its intentions / destination?

It has absolutely ZERO interest in promoting a better world, it is only interested in the maximum profitable Dollars. I do not have a problem with that however when its SERPs are so obviously distorted, skewed and biased, it has come to the point whereby governmental intervention is necessary to halt its blatantly obvious manipulation.

Could G honestly prove there is NO contrivance when US companies dominate its G.com English language SERPs globally let alone its results in non-English language SERPs.

Its a farce, a total and utter farce and it (G) is being allowed to get away with it with impunity.

[RedBar]

Catch-22

Nope, never, ever do it!