Understanding which keywords to use in SEO to rank for given keywords

[member22]

Is there way to find the list of words google wants to see to rank on a certain keyword ?

[netmeg]

I don't understand the question.

[member22]

Google ranks website partly on content and the way it ranks is by looking at the words and see how they relate to each other. A page about tennis needs to have raquet ball match set etc... and google has in it index somewhere a list if word to use to appear on certain keywords.

My question is there a way to find that list or what do you recommend to choose the right words !

[not2easy]

There are some free tools available here [freetools.webmasterworld.com...] (link at the top of the page) with some keyword tools in the mix you could use to see if they give you ideas.

[Robert Charlton]

My question is there a way to find that list or what do you recommend to choose the right words !

Yes, Google does look at context, and the examples you post indicate that you understand the basic principle. But, beyond that, I think that natural language and common sense are most likely your best approach. Each page has its own purpose, and I'd stick with that when writing it... not try to tack on keywords artificially.

Once upon a time, when Google's Adwords tool included synonyms and related keywords, there were SEOs who thought that including these on a page might help rankings... but reports I read suggest that the effect was just the opposite. Google looked upon this as keyword stuffing... too many synonyms... and the pages tanked.

[member22]

Thank you so just go with natural I guess...

[FranticFish]

Build a rankings diary of the terms you're targeting and look for words that are bolded in the SERP that are not your exact query.

For example, search on 'clementine' and you might see 'orange' bolded (made up, I'm not saying Google does this for these two words). That's Google telling you that it considers those words to be closely related.

[CaptainSalad2]

Once upon a time, when Google's Adwords tool included synonyms and related keywords, there were SEOs who thought that including these on a page might help rankings... but reports I read suggest that the effect was just the opposite. Google looked upon this as keyword stuffing... too many synonyms... and the pages tanked.

I can provide examples (if mods request) to websites that use keyword clouds "keyword variation ~ keyword variation ~ keyword variation ~ keyword variation" at the bottom/top of the site (sometimes hidden with css colour) and they rank at the top of their niche uninterrupted for the past 5 years, any explanation why this simply "keyword stuffing" trick still isn't being picked up? Not exactly natural...

I’d say to the OP that unless you have a strong backlink profile or are a brand you WILL have to work the key phrases you want to be picked up for by search engines into your text more often than you would if you were writing it just for humans, the best you can do is make it as natural as possible with that in mind!

I don't buy into the hype Google is smart enough to detect and penalise all unnatural language and keyword stuffing as I can disprove that by listing websites using keyword ~ keyword ~ keyword in the footer! It must still be beyond G to detect the completely unnatural symbol "~" between every other word in the footer I guess lol

[member22]

Words that are bolded are synonyms but I think google wanted is closely related words and not synonyms is that correct ? I believe synonym is like keyword stuffing.

How long does it usually take once you change your content for google to rank your page again ( is it based on the "trust" of the page ? and is it possible to rank a page on a competitive keyword without external link ?)

[CaptainSalad2]

and is it possible to rank a page on a competitive keyword without external link

Rank yes, on page one? No!

[davidjhonson]

i think keyword planner tool used to suggest the right keyword.

[member22]

Let's "imagine" that the keyword planner tool does this. The issue is that I don't really understand the tool. Let's say I type a keyword in there.

Why does it first ask me for my website address and the industry I am in ? is there a reason, can't google give me the keywords without that information ?

Then what is the different between adgroups ideas and keywords ideas ? I tend to look at keyword idea more than adgroups but how should I interpret this information ?

When for example for green widget it shows let's say " best green widget " or " green widget are small " as the keyword idea does it mean I need to use the expression the way it is shown or can I write a sentence and use the word " best at a different location than in the expression ?

For Ex : "The green widget that you see on this page are the best" instead of "The best green widget that you see on this page are green !