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301 Query - How long before all equity is transferred to a new domain?

         

Imtiaz_Hami

6:21 am on Apr 24, 2010 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Hello Everybody,

I have a two fold query :

1. On 301 redirection.

2. On domain age.

Question on 301 redirection.

Suppose I do a 301 redirect from OldDomain to NewDomain :

1. How long before all equity is transferred to the NewDomain.

2. After all equity is transferred, can I safely let the OldDomain expire.?

Question on Domain Age :

When we say the Domain age, does it refer to the domain or the Website?

Suppose I have a domain booked in 2004, I never had a website live on that domain. I just booked the domain and forgot about it,

Now, when I plan to make a website of it, will Google still count it as a New Domain or treat it as an Old Domain.

Thanks Everybody.

Cheers.

g1smd

8:01 am on Apr 24, 2010 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



It may take a year for the site-wide redirect to be fully effective.

Once the old domain expires and the redirect is broken, it's all lost again, as the links pointing to the old domain from other sites now point nowhere.

dusky

9:32 am on Apr 24, 2010 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



My answers are not authorities and are based on research and other people's testimonies only, while I am at it I'll elaborate slightly more on the subject!

Question on 301 redirection:

1= It may take months and up to a year for all pages from the old site to transfer rank to the new site domain, if what you mean IS THE RANK AND BACKLINKS, of course that's if the old site is well established with good PR / backlink portfolio (yes makes a change from saying profile) and trustrank. I myself would reserve at least one year and leave the 301 redirects there for that long. One drawback is if you take the redirects down, there will be few backlinks that are still pointing to the old domain, and those in time will count for nothing and loose PR juice as what was giving them credibility*** is the old site's redirect, once that is taken down, there is no point of reference as to where from THEY GOT THE OLD BACKLINKS as the old domain has expired, sooner or later will be treated as new links. However, don't let that deter you, as in the meantime, they will gain new backlinks (WHILE THE 301 IS IN PLACE) from new sources and many linkers to the old site and bookmarkers will get the hint after a year's redirect (not all, but at least half of them), so should all even out at the end. that's why the redirect should be in place for as long as possible besides giving time to SEs to index / re-index and recalculate rank etc. I have 301 on some sites for seven years now, why, because some webmasters will never change their links to point the new site (unless you asked them to), for me I tend to hold on to the old domains, so leaving the 301 is no problem.


- 2 = If it's not possible to hold on to the old domain, you have no choice I guess, there is a risk if the old site is an authority site and its domain is bought by a spammer or ends up a black hat site, the risk may be a temporary filter until SEs investigate further to be sure the site is under new management. Let's face it, it was redirecting all links to the new site and all of a sudden becomes a bad neighborhood itself, so it's bound to ring alarm bells and has done for few people who told me so, some had to write to G* for a recon request, though now G* has the "add or remove owners link" on WMT which may help to give them a hint the site is under new ownership, however, I don't think that is its purpose for sure!


Question on Domain Age :

My own judgment is not the domain registration record, but by site age, i.e. when went live / archived, be it on the Internet Archive (or other archiving service) or spidered by a Search engine. Even though one can get the age from the first day of registration from any whoisdomain service, for SEs to count it as live since such and such date, those whois services have to be authoritative on their response and not all whois services can convince G* or other SEs of that fact except bodies approved by legislative means directly. For G*, I think they go by the IA and their own records automatically (if the site is no older than their idex's first inception) and with manual investigation (through various channels other than pointed out here) if it's a very large corporate site, they don't want to upset people of power.

Someone should correct me here if I am wrong, if the domain was never used, it's a new site as far as any SE is concerned!

Site age is about how old is the content, membership, readership and circulation (if news / info site), reputation and backlink profile, brand awareness, new and repeat visitors, innovation, technology etc...

Domain age is about when the domain was first registered, how many owners were involved, and for those years probably the domain was expired few times, if it never went live, IT IS considered NEW once it goes live.

One last thing, when sites change hands let's not forget, if the site (live website) had different owners and each owner re-branded it with their own theme, content and so on, what will count IMO in its current ranking is how close the current content is to the once archived / indexed content, if it's almost exactly the same (titles, descriptions, design, material different but the same subject), that no doubt will boost its authority and rank, but only on those years matching the current current content even if its not the same owner. Note that when URLs and anchor texts are different, any backlinks can be redirected to a hub page explaining that the content has changed and should go to the homepage to choose what to read, at least if the content is on the same theme and subject, a lot of juice will still count and will in time be transferred to the homepage from the hub page and thereafter to where they liked the read and linked to it.
If two years live offering Swiss cheese, then another two years offering essays on Freudian dream analysis, it's best to go live with the site offering one or the other, being greedy and offering the two contents justifying blaming having bad dreams on Swiss cheese, may not be so cheesy even if that holds true in some respects scientifically for all cheeses.

Nice if you inherit the directories, scripts and database which means an identical content under new ownership and that just carries on the site rank with no change, but offering an entirely different content, you might as well say it's a new site, the backlinks sooner or later will be devalued as deemed to be irrelevant, maybe small advantage of visitors regardless of how different the content is for the initial period but will soon fade.

*** they in the same time gain credibility while the redirect is there, hence gain new backlinks anyway!

Imtiaz_Hami

2:48 pm on Apr 24, 2010 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Hi g1smd, Thanks for your message. So I guess we have to keep the OldDomain Live for Life. I hope someday SEs do come up with some time-bound issue regarding a 301.

Hi dusky, Thanks for a well explained message. I guess you cement the thoughts of g1smd.

Also, as regards to the new domain issue, I appreciate your thoughts. I too was thinking the same that G will start the alleged Sandbox once IT encounters the website and wont go by the domain whois details.

Also really liked the way you explained the Cheese site. Very insightful.

Thanks again for your valueable time everybody.

Robert Charlton

5:52 pm on Apr 24, 2010 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Administrator 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



So I guess we have to keep the OldDomain Live for Life. I hope someday SEs do come up with some time-bound issue regarding a 301.


There's no way SEs could have a time-bound arrangement.

As long as there are links or bookmarks out in the world that point to your old domain, or printed materials referring to the old domain, etc etc, you will want to keep the 301s in place.

Also, slightly different from the 301 considerations and search engine considerations...there are marketing and reputation considerations.

I've seen companies essentially blackmailed by operators who buy up once-respectable old domains, point them at sleeze, and then offer them for sale back to the original owners.

So, any domain that once identified you can be used against you. As long as you might care about the identification, you should retain old domain ownership... and you might as well then also 301 the domains.

Imtiaz_Hami

5:06 am on Apr 26, 2010 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Thanks Robert. Your advice is well taken.

g1smd

7:40 am on Apr 26, 2010 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



Although you need to keep the old domain name live "forever" you do NOT need separate hosting for it.

Assuming you use Apache, you would point the old domain name to the same server that is serving the new site. In the root .htaccess file of the new site you add some lines of code that simply redirect visitors to the new domain if the visitor has arrived there by requesting the old domain.