Forum Moderators: Robert Charlton & goodroi
Now after six months it is a PR 5, link pop has quadrupled there are almost 800 content pages on there with new ones every day and it has completely dissapeared from any Google SERPs. Its as if G is purposefully ignoring it.
I'm baffled as to how a site can improve in all aspects or SEO (PR, link pop, content etc etc) but get rated worse if at all than when it was just starting out.
Would be glad of some enlightenment.
I am assuming that your site has some great content or some good tool or something which creates unique value(UV) for visitors.
The first step should be to set up your house properly before inviting others (SE, editors & web masters).
Pls remember that one good quality incoming link is better than 100 inferior quality incoming ones.
Generate & create one way incoming links into your web site. These links should be on top of your link campaign list. This is because the SE sees them as they are: one way links. This gives it a significant vote to your website.In other words the SE knows that you have not traded a link. Some one has found genuine merit in your web site & has linked to you. They value that link higher than others.
Get the directory listings. There are numerous directories( Dmoz, Yahoo, Zeal) etc which one can submit a site to. With some one like dmoz you can aspire for more than one incoming link as well. You can try some of the paid options of URL inclusion if your budget permits it
( business.com, yahoo.com etc) Then there are multiple, regional & topical directories which one can look for & get the site submitted to.
Firstly I've been having enough trouble getting reciprocal links as the site is new and the PR on the links page is low. So how on earth would I get one way links? Its against my policy to do it so how can I expect other webmasters to link to me for nothing?
Ahhh the Sandbox, yes thats where I am. Any tips on getting out of it besides a really big spade?
ps: sorry if this has already been covered.
Firstly I've been having enough trouble getting reciprocal links as the site is new and the PR on the links page is low. So how on earth would I get one way links?
Write some useful content related to your niche, publish articles, develop tools (if applicable), etc.
HTH
I personally know someone who will not trade links unless the site is "established" with a PR of at least 4. This person has a number of sites and is highly succesful. He builds all his own sites by himself, no site generating progs, white hat all the way and his income makes me wonder what I am doing wrong. LOL
Ann
When I do a search I notice that most of the results are sites that are linking to me using the keywords that I have given them such as "location widget news". My site is nowhere in the top 100, its extremely annoying.
Is there anyway to get out of this by tweaking the site or getting more links or do I just have to sit and wait until Big Brother decides to give me some love?
Seems to me that Google is being clever and has not been impressed by the links you have acquired.
You say "Firstly I've been having enough trouble getting reciprocal links as the site is new and the PR on the links page is low. So how on earth would I get one way links? "
Trying to get recipricol links is a dangerous game. Once you have a few, perhaps 5 or 6 and google has found your site, then forget it. Trade links if appropriate but don't look for them. Too many recipricol and 'link page' links is possibly a flag to artificial linking. You need to fit the profile of a quality site, which will have natural links that have not been obviously traded. These will be one way and gained by the quality and usefullness of your site.
If Yahoo and Msn are providing traffic, then natural linking will accumulate if the site warrants it.
>Its against my policy to do it so how can I expect other webmasters to link to me for nothing?
They will and you should link to other sites in an unconditional way if appropriate. This probably also fits the profile of a genuinely good site that is participating in the spirit of the web. Google likes links, it is its life blood, and it loves 'natural linking'.
The trick is to generate a site that encourages people to 'naturally' link to it. Any consideration of PR is not a natural thing to do, so links from anyone who is hung up about this is something I avoid persuing. They are too seo aware and google will probably be ignoring their links anyway because they are probably not a 'natural' site themselves. Of course, you can fake natural linking, but longterm a site needs to continually be acquiring these links. This is only achieved by content and although your content maybe good, you need to make it 'linkable'.
One last thought, if you do not link out 'naturally' yourself, then you are not contributing to the web in a way that Google would be impressed by.
I think I have about a half dozen reciprocal links - but looked for none of them, I linked to them, they spontaneiously linked back.
In most articles I link out to good pages from an appropriate place within the article. No pattern, I just insert a link if it is appropriate and would be useful. I never bother to contact those I link to.
I have spent zero time on link development but a lot of time writing good content that people DO actually link to without being asked, even from high PR sites, though I do not care about the PR of site to which I link or which link in.
Other than having sensible relevant heading and titles I never think about things like keyword density, optimum article length or any of that stuff. If it seems like it would be useful to people done a given way, that's the way I do it.
This is doing just great in Google. Very good positions accross a range of searches, lots of free traffic. I am not saying doing it this way is a model for every site or is perfect, but it sure is more enjoyable and less stressful to develop this way, without obsessing about SEO. AND I really believe that now more than ever it happens to be the most beneficial also.
I think the key to your problem is where you say:
I'm baffled as to how a site can improve in all aspects of SEO (PR, link pop, content etc etc) but get rated worse if at all than when it was just starting out
That suggests to me that when you sit down to work on this site, to add a page of content or whatever, you are thinking all the time of SEO and search engines and not about people and usefullness.
That used to work and occasionally works for a short time now, but SEs can spot that better than ever and they do not reward it.
That pretty well sums it up. I don't care what anyone says, there are no sure methods with google anymore. Spam and blackhat are flourishing. Even the simplest, most archane methods are enjoying free rein and not being checked. I see constant remarks about sites reported 2, 3, 4, and even 6 months ago-still enjoying high rankings. Doesn't make sense. Then other, (claimed clean) doing poorly.
With the nature of the site it is quite difficult to put natural outbound links in without linking to competing sites. Now I'm sure they wouldnt be doing this back to us or any other site for that matter.
Thanks again for the great feedback, I have been designing websites and doing SEO for a few years but this is definately the first time I have been penalized by a search engine so its quite disturbing.
but deep under a pile of sand when it comes to Google (number 82).
I don't know how competitive it is for your main key words, but position # 82 after 5 to 6 months is a pretty good advancement these days IMHO. Keep grinding, forget the sandbox thing, if your that high up it just might be in the rear view mirror for you.
Should I remove the links page and not worry if those that I have arranged reciprocals with get annoyed or remove my link?
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I have got rid of most of my outgoing links now (less that 20) and continuing to add new content daily as I have been doing for the last 5 months. Hopefully someone somewhere will dig me out of all this sand before I apply for a job in a fast food restaurant.
Viva la revolution.
It just annoys me that one corporation can have such a monopoly and hold over peoples livelihoods.
I find it much more annoying the number of people who willing GIVE that corporation control over their livelihood.
Try this: Assume that there is no google....how would you market your website then? Would you try to build a site that attracts new/repeat users via alternate means? try that approach, and you might just see your googel traffic return and/or increase.
Excellent point...one major problem is folks get hung up on Google and then suffer the consequences...you must think about your target audience and find ways to communicate and create relationships with them...Google is one channel...
