Domainers making Millions

Instead of Selling Domains for Profit, they Now Show Ads

[guru5571]

I don't know how many of you have read the Business 2.0 article on Domainers. These guys get hundreds of thousands of domain names that are essentially just words or phrases that people commonly search for just by typing them into the url bar on the browser.

Some of them are selling their own in house ads, but plenty are straight up MFA sites with zero content. One site profiled in the article <snip> has serious Adsense TOS violations. They have snipped up the Adsense code to display a column of 10 Adsense ads. The guy who runs the site is standing there with his picture in Business 2.0, raking cash by abusing Adsense and taking money that should go to real content providers.

What say you ASA?

[edited by: martinibuster at 5:41 am (utc) on Jan. 5, 2006]
[edit reason] Removed specifics [/edit]

[OptiRex]

Try this link:

[google.com...]

It will probably answer your angst!

[hdpt00]

Do you really have nothing better to do then cry over people making more than you?

[guru5571]

Thanks for the link Opti! I had no idea about the existence of this program. Guess I'm eating crow now. This answers a lot of questions I had.

[Atomic]

Google slipped these sites into the Search Partner Network so when you advertise with AdWords your ads appear on these BS "sites" that Google allows. The fraud is rampant and the traffic terrible and Google is their partner.

I think it's only a matter of time before someone takes Google to court since they have created an elaborate system designed to defraud advertisers. These sites exist for no other reason than to drain advertisers of money. It's not something Google is unaware of. How could they not know that they designed this beast?

So while you could say, "Oh, this is a legitimate Google program", and move on you could also look at it another way. That it's only legitimate to Google and when more advertisers catch on there is going to be a lot more noise about it.

[guru5571]

I'll agree with you Atomic. It seems pretty hypocritical to run these when they are just as bad if not worse than so many of the MFAs that people are always whinging about.

[Jean]

I agree with you. Got to some of this crap doing searches and it leaves a bad taste...and I am not even paying for the ads.

[gendude]

Google slipped these sites into the Search Partner Network so when you advertise with AdWords your ads appear on these BS "sites" that Google allows.

This is one reason why I no longer advertise through AdWords. I don't believe in supporting these sites.

[Atomic]

Add this to what I said: These sites also bid on the same keywords that you will so that you have tyo raise your bid so that when the traffic is sent to these garbage MFA sites you pay more for your reglar ads and the fraudulent clicks. I got out of the Search Partner network and my costs were cut in half and my income stayed the same. It really does leave a bad taste in your mouth but the smart advertisers will start leaving their money in their wallets.

[martinibuster]

It seems pretty hypocritical to run these when they are just as bad if not worse than so many of the MFAs...

Well, stop to think about it a second.

1: These sites are monetizing "type in" traffic. So they are not stealing money from AdSense publishers.

2: Type-in traffic is as targeted, if not more, than regular search traffic. So someone typing in widgets.com has a good chance of converting (since they are looking for widgets), than the average visitor who reaches your site for a variety of three or four word search queries.

3: Type-in traffic is desire based. People typing in domains want to see that specific domain. They are looking to find what is being offered on that domain. Type-in traffic is relevance in it's purest form.

These sites exist for no other reason than to drain advertisers of money.

If AdSense is about delivering targeted traffic to advertisers, then type-in traffic represents the ultimate in targeting. If you were a merchant selling Green Widgets, wouldn't you jump at the chance to monetize traffic from the GreenWidgets.com domain? Of course you would!

[edited by: martinibuster at 11:24 pm (utc) on Jan. 4, 2006]

[Jay27]

I agree with martinibuster.

I think some people are using MFA, scraper, etc to anything they believe is decreasing their income. These are not MFA, they are not even websites, they are just parked domains, but seems some people here prefer to kick anybody out of their method out of business.

p.s. and no; I do not have any parked domain, though I hope I had such domain names!

[Atomic]

They use Adwords. AdWords is not "type in" traffic at all. Some of them are networks of sites that link to each other. And some of them turn up in searches. This is not legitimate traffic and these sites resemble every other MFA site if they can advertise.

If these sites' traffic was only "type in" I might agree but since they are indexed, have page rank and use AdWords it's a whole different ball game.

[edited by: Atomic at 11:44 pm (utc) on Jan. 4, 2006]

[novice]

Actually, AdWords ads appeared on parked pages before AdSense even started. Google used Oingo, prior to buying them, to display AdWords ads on parked pages. In return the registrars were paid a commission. The only difference now is that the "domain owners" get a portion of the money generated from the clicks and not just the registrars.

I think Google bought Oingo in February 2003 and didn't begin AdSense until June 2003.

[Atomic]

I forgot to mention that some have cache's far different than the pages visitors see and after reporting to Google I was told that it was fine.

[guru5571]

I appreciate your point with "type-in" traffic MartiniBuster... but plenty of these sites can be found in the SERPs. Not only Google SERPS but Yahoo and MSN SERPs. Why should parked domains rank well in SERPs? In my opinion they are MFAs that have the blessing of Google since they can have a title that is indexed by SEs like the dailyjoke site I mentioned previously.
Also it looks like the ads are in plain html so they will be indexed by other bots. I think this is just promoting spam on the net and putting one more click between the person and the content they are after.(IMHO)

[OldWolf]

at G/domainpark it says

If your sites generate more than 750,000 page views per month, AdSense for domains is for you

check the link below
<snip>

there are 12699 parked domains there, are you believe if any of that [stupid] domain names can have 750,000 page views/monthly

(copy /paste domains to browser)

[edited by: martinibuster at 1:34 am (utc) on Jan. 5, 2006]
[edit reason] Removed URL per tos. [/edit]

[Atomic]

There are some that have links designed to look like menus that bring up nothing but pages of more AdSense units so that it initially resembles a website. They also allow just enough text to bring searches in. It took me a while to figure out what was going on and I have just been getting angrier and angrier about this. And then on top if it all some people, including Google staff, have deluded themselves that this is a legitimate business practice.

I can't see much of a future in a company thats business model is based on spam and fraud.

[incrediBILL]

FWIW these domainpark sites look just like AdLinks pages, so if you use AdLinks then you're doing the same thing.

I have just been getting angrier and angrier about this

Let me buy you a beer, it will help ;)

[Hobbs]

Type-in traffic is relevance in it's purest form

Or rather a sign of giving up on search engines, and ironically look where they end up.

[Atomic]

I'd rather just smash things up a bit.

[btas2]

AdSense must be really proud of their ads on the <snip> parked domain. Anyone looking for a hooker in Alaska can now benefit from the help of Google.

Follow it through and you can find what appear to be AdSense ads for escorts and all sorts of other "entertainment"

Any chance we'll be seeing AdSense on adult sites anytime soon? Could be a great money maker for them.

[edited by: martinibuster at 1:35 am (utc) on Jan. 5, 2006]
[edit reason] Removed Specifics [/edit]

[Webwork]

I'm the registrant of quite a few keyword and keyword phrase domains.

The problem I see with type-in traffis is the domain landers - the pages that appear in your browser upon hitting "go" next to the browser address box - are not being appropriately optimized for the keyword or keyword phrase imbedded in the domain.

If my domain is LocationHotel.tld I would hope that the lander would function like this:

A - If it's a single click lander (you type in the domain/URL) the browser loads a page populated with 10+/- paid website links, hopefully with understandable verbiage associated with each link. A single click on any of the displayed links leads the "direct navigator / type-in navigator" to your advertised hotel information or hotel registration site.

Concrete example: MiamiHotels.tld (not mine). Someone looking for hotels in Miami types in MiamiHotels.tld. That's likely someone very focused on finding a hotel in Miami. They might not register a room on the spot, but chances are pretty good that they're in the hunt. Just like any other click - AdWords or SERPs - they might just be looking.

IF the lander that appears in the browser is nicely populated with links to Miami hotel sites then you have your best shot at a visitor conversion:

Concrete example of good link on lander: "LinkToHotelWebsite - Lowest rates of the season for XYZ hotel in the heart of Miami on the beach".

2 Click landers are a different matter.

Example of 2 click lander: Person types in MiamiHotels.tld.

FIRST PAGE LANDER: Loaded with off topic links: "Free Music Downloads" "Mortgage Refinancing" Etc. AND MAYBE 1 or 2 links to hotels in general. I've seen many such landers. I'm certain they're less productive of conversions. THE ESSENSE of domain landers working is that they should have relevant, directly on domain topic links.

Here's the rub: Not all PPC domain monetization firms do it well. Some are better than others. The industry is actually getting better, but they appear to advance in jerky motions. The firm I'm not using is playing with their landers. It's a debacle: The links are on topic (I hand optimize the lander for links that are relevant) BUT the images and the "generic verbiage" they are playing with are totally off topic. Still, one can only hope that the direct navigator will focus on the on topic first tier links and will click through to the related ad feeds.

Domain PPC, like any other form of PPC, provides an opportunity for fraud. Frankly, a domain PPC firms that accepts all manner of domains, such as typos of trademarks and the like, is opening the doors to corruption. What do I mean?

Well, the person who has no qualms about making money off of typos of other peoples trademarks - or websites - might not have qualms about using click bots or having his/her friends click a few links every day or hour. It's all a matter of conscience.

Click fraud is a serious issue. There's a lot that needs to be addressed. The "take all comers" approach to domains - or AdSense membership - isn't the best approach IMHO. However, I believe in the underlying intelligence of the system - be it domain parking or AdSense - in that they are designed to work and do actually work. Google and others are in the hunt for good domain portfolio providers for good reason. The conversion stats are pretty good.

The real issue is the people participating in the programs. Are they focused only on making money for themselves or are the equally focused on helping the advertiser? Win-win is pretty good stuff when you can make it happen.

Believe or not - in October/November 2005 - the PPC feed providers did the same thing with the domain parking services that they've been working on with AdSense and "smart pricing": They upgraded or downgraded the domainer's revenue payout based upon the indicia of domain quality and domain conversion data.

I'm a happy little camper, pleased to report that I got a gold * on my domain ROI report card. Success, however, isn't quite the same without a hug from mom, her pat on my head and her making me a chicken salad sandwich as a reward. :) I work extra hard to hugs, head pats and chicken salad sandwiches.

You listening AdSenseAdvisor? Chicken salaaadddd . . .

[edited by: Webwork at 12:31 am (utc) on Jan. 5, 2006]

[Atomic]

Wow, that is a lot of words when you could just say:

I trick people into going to a bogus website to steal advertisers money and Google helps me do it.

[Webwork]

Having a bit of a meltdown, Atomic?

[Atomic]

If you felt like you were being scammed by Google you might as well. I bet there are a thousand more like me out there, too.

[Webwork]

Sorry to read you're having a bad time of it Atomic. I'm with you on dealing with PPC frauds/scams/etc.

I can imagine a time when all versions of PPC will allow for greater advertiser control/selectiveness - in choosing quality websites for contextual advertising and quality domains for PPC on domain landers.

You see, I'm inclined to believe that a more selective system will be good for you (higher ROI for the advertiser) and for me (higher payouts for quality domains and domain related quality websites. :)

[jtara]

There's more than a bit of irony and duplicity in Google's policies.

While the operation that I outlined in the Adwords forum here (see link 2 posts above) seems clearly against the Adsense TOS, you can do essentially the same thing using Google's parking program.

The only real differences are:

- No nonsense phrases on the official program - only keywords and ads.

- No crosslinking between sites in the official program

- Official Google program vs. do-it-yourself

The ultimate insult to Adwords advertisers is that some of the sites in the Google parking program are classified as "search". (You got keywords? You got ads? You got a Google search box? You got a "search site"!) And they get thrown in to "Search Network", which they've convinced many advertisers is safe ground.

I'm probably going to pull-back to Google Search only, until/unless Google gives me the ability to remove parking sites from so-called "search network".

I do want the AOL, Ask Jeves, etc. traffic. Don't want parked domains.

[Atomic]

I am still of the opinion that this is more Google's dirty little secret scam than anything. Take the way they promote the Search Partners. Google suggests that it's sites like AOL and AT&T or Ask Jeeves but they curiously omit the fact that your ads will appear on their officially sanctioned version of made for AdSense sites. This is a dishonest bait and switch that makes Google complicity in this scam is clear when you take this into account.

[Atomic]

I do want the AOL, Ask Jeves, etc. traffic. Don't want parked domains.

Precisely. Who would?

[venuma]

The easiest way for google to handle this situation would be have 3 categories (Currently they just have 2).

Search : impressions on search results pages generated by Google and by Google Network search partners.(Includes AOL, Earthlink, Ask etc)

Content: impressions on content sites in the Google Network. On these sites, your ads are displayed alongside content relevant to your keywords.

ParkedPages: Impression on Parked pages.

Each Type should have their own maximum bid and the advertisers can choose to opt out of any these categories.