Forum Moderators: mack
The last site I made was for a business that is just starting out. I didn't ask that they pay, but they liked the site and ended up referring me to a friend who also owns a business. This person liked the site and wants to pay me to make a site. My friend who works at the business for the first site I built told me that he was serious about it and that I could probably charge $1000 but shouldn't go lower than $500.
I feel shocked about getting paid that much to build a website! I'm not completely new to web developement (I first learned how to build websites about 6 years ago, even though I don't make sites on a regular basis), but I am new to looking at it from a financial standpoint. The site he wants is pretty basic and will likely only take some html and css. He has already seen what I can do and wants something similar, so I think I'll be ok with actually building the site.
Is it really ok to ask that much from my first paying client for a basic site? He wants to talk to me over the phone in a couple of days, and I'm not even sure what to discuss when it comes to what I charge! Can someone please give me some advice?
I remember seeing a long thread on webmasterworld about what to charge for websites but at that time wasn't giving it much attention since it didn't apply to me. I can't seem to find it now, so if someone could also give me that link I would appreciate it.
Edit-I found the post I was thinking of at [webmasterworld.com...] and am reading it now. If anyone has more advice I would still appreciate it!
I get around $150-$200 for a 5 static page site.
Don't undersell yourself... if you start out low you'll always have trouble raising the price later. Your first client will recommend you to a friend "hey they only charged me $100 for a top site... cheap or what?"
Depending on the size of the site - $500 is an easy starting point. I just did a site (can we post web addresses on this forum?) and total cost ran to about £3500 (about $5,500)... It has news sections (with an admin area), a voting system, Credit card purchasing, about 30 pages and registration/mailing list process.
Now it seems as though I'll need a different approach. What should I make sure to ask about during the first meeting? What do I need to be sure to let them know? What SHOULDN'T I say?
It probably wouldn't be a good idea to let them know I'm this clueless, right? ;)
One small word of advice: Decide how much you're going to ask for, write it on a peice of paper, and keep it right in front of you when you are talking to him on the phone. Otherwise you may be inclined to ask less than you were going to when the golden moment arrives.
Good luck - there's a whole new world of income opportunity opening up in front of you!
Where starting to charge for websites is concerned I have certainly been in that place before :-)
I think you must think about a couple of key issues and they are important to keep a sense of perspective in this I think anyhow.
1. You are no more nor less than one individual.
The same as me, as your prospective client or anyone else in here or who may be there and trying to compete for a piece of work that you want to do.
You intrinsically are the same, all are consenting adults in law with the same rights and ability to act with free will.
What has this to do with anything. It is to do with value. If I told you that webdesigner A is worth $10,000 a site and you sorry you are only worth $500 a site, that would almost be to be being rude.
You as an individual human are the same as webdesigner A you are equals, they cannot as a human individual be more or less valuable than you are.
However for the specific process or task of making a website for a company you have to think that in that one instance that one need, webdesigner A may be able to provide such a better solution for the client that they may actually (in that one task) be worth more to the client than in the same task you would be
Or of course vice versa :-)
So this is to do with setting price for a specific something a thing, this thing has a value, you have to negotiate with the client and with the pressures of the surrounding market forces to discover what value the thing you are delivering at this point in time has.
In this at least two needs should ideally be met, your clients needs as the one who needs the website and your needs as the person who may provide it for them. In your negotiation you will come to an agreed value for the transaction.
Welcome to the world of commerce :-)
2. Your prospective client in this case wants something that they feel you can provide for them.
It seems as if the prospective client has already seen a site that you have done that they feel you can deliver what they want. This is the essence of word of mouth recommendation.
You are not sure that you can charge this price because you are not used to negotiating your own value, perhaps you have never had to do this before consciously.
Well as an adult you do have to do this and in fact we are engaged in this negotiation from childhood. The negotiation goes like this, what where how why when, can I do that can I push this envelope further, as children our parents would be watching if only to say no dont put your head into that lions mouth!
But when they decide you have developed rational thought for yourself they will assume you have been programmed sufficiently :-) for the adult world and thereafter it is much more up to you.
But still you are not on your own, your arrival here at webmasterworld to ask this is a request for assistance from your peers, a "peer review" because you have had a doubt suddenly perhaps you wondered do I actually know what I am doing? :-)
That question is something that all thinking people should ask themselves regularly imho :-) its always a humbling question to ask however :-)
You may feel some dissonance about setting a value for what you are doing, you may even be embarrassed or feel to charge $500 may be like stealing because you think the work you would have to do is so simple.
Is that a thought you have had, no need to answer that?
3. Multiple parralel negotiations of markets.
What happens in relatively free but human markets is that there are multiple simultaneous negotiations always occuring just like the one you are in at this moment and while each discussion may not arrive at the same price or even at a deal at all, overall the market is adjusting itself to put a value on a service or a product and to ensure if it can that no one party is being robbed blind :-) not you and not your customer.
So do honestly look around at the sites that others are providing and what they are charging for them.
Be scrupliously honest in appraising your own skills in this particular task of website production.
If you are a relative beginner? you may have to admit that it is unlikely your pressing a few buttons in a piece of software like dreamweaver will produce the same result or same eventual business performance in a web site or online property as the work of someone perhaps with 10 years experience of custom site construction and online promotion.
It is completely your choice what price you set, also what claims you make about your service but I think you would be wise not to generate any expectations you cannot deliver.
So best of luck to you in this new endeavour it sounds as exciting to you as it was for me and I may only be one tiny step in front of you in that specific thing websites and all the associated paraphanalia!
There are only 2 things you can do, do your best and give your client your full attention and best intentions.
Your word should really be your bond so speak carefully in your market communications :-)
hth
Step 1: Meet the client and determine the requirements. Do NOT discuss price - say you will work up a small presentation of options and get back within a day.
Step 2: Think about what needs to be done: is anything new to you, etc., cost it out and talk it over with someone you trust to pick up anything you missed.
Step 3: Get back to him the next day with several sketches (yes sketches) giving him a low ($500-700) option and a top ($1000-1200) option. Encourage him to draw all over them to clarify a look. Now bring up price and be explicit. This much for this, this, and this by such and such a date. Anything else is extra.
Step 4: Type up a contract proposal, get it signed, get a part payment, get to work.
Remember: He wants the site, you are the recommended designer, you know the price range. He has put himself into the design (you got him involved by altering your suggestions) and he is not likely to walk away at this point. It has become his site.
Read the threads here on contracts and payment schedules and all that other business pitfall stuff. Very important and he will expect it.
Jump on in - the "professional" pool is never too crowded!
There is a lot of useful advice above.
I would only add this: You seem to lack self confidence and that is critically important.
This is a service industry, you need to instill confidence in the prospective client.
Immediately stop thinking about whether you are worth $1,000 for the job. That is such a negative thought I personally can't handle it :(
If you and I were in the same physical room right now I would rotovate you into motivating you. You wouldn't like that experience, but you wouldn't leave the room in any doubt you were worth much more than $1,000 for a simple site. When you talked to the prospect you would be able to convey it to them also.
$1,000 is peanuts.....I don't know you from Eve, but if anyone is recommending your services I know you are worth more than that!
I also know you have shown a great deal of integrity in your post here.....heck, that alone is worth $1,000.
You already know what you need to do in your heart....but, lack the courage. You have been setup with a good starting point.....now go and get the gold off of the table.....and stop thinking you aren't worth it!
Start thinking you are worth much more than $1,000, but because the client was a referral you will do the right thing and give them a good deal at $1,000+.
To win you need an ego the size of the galaxy. Will some folks think you are arrogant?....sure they will, live with that, and enjoy your success :)
Regards Ian
Just get a copy. Today.
Lots and lots of truly valuable info, people!
This is one of those so-valuable threads I wish they'd sticky.... I'm bookmarking it myself!
Try clicking "Flag thread" at the bottom of the page. Should keep it handy for your future reference. :)
Sheesh. Never paid any attention to that! Thanks whoisgregg!
never undersell yourself. a good tip for if you are getting paid, is that you could always outsource some of the harder work to somebody else.
im sure people here would be prepared to help you out for 100 bucks should you get stuck somewhere
make it seem like you have alot of experience and you have a team of people behind you. no problems, only solutions!
thats what i would do at least ...
I worked as a consultant for large corporations and they used to pay me $100 an hour. I used to swim in my pool and sunbathe listening to jimmy buffett while I was "on-call" and never once had a problem collecting the check at the end of the month.
Worth is about perception - if you are good at what you do then you should get paid for it.
Keep it simple and positive. Listen, and the client will show you what he wants, and tell you want he is willing to spend. Just wait for the info to come... be patient.
Oh, and makes sure you tell him that you always bill in 30 minute increments, so if he wants he can save up his smaller changes and whatnot and give them to you all at once, to save money. It makes him happy to hear you showing him ways to save money. Later, when he asks you for lotsof little things one at a time anyway, you will thank me for that tip ;-)
But of course the US economy is very different to the NZ one; US$45 here will buy you 2.25 full-price music CD's - I would refer to the famous 'Big Mac' index but I don't eat them so an unfamiliar with the price here :)
