Complex designs and compatibility

How far back do you go?

[matthewwithanm]

I'm currently working on a design for my page using (of course) CSS for layout. The layout looks good in FF, NN7+, IE5+ and Opera 6+. (I have yet to test on macs but I'm confident it'll be fine on both IE5 and Safari.) However, it breaks completely on IE4 and Opera 5 or less (degrades gracefully in IE3).

My question is, how far back do you aim with compatibility when designing your sites? Of course, everybody would love for their site to look identical in all browsers but, practically speaking, what are your goals when you design?

What I'll probably end up doing is hacking or PHP to deliver alternate CSS to these old browsers but when do you consider a browser "old"?

Is my layout crappy for not supporting these browsers or are your sites the same way?

Thanks.

[alias]

It depends on the type of your website, the target-public etc.
Since my statistics show that my sites are being visited by less than 1% with old browsers (e.g. IE5) - I don't bother for them.
You can't make everybody happy do you ;)

[salo]

The farthest I currently test is IE5, for my site 1 in a 1000 people have IE4...
The best I do for users of IE4 and below is code a message when the browser is recognized and put 'This site is not viewed very well with your current browser, please consider updating'
At least you've made an effort.

[nigassma]

I check back to IE5, and for mac if I feel the urge, I will check on IE5mac, but once you get used to what styles break where it makes it easy.

I like the noIE popup you can add to your site for IE6.0 users...

When exiting your site, visitors using Microsoft Internet Explorer 6.0 will be prompted to upgrade their browser. "noIE" is installed via a single style sheet inclusion, no other configuration is necessary.

[encyclo]

It sounds as if you have just about everything covered. I would recommend using the @import method for the stylesheet(s) as this will not be recognized by Netscape 4 or IE4, allowing the page to be displayed unstyled for those two browsers.

I like the noIE popup you can add to your site for IE6.0 users

I'm not sure I see the point. You will just be annoying your visitors with an unrequested popup about something they may not understand and almost certainly will not be interested in. Unless your site is specifically about web design or browsers, then you should just concentrate on maing it display correctly in the browsers your users choose to use. Don't confuse the issue - use your site to talk about your message or products, not about browser compatibility.

[matthewwithanm]

I would recommend using the @import method for the stylesheet(s) as this will not be recognized by Netscape 4 or IE4, allowing the page to be displayed unstyled for those two browsers.

A great suggestion, thanks. Since it's a mess in those browsers (but degrades gracefully), I might as well give them something they can use.

While we're on the subject, is there a way to block these browsers from displaying flash content?

[edited by: matthewwithanm at 7:15 pm (utc) on June 30, 2005]

[salo]

i remember seeing somewhere with the 'flash' problem fix when using @import (where your page first loads without the style, then all of a sudden switches to the stylesheet)
if anyone happens to find it / know it, send it my way :)

[matthewwithanm]

Google "FOUC."

There's a thread or two on this site about it as well.