Forum Moderators: skibum
Could You please advide me something here...
I'm feeling desparate...
I've wasted nearly $1000 in Adwords and didn't make a sale in almost any niche I've tried.
I've joined Shareasale some time ago and tried promoting various products, like Ipod cases, leather jackets etc.. I've tried over a dozen affiliate programs, but nothing worked. Even Clickbank merchants didn't work for me. I've tried pretty much the same amount of those too.
And my PPC campaings were targeted if You're thinking that I was driving non targeted traffic.
I've targeted 3 or 4 keyword phrases (very specific) to landing pages that were selling exactly what the keyword promised... After 150 clicks for each Ad group for all the products, I haven't made any money yet...
Now I wonder how can that be?
Did the best I could. My CTR was from 4% to 10% or so after 100 clicks for some campaigns...
So can I blame only landing pages here?
I mean, I did the best I could and got pretty good in making targeted campaigns and writing effective ads. Is thing normal that after more than 100 clicks to very specific landing pages, I didn't make a sale? Could the merchants be stealing money from me? Gees, I don't know what else to think...
I'm testing some products and services and see how those are doing in PPC. IF it's all fine, then I'm thinking about putting all the efforts into making better SEO, banner, link prmotion...
I think I've reached the situation when I really need some advice from real people about how to make it finally with Adwords and affiliate marketing...
I'm not asking for specific niches or something, but more I'd like to know how much conversions do you get for merchants (being an affiliate) out of 100 clicks for specific 3 or 4 word terms to specific landing pages? I mean, I can't think of anything more targeted and specific than that...
You have catch the buyer at the end of the buying process, otherwise they are going to delete the cookies, or click somewhere else
I use to do quite a bit of affilaite marketing via PPC and made some good side money off of it. Now SEO has become so difficult and G so difficult to figure out that its just not worth the effort anymore. The name of the game is building a real business with real profit margins now. Otherwise, your profit margins from aff marketing willnever allow you to compete!
Good luck
In shareasale, they have this EPC, which is how much you make from 100 visitors if I'm correct. Most companies I tried have this over $50. So that mean that out of every 100 visitors, I should make at least $50. So I can bid 0.50 cents a click. But even after 150 clicks from related (3 or more word phrases) I get no sales...
Maybe like Valleycommando suggested, I should get leads, not sales... There are many mortgage sites that offer $$ for leads, but it's competitive.
I've done a research earlier, discovered that one keyword according to Overture gets 8000 searches a month. That was a 4 word keyphrase. In Wordtracker, it said it's getting approximately 400 or so searches a day.
After some time, I got a top 1 ranking in MSN for that keyword alone with my blog and got as much as... 2 visitors a week. Yep, 2 visitors a week. 3 metric tools, including Google's Analytics told me that... Unbelievable...
Now, I've ordered 3 day WT trial some time ago, did a thorough research for a niche that I chose to promote. Found like over 20 keywords that have about 20 or more searches a day and less than 2 competing sites (when searched in quotes). I now have top spots in G. for 4 or 5 of those keywords and I get 4 or 10 searches a month... Even Wordtracker doesn't provide accurate results... That's a conclusion I can make after what I see...
So probably the best Affiliate marketer's model is to drive traffic to squeeze page, capture leads and redirect them to a merchants site. Even if I don't make money on a merchant, I'll have leads that I can promote to. but's extremely hard to do effectively. I have to stay up to date with those leads, provide them valuable content. If I build more than one list, it's even harder to write good and quality follow-up messages for each. Besides, I'm losing money upfront, and I'm never sure that I'll make money out of them later...
I'm thinking about creating an ebook about something I know... I know quite a lot about IM thing, but who the hell needs another internet marketing ebook. When there are top gurus for each niche, Adsense, Adwords, Resel Rights, SEO, etc. promoting not only ebooks, but DVD's... Who'll even pay atention to some new guy with another marketing ebook.
I could spend the last saved money on a writer to write an ebook on some totally different topic, like growing roses, knitting or similar, but not sure how people are buying ebooks in non-internet marketing niches...
So, if getting back to Adwords question, I believe that most people who're making money are the ones promoting their own business or products... But there are folks who're making million a year just from affiliate sales... Read an ebook written from one guy...
Maybe I should consider different AM concept? Instead of just putting link and banners, have a datafeed or sometihng like that. Probably arranging a deal with a merchant and selling products under my brand would be better, cause customers would assume I'm a big boy and would be ok buying from me... But I'm not sure how to approach merchants in setting up such a venture. I'd need some shopping cart and so on... Uhh. I'm just confused...
There's one merchant out there whose top affiliate made $15K last month for their program - and that's just on one product niche with one merchant. That affiliate no doubt does others also - and it's seriously doubtful that the traffic was acquired via organic SEO alone, if at all.
Think about keywords as how much information is contained in them. Does a keyword indicate that the consumer has done research on the product and knows what they want to purchase? Does it indicate they are familiar with a certain type of product(s) and are ready to buy one? The whole "long tail" thing has some merit to it but in the end it is really how much info or research and how much purchase intent is contained in the keyword regarless of how many characters or words are in it. Then, of course, does the marchant have a site that is designed to convert shoppers or just an online brochure that will cause people to bounce right out. The ad copy has to be right too. What highlights can you pull out - free shipping, huge selection, buy 1 get one free - that are backed up on the website landing page. Lots of stuff to think about and many variables to consider.
Of course, people don't always use those terms correctly.
Hunderdown, I type in Google "epc affiliate" and most sites say it's per 100 clicks. Sometimes, it's cosidered as per 1 click. But that would be $0.60 instead of $60 dollars or similar.
Skibum, thanx for help. I realize what You're saying. I've read some researches done about user's behavior and people do a basic research first and then use brand or similar terms to search for stuff to buy.
So after searching for "silver jewelry", people type in such terms as "man wedding silver ring" or something like that.. Or some brand name next to it.
But I've tried several brand names (those were mostly 2 word phrases) along with a kewyord, but still after 100 clicks or so to the merchant's site, I didn't get sales...
Try to stay away from the networks- CJ, Shareasale, Clickbank etc. Too much competition from everyone else in the mosh pit. Look for indie programs.
Look for specific products to promote with no more than 2500 searches per month- ideally 50-500, and less than 10 adwords ads on that keyword. You can get on the front page for the minimum bid, which on most of these types of words is less than 10 cents if you have a relevant landing page.
Do You actually have found such products to promote? Where did you start? In ebay category searches? Or just discovered from a more competitive and popular market digging in Overture or WT lists?
It's funny to see competitors come out of nowhere and start bidding on the same keywords for a few weeks, then drop out. If they only knew.
Lastly, I found these keywords researching conversion rates on natural keyword traffic I was getting. Then I took those keywords, and started using PPC traffic. Still making money using PPC on thosekeywords that I lost naturally a year ago..
The Networks scare me, badly. But I want to clone what I have now and keep cloning. Like 10 of my sites would be awesome. I couldnt bring them all up at once due to the cost, but I think I could do one a month.
Where can I find reliable products that aren't oversaturated? Is it best to make a individual website for each product line you have as an affiliate? Or could a one in all site do well? Like a page for each product, and Adwords going straight to that product line page.
I've realised that I did pretty much like what You've said. Sort of do the best campaign I can, by themeing keywords into targeted groups and then doing split testing ads. But after no sales, I just dropped out...
I'll definately try to keep on doing one thing and see how it goes. Funny, Yesterday I made a sale using affiliate PPC method.
I think I'll try CB, cause commission on physical products are just very low...
RhawnJ, I'm not sure if I'm good advisor here, but if Your merchant's site isn't an ecommerce store, then individual website pages would be the best I think... Just watched a video of "Project X" that recently boomed the web, and Chris (I think it's his name) sshowed that he made some great money by having a separate landing page for KE software. He'd spent 5 pounds, and made over $100 in sales per that day, if I'm correct...
I tried to promote KE before, but without any luck, just wasted money... I need to put more attention to the campaigns....
Anyway, thanx guys.
Will try to keep concentrating on very targeted and ready-to-buy traffic, and hope will make some positive ROI sooner or later...
KE - Keyword Elite (soft)
CB - Clickbank (aff network)
Now I'm trying to concentrate on very targeted keyword for some merchants and see how it goes.
Thanx for all the suggestions... I think my problems was that I didn't pay too close attention to my campaigns. Tried them out, no matter how good they seemed to me, but after no sales for over 100 clicks, I dropped. Now I realise that it's important to keep the campaign active for a longer time and do the absolute best at refining keywords and ads, until the CPC gets lower and the conversions actually increase.
Will keep trying different approaches until I find something that works though.
I'll concentrate more on clickbank products. It's definately easier to make money by getting 75% in commissions than 3% or 8% selling TV's or batteries...
Diversification is important, as people mentioned, but not just in products, but also in traffic sources. You need to do a lot of testing and expirementing.
Adwords is probably the toughest nut to crack. I would not encourage anyone to start out PPC affiliate marketing on adwords it is a recipe for losing money. Try some of the other offerings with Yahoo! and MSN or even some of the second/third tier search programs. You will be able to spend less and learn a lot. Once you have your feet on the ground and have tasted some success then you can tackle the more complex and involved adwords.
What kind of search programs are you talking about? Can you drop a few.. I don't know, names, if not URL's, please? Are blogs/community sites worth trying? I read about few adv.companies specializing in mediabuying in blogs, etc. but haven't done any deep research myself though I strongly believe that Adwords/OV/MSN are not the only ones when it comes to buying *real* traffic.
SEO is a challenge too as you can bet all the other affiliates of the merchant, plus the merchants competitors and their affiliates all wan't to be on the first page of the search engine too.
Customer Reciprocation should work well for you as an affiliate marketer. it won't make you a fortune but little steps count.
If you are going to pay for PPC traffic, you're going to spend every nickle you make on PPCmarketing.
Compared to many businesses, the variable operating costs can be high. But since PPC traffic can be paid for on credit, that's less of a barrier to entry than in many markets.
But they know their market and their keywords, and have become "experts" at using PPC, what to aim for, how to do it, and how much to spend.
Exactly. The analogy I've used elsewhere is that PPC affiliate marketing is like ice-skating; if you're doing it right, it looks effortless, but the reality is hard graft and there's no substitute for experience.
There's one merchant out there whose top affiliate made $15K last month for their program
There are many, many programmes paying far greater sums every month to multiple affiliates. But, as noted, there's a lot of strong competition.
Look for indie programs
This can work very well. But bear in mind that many lack the same level of tracking technology, reporting, transparency, tech support etc that you'll get with an established network.
Much of the advice suggested above is pretty good; you need to learn the PPC engines inside out, learn your niches, learn what makes a site (or affiliate programme) convert. It all comes down to experience, and there are few shortcuts. Many sites are simply pretty poor converters, meaning PPC is unlikely to be a scalable and cost effective way to drive traffic as an affiliate. Reasons might include:
- A prominent 1-800/0800 sales number
- Clunky ordering process
- Not price competitive
- Out of stock for key products
Think about what makes a site work (or otherwise), and you'll get to grips with what makes a site an affiliate programme a good converter.
Regarding your PPC campaigns, are they pre-qualifying traffic? Are you filtering out cheapskates, hucksters and fraudsters with appropriate negative keywords (eg, 'free', 'refund', 'warez')? Are you stressing the key Unique Selling Point (ie, in consumer electronics, users will be price sensitive; with second hand cars, follow up service might be the deal breaker). Are you sending traffic to the appropriate page (eg, relevant product page, not the homepage)?
BTW, you may wish to avoid CJ initially for their unforgiving payment terms; many other networks will pay faster. Cash flow will likely become an issue sooner rather than later if you have any level of success.
At the moment I'm trying to sell ClickBank products, by driving very targeted traffic to the sales page directly just to see what works.
Out of some of the better sales pages and products, I got only 1 sale, but it was 4 days ago. Quite frustrating to see those zeros in CB account...
I'll try this method for a while, or until I'll have just a few hundred dollars left and then maybe I'll think about some kind of my own product...
I can't imagine how those super affiliate are raking in $15,000 a month in networks. In SAS - Shareasale, they pay like 5% to 20% commissions. No matter what product I've tried there is competitive and even with the most targeted traffic, I get no sales...
There's definately SEO playing the major role I think... I'll probably try this affiliate/clickbank method for a while, but if it doesn't work, I'll definately think of some kind of my own product, cause it's very frustrating... I heard some people sell 15 or 20 page reports for like $20 or $30 bucks... Maybe this will work for a specific niche...
