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How to terminate publishers...

...with tact, poise, and kindness

         

mysterynme

4:48 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



I appreciate our publishers' hard work but can't afford to keep working with some of them. How do I tell them?

We now have custom backend reporting which enables us to identify the cost-effectiveness of specific publishers within CJ. We always knew that some publishers were obviously more or less targeted, but until now we didn't know how individual publishers affected the program.

We now clearly see how much certain publishers cost (ouch!) and how much others contribute. There are of course many that fall comfortably in the middle, but I am concerned here with the two extremes.

The very targeted, profitable publishers deserve a much higher commission, but in order to pay them and keep our own costs in line, we need to let go of the very low-end publishers.

Any suggestions on how to do this gracefully?

Drastic

5:36 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



I'd just be honest, it's just business after all.

Explain how the costs outweigh their production. Give some details of what your costs are. The ones that won't understand that won't understand any other reasoning anyway.

mat_bastian

6:36 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



I get nervous whenever I see people saying something like, "We have some profitability tracking software and it's clear some of the publishers are costing us money. Clearly the bottom line should come first, but is it possible that the whole of your organization is worth more than the sum of its parts? Not sure if I got the cliche correct, but what I'm trying to say is that in a team environment, often times the indirect contribution of those who appear to be underperforming according to the software is not easily quantified.

They flesh out the site and help keep it current and that has to hold some value even if it doesn't directly translate into dollars. It may well indirectly help convert.

Perhaps a redistribution of the monetary pot is in order but maybe firing them will have an unexpected impact that software can't predict.

[edited by: mat_bastian at 7:13 pm (utc) on April 14, 2003]

mat_bastian

6:42 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



edited due to totally misreading the thread.

[edited by: mat_bastian at 7:37 pm (utc) on April 14, 2003]

buckworks

6:56 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Administrator 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



It would be nice for publishers to receive some warning that this is in the works, rather than just getting a "You've been dropped" note.

Be sure to allow for the possibility that a seemingly-unproductive publisher might be working on things that WILL be productive, but it takes time to do the keyword research, make pages, get them indexed, etc.

I'd be interested to hear you say more about your costs, etc. and why some affiliates are a drain on resources. Can a small affiliate who sends a small amount of traffic be benignly ignored without increasing your expenses? How would that compare with someone who makes sales but has to send zillions and zillions of visitors to do it?

As a publisher, it would be useful to have a better understanding of that. I sometimes sign up for merchants but it takes a while to generate any results for them.

buckworks

7:19 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Administrator 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



I think some of the folks posting in this thread are not quite understanding the question. I think Mysterynme is talking about CJ publishers ... websites "out there" who are their affiliates.

It's not fun to be dropped by a CJ merchant (don't ask how I know that) but to call it a wrenching experience or equate it to being fired is over-dramatizing, I'd say!

mysterynme

7:29 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



That's a great point, buckworks. The problem isn't with their production, it's with the quality of leads they send. We allow customers to either pay up front or be billed later. We pay a sale commission for paid orders and a lead commission for bill-me-later orders.

We know a good portion of the bill-me-laters won't pay after billing them for 5-7 months, and we foot the cost for the billing and free gifts they receieve. This isn't a problem because overall, we receive enough payup for the program to work.

What we didn't know until now was how wide the gap was between the different publishers, because all we had was a generic payup percent for CJ as a whole.

The targeted publishers send leads that pay up at good to excellent rates, the untargeted publishers run "freebie" sites and it turns out the payup is dismal at best.

I would like to reward those targeted publishers, set up great incentives for them. But with untargeted publishers sending orders that significantly pull down our payup rates, I don't have much flexibility to do that.

It simply isn't smart business to keep rewarding these publishers - especially at the expense of relevant, targeted publishers.

mat_bastian

7:29 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



oops, didn't realize it was that... I thought it was like firing people with a full time gig. Sorry for the drama.

mysterynme

7:37 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



<smile> No problem... You know, I just want to be decent about this - especially since most of these guys have been sending orders for close to a year.

Before I do anything, I thought it would be good to get some publisher-perspective feedback...

sullen

8:06 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



mysterymne -

If I were you I would simply change the way your programme works. I would pay a lot less (even nothing) for leads, but start to pay the percentage on leads that actually pay up. Perhaps also pay a higher percentage.

I always wonder why people have pay-per-lead programmes in the first place when they are so open to abuse. Some affiliates are losing you money through no fault of their own, agreed. And as a freebie-affiliate-site owner I know that visitors to those sites rarely buy anything. But I bet some, are, shall we say, milking the system (even if only by having a notice which says "PLEASE KEEP THIS SITE FREE" or whatever).

By changing the programme your good affiliates should be able to work out that they would be better off (or no worse off), but the not so good ones would leave of their own accord.

But anyway, in answer to your question, I run a freebie site with affiliate programmes (that make next to nothing!), and I would not be offended if a merchant dropped me. A polite email would be good, but I would be a little bit wary of giving advance notice, as you may find you get a lot of non-paying orders from the publishers' friends/family as a result.

Not very trusting am I? I of course would never take advantage of an affiliate scheme. :)

hannamyluv

8:09 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



Not that we have an affiliate program yet, but I think that a 30 day warning would be a good thing. A quick note letting them know about their under performance and that if the numbers don't improve in the next 30 days, you will have to drop them.

It isn't to spare any feelings. It's more of a wakeup call to them. They may not even know that they are sending you bad traffic. If they can improve it, you win and they win. If not, they may take the hint and drop off themselves or you can drop them after the 30 days.

watercrazed

8:10 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



As a new publisher, I have a few ideas, take them with a grain of salt.

Long term go to manual authorization, ie. pre qualify them based on if their offer's focus on the free gifts or on the products.

Short term - explain the problem with the focus on free gifts vs. products and even a sample of their monthly payup rate verus your average, maybe send them a sample page with appropriate focus. Drop the worst, with an offer to reinstate if they are interested in changing their approach.

The moderate offenders, put on notice say 60 to 90 days to adjust their approach. They will need some time to implement changes and develop a more stable customer segment.

The mild offenders let them know you are watching, their payup rate versus the average or target rate and offer to provide them with suggestions to improve.

If it does not complicate your model to much maybe your existing publishers know that at a future date a sliding scale commission base on payup rate will be implemented.

nativenewyorker

10:35 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Debra:

Some merchants have a clause in their affiliate agreements that prohibit websites that drive incentivized traffic. Such traffic tends to result in low quality leads. Given that you do not have that implemented, you should give it some serious consideration.

It is surprising that your company compensates for leads. The majority of affiliate programs paying for leads are companies in financial services and companies that sell expensive items that are not impulse purchases, such as autos and real estate. Why not also consider abandoning the lead program altogether and just pay publishers for paid subscriptions? You can still let publishers promote the "bill me later" idea, but only pay them when they actually convert to a paid sale. This is instead of the current situation of either compensation for sales or leads.

Ted

[edited by: nativenewyorker at 11:01 pm (utc) on April 14, 2003]

buckworks

10:59 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Administrator 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



Knowing more about it now, I'd agree with what Ted just said. Reward what works for you, and stop rewarding what doesn't. Stop paying for leads (or at least drastically reduce the payment), raise the payment for completed orders, and I'd bet the affiliates would sort themselves out.

mysterynme

11:27 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



That's a good suggestion and one we've considered. But let's say we pay only for sales and remove the bill-me option from the landing page. While this may deter untargeted publishers from running the offer, I believe it severely undercuts the commission potential for targeted publishers.

We all know it's much harder to get a customer to plunk down their credit card after clicking on an offer, than it is to get them to try a risk-free trial offer.

Don't you think we'd be doing the targeted publishers an injustice by making it even harder for them to earn commissions? And how would they feel if we suddenly yanked the lead program out from under their feet? I'm not sure that would help them make more money.

nativenewyorker

11:50 pm on Apr 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Debra:

I was not suggesting that you drop the "bill me later" lure for customers. Instead you should drop the payment of leads. Tell your publishers that you will pay them when those signups become paid subscribers. That will encourage your publishers to drive quality traffic to you.

What percentage of referals are immediate sales vs. bill me later leads? Perhaps, raising the commission for outright sales will offset the losses by publishers from eliminating their lead generation activities.

Ted

mysterynme

12:03 am on Apr 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Oh yes, I see what you mean. We get about 10% sale, 90% leads, but now that we know payup by individual publisher, I suppose we can work out a way credit commissions as payments come in.

Do you think the publishers will be put off by having their lead commissions cut and then having to wait anywhere from 2-6 months for payup commissions?

buckworks

12:07 am on Apr 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Administrator 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



If the "bill me" option works for your customers, keep it!

Can lead fees be changed for individual affiliates the same way commissions can? That might be a way to approach this. If your general offer was less for leads and more for paid orders, you could tweak individual affiliates' lead fees to make sure that those who send quality traffic maintain or increase their earnings.

I don't know enough about CJ's merchant service fees to know if they'd be an issue, but it would make reasonable sense from the affiliate side as long as your top performers knew about that part of the plan when the changes were announced.

mysterynme

12:19 am on Apr 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



buckworks, yes. And that is how I was hoping to restructure the program. Terminate low-payup publishers and increase the lead commission for the rest based on the level of payup their orders generate. Varying lead amounts is an available option in CJ.

Some of them will see significant increases in their lead commission, and it seems this would be better received than being paid when the customer decides to write the check.