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Yahoo Search Engine and Directory Forum

    
Yahoo Directory - Poor PR Values
Has the Directory Structure Changed Recently?
cabbagehead

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 6:16 am on May 30, 2007 (gmt 0)

I was just checking for my link in the Yahoo directory and I found that the main page of each section has a strong PR5, but in my section when you hit the 'next' button on the pagination to go to page 2, it drops to a PR1, and pages 3-10 are PR0. Yikes!

Looks like that $300 link was worthless, unless I stay on the main page after the "new" designation goes away....or unless the new structure just needs to be crawled etc. :(

 

martinibuster

WebmasterWorld Administrator martinibuster us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 7:49 am on May 30, 2007 (gmt 0)

Passing the review process of the Yahoo directory says something positive about a website. The toolbar doesn't reflect that.

austtr

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 7:27 am on May 31, 2007 (gmt 0)

I recently spent quite some time looking at suitable pay for inclusion directories for placing client sites.

In the majority of cases, a directory with a PR4 or more home page would show zero PR just one level down. It seemed to be too consistent to be accidental and left me with the impression that directories might be receiving some special treatment when it comes to PR display on the toolbar.

I have no idea if that is plausible.... just an observation based on what I was seeing at the time.

cabbagehead

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 6:56 pm on May 31, 2007 (gmt 0)

Yeah, I'm not sure what the deal is ... but interal pages on yahoo directory use to generally be at least a PR3.

Nice to know what we're spending so darn much money on inclusion for. :(

Rumbas

WebmasterWorld Administrator 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 7:06 pm on May 31, 2007 (gmt 0)

Read very care fully what martinibuster said. It's all in the trust of getting past a Yahoo editor. TrustRank anyone? ;)

cabbagehead

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 7:05 am on Jun 2, 2007 (gmt 0)

Hmm. I think I hear what you're saying. Thanks...

steveb

WebmasterWorld Senior Member steveb us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 12:48 am on Jun 3, 2007 (gmt 0)

The linking did change a lot a few months ago, so PR is down. There used to be multiple links from the main yahoo.com page but no more.

oziman

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 8:08 am on Jun 3, 2007 (gmt 0)

Yahoo! isn't about the pr, it's about the trust.

matrix_neo

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 10:45 am on Jun 4, 2007 (gmt 0)

Yahoo! isn't about the pr, it's about the trust.

I think this could be another myth. Or atleast not as much as every one thinks here. Because I think getting past the yahoo editor is much more easier than domoz editor. I never heard anyone saying getting past the yahoo editor is difficult. Just my 2 cents.

oziman

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 11:26 am on Jun 4, 2007 (gmt 0)

Google tells you to submit into Yahoo! The reason most SEO people spend the $299 to get into Yahoo is because it passes on some basic trust in terms of the engines. same goes for business.com.. who buys a business.com link for the traffic?

The Contractor

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 11:31 am on Jun 4, 2007 (gmt 0)

I think this could be another myth. Or atleast not as much as every one thinks here.

I tend to agree. Why do Yahoo editors see fit to include sites for free at times, yet those same sites are banned/penalized in Yahoo search? Seems kind of unrealistic to believe that Google would/should trust the Yahoo directory, when Yahoo search division doesn't.

[edited by: The_Contractor at 11:32 am (utc) on June 4, 2007]

centime

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 11:55 am on Jun 4, 2007 (gmt 0)

Why is TBPR the sole reason for getting a yahoo directory listing?

Can anyone here visualise going up to yahoo an demanding to know why the TBPR on the internal pages is not up to expectation,,

or

perhaps ask some one over at google why yahoo directory internal TBPR is not up to demand

Submission to yahoo directory or Yahoo search , or Yahoo services really has to bee seen from yahoo's view point.

They give you their stamp of approval, a stamp as valued in the internet community as a dmoz listing,

How google , gigabot, ask, msn et al decide to value that yahoo mark of approval is a matter for them.

Yahoo directory, IMHO, remains a directory to aspire to for listing, if you can afford it

maximillianos

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 12:29 pm on Jun 4, 2007 (gmt 0)

Yahoo's directory is a revenue stream... not a quality test. That is why the fee is annual... so it can be a building and reoccurring revenue stream.

I don't pay for my new sites to get added. Waste of money in my opinion. They are just one link, and a paid one at that!

I think everyone should submit their site to Yahoo's free index inclusion request. But in my opinion... pass on the directory.

matrix_neo

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 1:21 pm on Jun 4, 2007 (gmt 0)

Yahoo's directory is a revenue stream

I agree. Few sites got included with $299 submission after the the domz's rejection.

justablink

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 2:28 pm on Jun 4, 2007 (gmt 0)

Yahoo's directory is a revenue stream... not a quality test. That is why the fee is annual

Well, in the good ol' days, you paid once, canceled your recurring charge, but still show up - pay once and you are done. I paid once in 2002 for one of my sites, and I'm still in the directory. This still holds true for several of my clients.

Martinibuster is spot on; it's a trust issue.

Traffic from the directory is nil. Every new or redesign I'm involved in, the Y! directory is an automatic decision, but not for the traffic, and certainly not for one inbound link. Trust is the answer.

As for using the toolbar PR to monitor Y! results, it's a bit of an oxymoron, don't you think? That little green bar's value "factors in link structure and many other variables" as G says. So, the real value here again is trust.
justablink

adfree

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 2:37 pm on Jun 4, 2007 (gmt 0)

It's different when your site got grandfathered. Nowadays they kick you days after expiration.

seoArt

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 2:43 pm on Jun 4, 2007 (gmt 0)

I've always felt that the value of a Yahoo listing depends on many factors.

1. The category you are listed under.
- How relative is the category to the keywords you want to show up for?
- How many other sites are in the category?
- Is there a high likelihood that your site will be buried on the second or subsequent page of results?
- Is it a "top-level" category, or will the site be buried in a category so deep that its significance will be less to users and search engines.
- PageRank of the category (although not necessarily THE deciding factor, should be considered)

2. How will Yahoo list your site? Will the title be relevant to the keywords you want to show up for in the search engines? If not, you may want to skip Yahoo.

I have a few good Yahoo listings that have been very worthwhile, one that even gets good natural traffic from the directory. But I've had others that were worthless, where my link was buried on the 10th page of results for its category.

You always want to consider the value of a directory listing based upon how good it is for the user, as well as the search engines, and most of the time these two factors go hand in hand.

[edited by: seoArt at 2:45 pm (utc) on June 4, 2007]

caveman

WebmasterWorld Senior Member caveman us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 4:22 pm on Jun 4, 2007 (gmt 0)

martinibuster doesn't waste time or words when he makes posts like that. People who really want to understand should do some digging on Trust Rank and also the various reasons for, and changes wrought by, the roll-out of Big Daddy.

woop01

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 4:55 pm on Jun 4, 2007 (gmt 0)

The ironic thing is it appears that inclusion in the Yahoo Directory helps more with trust in Google than Yahoo.

Yahoo is more than happy to list sites in their directory for $299/year that were banned in their index many owners ago.

lgn1

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 10:11 pm on Jun 4, 2007 (gmt 0)

It's different when your site got grandfathered. Nowadays they kick you days after expiration.

If you have a quality site with good content, and you revoke your credit card before they can automatically recharge you after the year is up, you are basically grandfathered. because Yahoo will not remove quality sites from its directory.

If your site has no unique content, then yes they will probably revoke your listing, so once again content is king.

Anybody with this experience?

Also, my understanding, is that the PR on the first page is distributed amonst the remaining pages in that category, since Yahoo serves the entire category to Google as one page, and only divides it up into 20 listings per page for the user (sort of reverse cloaking).

So if Yahoo has 90 listings in a category, with a PR4 then that PR4 is spread amounst the 90 listings, not just the first 20.

SEOPTI

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 10:23 pm on Jun 4, 2007 (gmt 0)

I can tell you a Yahoo Directory listing won't help you in any way, it does not help with -30 filter and with -950 filter. It is really 100% worthless.

blend27

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 3:46 am on Jun 5, 2007 (gmt 0)

It is not the value of directory, its the value of other people linking to you based on your ability to fork out the "2 nai ni" and how others interpret it, which in turn generates one way links from webmasters that value your commitments be listed in recognized directory.

I rented a spot in 2003-2004(got denied on the first try, but got it later). took about 3-4 month to build up backlinks(back then). Got bumped to #2 for #1 searched term. at one time site ranked even as #1 for 2 month or so, but then the big scraper network got taken down, so did the backlinks.

There were bunch of SMBs that I exchanged links with based on the fact, most of us are slightly enjoing the top spots these days and trafic from each other.

I am still at #2. I have the content and widgets to back it up.

oh BTW, 0 traffic from it back them....

oziman

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 7:31 am on Jun 5, 2007 (gmt 0)

I think we can summarize it like this:

In terms of Toolbar PR, traffic, Yahoo rankings or any overt effect, it's worthless.

In terms of putting trust into new domains, acquired domains, etc, I think it's worth the money.

hairycoo

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 12:34 pm on Jun 8, 2007 (gmt 0)

Ok so in terms of PR, Yahoo Directory is worthless but in order to benefit from any trust, Google must at least crawl the page your website is listed on (in my category, the 2nd and 3rd pages are not cached).

Can anyone tell me whether helping Google crawl the page where my website is will have any effect (placing links from my own sites to Yahoo)?

steveb

WebmasterWorld Senior Member steveb us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 9:11 pm on Jun 8, 2007 (gmt 0)

The yahoo directory isn't worthless in terms of PR. That's silly. It's as valuable as any other pages with the same PR.

nzmatt

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 5:55 pm on Jun 10, 2007 (gmt 0)

Paid links are supposed to be worthless...

lgn1

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 3:41 pm on Jun 11, 2007 (gmt 0)

Yahoo is not a paid link. It's a pay for consideration or pay for review.

nzmatt

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 9:43 am on Jun 13, 2007 (gmt 0)

Semantics. On that rational every paid link is ‘pay for consideration or pay for review’ because a site selling links won’t just link to anysite. I agree, however, that Yahoo maybe more picky than most.

The difference is that Yahoo is a big player (as is Google) and as we all know the rules are different for big players because they have the ‘pull’ and they have more trust. This is the key difference.

bw3ttt

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 4:34 am on Jun 15, 2007 (gmt 0)

<quote>Paid links are supposed to be worthless... </quote>

Directories which charge for inclusion are the exception..

austtr

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3353143 posted 11:08 pm on Jun 20, 2007 (gmt 0)

bw3ttt..

Do you know that to be a fact? There has been some conjecture on this and to the best of my knowledge there has been nothing from Google to confirm it.

A Yahoo or BOTW may be treated as authority directories but there are a gazillion crappy directories out there where the review fee is just a way of camouflaging payment for a link.

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