| 5:29 pm on Oct 10, 2006 (gmt 0)|
The casino's are losing money due to online gambling and the government profiting from a percentage of that revenue is cleaning house online.
[edited by: trillianjedi at 11:08 am (utc) on Oct. 11, 2006]
[edit reason] I appreciate it's tricky in a thread like this, but let's steer away from politics. [/edit]
| 6:20 pm on Oct 10, 2006 (gmt 0)|
I am for online gaming and the legalization of gambling everywhere. Gambling is a voluntary transaction between a person and a casino. I don't see why or how it should involve the government, even on the basis that gambling can be addictive.
The addiction arguement could be essentially applied to everything:
A person is addicted to shopping, outlaw shopping
A person is addicted to alcohol, outlaw drinking
ad infinitum until we have a totalitarian state.
IMHO, what really should be outlawed is: Cable company monopolies, tariffs, social security, and scores of other useless government entities and people who depend on the government for their income <snip>
[edited by: trillianjedi at 11:07 am (utc) on Oct. 11, 2006]
[edit reason] See above [/edit]
| 7:00 pm on Oct 10, 2006 (gmt 0)|
Exactly, it's time people took responsibility into their own hands so us with half-a-brain can market services and wares to them. Ah...you have to love the weak-minded.
[edited by: trillianjedi at 11:07 am (utc) on Oct. 11, 2006]
| 7:10 pm on Oct 10, 2006 (gmt 0)|
I just find it interesting that they aren't banning betting on horse races or lotteries, it's the online casinos. Instead of regulating it, they just ban it. Either you ban everything or nothing. Horse races can easily be fixed whether it be through drugging a horse or the Breeder's Cup PickSix scam from a few years ago. Either ban it all or regulate it all.
| 7:47 pm on Oct 10, 2006 (gmt 0)|
|I just find it interesting that they aren't banning betting on horse races or lotteries, it's the online casinos. Instead of regulating it, they just ban it. Either you ban everything or nothing. Horse races can easily be fixed whether it be through drugging a horse or the Breeder's Cup PickSix scam from a few years ago. Either ban it all or regulate it all. |
What I find interesting is that the us goverment wants to put the onus of enforcement onto the banks. The banks are saying they won't do the enforcing because of the huge cost.
Small details like:
Where is the master list to lookup companies that CC can't transfer funds to?
Who maintains this list?
How do they deal with rolling company names?
None of these items have been discussed and the banks say the answer is not them. It is an administrative nightmare to figure out and maintain such a list.
Also for the US Internet money transfer companies this is going to be bad as they are bound to this law where other transfer companies who reside elsewhere are not. I forsee many americans putting money in some out of country transfer company and then having that company transfer the funds to their gambling account will still be just as easy but will cut out American businesses from the action. Will they then make it illegal to use their CC to put money in any transfer company that doesn't comply with their law. And who keeps that list.... and so on.
Internet gambling has always been illegal in the USA just not enforceable, well now they have some bill they ca point to and say "See we are doing something to stop it" when really there isn't much they can do.
I read a canned letter from a large poker site, one of the first and largest, and they are saying they will have ways for Americans to play real money games and not to worry.
[edited by: trillianjedi at 11:09 am (utc) on Oct. 11, 2006]
| 7:49 pm on Oct 10, 2006 (gmt 0)|
Interesting enough Europe might go the opposite direction;
France, Italy and Austria will this week be formally censured by the European Commission for restrictive laws on gambling, the latest move in the fierce global battle between governments and private sports betting and gambling companies...
EU nations face censure over curbs on gambling [msnbc.msn.com]
| 9:36 pm on Oct 10, 2006 (gmt 0)|
Just for the record it's not the casino's fighting this, they would love to get in on internet gambling. In fact, the Nevada congressmen (most obviously casino friendly politicians) voted against this.
| 10:58 pm on Oct 10, 2006 (gmt 0)|
I thought I'd link to this thread of mine from 8 months ago when Italy began hitting back at online gambling (for their own benefit of course)
Italian State Blocks Gambling Sites
| 11:01 pm on Oct 10, 2006 (gmt 0)|
I received an email today from my host advising me that as they were based in USA they would be shutting me down if I had an online gambling site on their servers.
| 7:29 am on Oct 11, 2006 (gmt 0)|
reason is that they are having difficulties accounting online gambling revenues and collecting taxes from the gambling site owners,,
| 9:08 am on Oct 11, 2006 (gmt 0)|
I think these companies are exiting because they expect to apply for some type of US license in the not too distant future.
If they have no US presence, they aren't subject to US law. Besides, this new law doesn't make any type of gambling illegal that wasn't illegal before. So, why else be bothered by it on the other side of the world?
[edited by: trillianjedi at 11:15 am (utc) on Oct. 11, 2006]
| 11:18 am on Oct 11, 2006 (gmt 0)|
Guys - I appreciate that it's nigh on impossible to avoid politics altogether in a thread of this nature, so we can cut a little slack with that rule, but that's on the basis that comments are necessary, sensible and non-confrontational please.
| 12:19 pm on Oct 11, 2006 (gmt 0)|
I think people are bothered by it because someone was arrested.
Previously, it was all megabucks, offshore companies and big flotations.
Now it's more 'real world'. Smell the fear.
The unseen subtext is that, contrary to what many people think (including radical Islamists) America is a very conservative country.
It doesn't like crooked businessmen of any stripe (Enron et al), and it certainly doesn't like gambling.
| 1:41 pm on Oct 11, 2006 (gmt 0)|
IMO, the ban has to do with protectionism, and USA is not alone in this; all states engage in it up to a certain point.
If you are a US citizen, I would still check with a lawyer, god knows what they put in the bill...for all we know they probably made it illegal to handle that money, or even be an exec or employee of such business (regardless of location).
| 2:10 pm on Oct 11, 2006 (gmt 0)|
Yikes, another way to export a profitable business plan and where the US makes less and produces less business.
| 2:35 pm on Oct 11, 2006 (gmt 0)|
Remember in November.
| 3:57 pm on Oct 11, 2006 (gmt 0)|
|I think people are bothered by it because someone was arrested. |
Sure, but those people were on US soil and also involved with online sports gambling. The US justice department says that online casinos are covered by the Wire Act, but courts have held that the language in the Wire Act only applies to sports gambling. If it applied to online casino games, there wouldn't have been people trying unsuccessfully to pass another law for the last six years.
I agree with you that such arrests might make a few executives shaky, but the arrests came under different circumstances and different laws. I don't think anyone has ever tried an extradition for a Wire Act violation, but I could be wrong.
| 11:59 am on Oct 12, 2006 (gmt 0)|
> If they have no US presence, they aren't subject to US law.
try telling that to the two heads of British online gaming firms who have been hauled off planes by the feds in recent weeks. If you go anywhere near the US then you have to be aware of the laws there. That includes the possibility that your flight from London to Mexico may have to divert to the US due to a technical problem.
| 1:44 am on Oct 14, 2006 (gmt 0)|
I just tried to sit down at my favorite online poker parlor this evening to relax a little and play a few nickel hold 'em hands - No longer possible! #*$!?!?!
It seems that the poker site I frequent has decided to quit allowing US citizens to fund their accounts. Okay.... so I try to sit down and play with the measly $17 I have in my account - no go! As a Nevada resident, I can't even sit down at the tables!
I'm so furious over this I can barely see straight! Not mad at the poker site, of course (they don't like the situation either), but the US politicians who have decided its time to chip away at our constitutional rights. I'm with the fellow who said to "remember in November". The U.S. is rapidly becoming something the founding fathers never would have approved of. It's time to take back our country and throw the whole lot of them out of office next election.
| 11:10 am on Oct 14, 2006 (gmt 0)|
Party Poker has also blocked all players with US addresses or banks as of Friday morning.
Bit of a pain for me as I am not a US resident or citizen but was using a US bank.
| 4:50 pm on Oct 16, 2006 (gmt 0)|
Why gamble when you can code? :)
| 6:08 pm on Oct 16, 2006 (gmt 0)|
|Why gamble when you can code? :) |
There's no adrenalin in coding :-)
| 6:16 pm on Oct 16, 2006 (gmt 0)|
I prefer forex daytrading over online gambling, more fun less restrictions :)
| 9:40 pm on Oct 16, 2006 (gmt 0)|
I guess there is a "piece" of truth in coldfused's post...offline casinos can be the ones really interetsed in that law
| 7:33 am on Oct 21, 2006 (gmt 0)|
|There's no adrenalin in coding :-) |
Says you! :-P
| 8:33 am on Oct 21, 2006 (gmt 0)|
Go to the track, or find the local runner and watch the newspaper. Plenty of adrenalin. :)