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Directories+exact match domains
wheel




msg:4325914
 1:35 pm on Jun 14, 2011 (gmt 0)

Not sure I have a point here other than sitting around waiting for white hat stuff to work in Google can be rather pointless.

I own an exact match domain .com. An affiliate type company/reseller owns the same domain but .org.

Google just reshuffled the results for this search term, vaulting the .org to the #1 spot. My .com has been sitting at #11 for months, no change.

They have roughly 100-150 backlinks. 100% of those backlinks are from paid blog posts and directories. Anchor text is all exact match.

My backlinks consist entirely of other 'real' sites in the niche. i.e. they're all from live retailers in my niched, potentially my competitors. I got every backlink through existing relationships + a phone call - i.e. they're about as white hat and ontopic as could be; they'll pass any hand review. Have about 10-20 of these backlinks.

While I expect that I will eventually overtake them (and when I do, it will be effectively permanently), the white hat techniques are cold comfort while they're seeing 5 conversions a day and I'm getting maybe 1-2 a week.

What would you do? Continue building white hat ontopic links, one every month or so? Or spark up a $1K blog/directory buy and overtake them that way?

 

harsh2k218




msg:4325995
 4:32 pm on Jun 14, 2011 (gmt 0)

You need to consider contextual link building from blogpost, articles, press release and directory submission can help you a lot if you target 200 directory submission per day.

wheel




msg:4326004
 4:41 pm on Jun 14, 2011 (gmt 0)

you target 200 directory submission per day.

lol. Uuuuuhhhh, no.

Planet13




msg:4326031
 4:58 pm on Jun 14, 2011 (gmt 0)

They have roughly 100-150 backlinks. 100% of those backlinks are from paid blog posts and directories. Anchor text is all exact match.


The problem with this is, of course, while they are at number 1, they are probably getting natural, unsolicited links, by simply being at number 1 (if their content is any good at all).

Also, for what it's worth, they will be getting whatever social media love their is out there for that niche (facebook likes, etc).

I really don't know and lamenting sort of the same thing in my niche...

I think you should have at least a couple of directory submissions though. Just a handful with your site's name in them. Maybe it won't help with raising your page rank but maybe google thinks a diversified link profile will at least contain three or four directory listings.

Hoople




msg:4326086
 7:09 pm on Jun 14, 2011 (gmt 0)

I would add a few high quality directory links from the many that are available.

    A few (<3) links in niche / industry specific directories.

    A few (<3) links in directories having a large ammount of links in your niche's area.

    A few (<3) links in a regional directories in the sub category matching the site's chosen location. (Country - State - city/county).
With the number of links you presently have I wouldn't go beyond that. I would space these link placements out over time to not trip a non natural linking penalty. DMOZ and BOTW are also options but likely will not drive any visitors.

Your existing links are all top notch - adding some more 'pedestrian' quality links (but still valuable - not spam) will hopefully get G to give your site some link love in the SERPS.

Planet13




msg:4326238
 4:21 am on Jun 15, 2011 (gmt 0)

Your existing links are all top notch - adding some more 'pedestrian' quality links (but still valuable - not spam) will hopefully get G to give your site some link love in the SERPS.


I wonder if in the case of the original poster whether it might be a good idea to get a few nofollow links as well, just to keep things balanced?

While they won't flow page rank, they will at least fill out the link profile. I think that google would be a little suspicious if ALL the inbound links were dofollow links.

I guess the important thing is to figure out on the web, as a whole, what is the ratio of nofollow links to dofollow links (Matt Cutts said there were way more dofollow than nofollow links, but that might have changed since he said that). Probably it would be good to have a ration of nofollow to dofollow links that mirrors the web as a whole.

Also, I wonder if nofollow links from relevant sites might not possibly add to the "authority" of a domain. I remember a video where Matt Cutts said that nofollow links "don't pass much page rank." Maybe it was just a goof on MC's part, or maybe there is something to nofollow links.

piatkow




msg:4326332
 10:04 am on Jun 15, 2011 (gmt 0)

Don't forget the possibility that they might simply have a better designed site that the googlebot sees as being more relevant to the search arguements.

IanTurner




msg:4327372
 2:49 pm on Jun 17, 2011 (gmt 0)

What are the comparative ages of the domains?

wheel




msg:4327383
 2:59 pm on Jun 17, 2011 (gmt 0)

The .org was reg'ed in 2009. I picked up the .com about 9 months ago on a drop.

I still can't believe I picked up the domain on a drop. I can't believe that I even noticed it was up for a drop (I don't watch these things, I was just browsing the industry seeing who owned what). And I can't believe someone let this drop. The domain is hot enough that I've considered changing my company name to match the keywords.

IanTurner




msg:4327396
 3:20 pm on Jun 17, 2011 (gmt 0)

My view is that is where your issue lies - exact match domains are taking some time to get up the SERPs these days - they seem to eventually get there but it is a case of waiting.

wheel




msg:4327397
 3:24 pm on Jun 17, 2011 (gmt 0)

Well, I'm never in a rush. I keep throwing a link or two at it every month or so. It'll get there.

Panthro




msg:4327399
 3:26 pm on Jun 17, 2011 (gmt 0)

Not from what I've seen. I'm sure it has a lot to do with what niche you're in, but I see EMD's getting up fast and sticking.

IanTurner




msg:4327408
 3:42 pm on Jun 17, 2011 (gmt 0)

Are you sure you're seeing exact match built from scratch Panthro or could you be talking about people 301'ing an existing site to an exact match - the effects of which I haven't had chance to test.

Panthro




msg:4327410
 3:47 pm on Jun 17, 2011 (gmt 0)

I'm talking about EMD's built from scratch on a single domain. I can't speak to directory-type sites, specifically, but most of the sites I work with are hand-built EMDs and I remember being surprised at the speed at which they jump to the top. I'm not so surprised anymore because I'm used to seeing it, but it's still happening (at least from what I can see).

Planet13




msg:4327490
 6:29 pm on Jun 17, 2011 (gmt 0)

@ Panthro:

..but most of the sites I work with are hand-built EMDs and I remember being surprised at the speed at which they jump to the top.


Can I ask what the competitiveness of those niches are? And are those sites getting a lot of supportive link development as well? or do you think they are ranking solely / primarily on the basis of having an exact match domain?

Panthro




msg:4327538
 7:53 pm on Jun 17, 2011 (gmt 0)

I think competition is relative, but I don't work with "handbags" on an international level or anything like that (If you want to PM me, I'll show you my niche if you show me yours ;). My competition in regards to these sites is about 40% local, 60% big sites that are not local. And I'd say my sites have about equal or less link development as the local guys and way less than the big guys. When there is less competition, they rank solely on the basis of EMD. When there is a lot of competition, it only helps. I have also seen them rank very well without any link development at all, but usually when there is little competition for those exact KWs.

Tanith




msg:4327551
 8:35 pm on Jun 17, 2011 (gmt 0)

I'd say that was pretty much what I see Panthro - The more competition there is the longer it takes for EMD to have its effect. If the content on the EMD is good enough it will make it in time.

Tanith




msg:4327554
 8:42 pm on Jun 17, 2011 (gmt 0)

P.S. I've seen quite a number of EMDs bomb recently due to crap content.

adder




msg:4328675
 10:13 am on Jun 21, 2011 (gmt 0)

What would you do?

How fresh is your competitor's content? How fresh is yours? Maybe this is where you can have an edge? I'd set up a subdirectory blog and outsource writing stuff to somebody. A couple of posts per week or so. Submit to RSS directories and a handful of good quality blog directories. Get people to retweet your posts.

I'd still be tempted to do some contextual linking from related blogs. Not really white hat but definitely not black hat (if done in moderation and kept as relevant as possible)

9 months ago on a drop

That might be the problem. I picked up a keyword based drop .com 4 years ago and it took me 2 years to convince G that I'm taking this seriously. Drops are seen as lower-quality things, hence so many people have trouble re-selling their drops or selling advertising space on them. :( One thing you might try is register the domain for a longer period when it comes up for renewal (not just one year).

CainIV




msg:4332392
 4:24 am on Jun 29, 2011 (gmt 0)

It's tough. I see this daily as well.

What is frustrating is "pen to paper"

In theory what you are doing is exactly what Google asks for.

And what the others are doing is specifically the opposite many times.

I think sometimes as link builders we might over-estimate the value of diversity in inbound links.

I believe that high value links impact the value of low level links. This means that lower level links that are sitting on the brink on trustability are considered "more" trustable by Google.

In this scenario, then, even simple profile page links, local directory links would have increased weight because of the larger links.

I would therefore suggest you actually go after easier to obtain, comprehensive profile and local links.

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