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This 95 message thread spans 4 pages: 95 ( [1] 2 3 4 > >     
Yes, I got that dreaded email, too: adsense account disabled.
Your business model is not a good fit for the Adsense program
fischermx

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 2:47 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

Well, yesterday I got that email informing me my Account is being disabled.
But, before you rush to blame on me, please take in account, that I'm not hiding under a newly created nickname. I'm a 3 years old webmasterworld supporter member.
Also, please note that my Adsense cancellation is not because "invalid clicks", the one get you booted without further payment. The email I received is the one that says that "your business model is not a good fit for the adsense program", and they will still paying me the last month and this one as well.

My website is about an IT topic, in which I have some expertise. I started this website, just because I knew about the topic and started to write about it.
So, everything started just for promotion. I already had adwords account, because I was promoting some affiliate sites, some very tiny ones. Then I decided to create a campaign to promote this new website, and throw like $5 bucks a day out of my pocket. A month later, I signed for Adsense, so there was as point where I was running both, and the adsense earnings somehow compensated my adwords spending.
As time passes, the Adsense earnings overpassed my Adwords spending and somehow this resulted in a "business model" (please note the sarcastic use of quotes).
There were good times, in 2006, a peak, but then profits went down, and down, and down, mainly because the QS on adwords. I didn't care too much, because my website was good, and I was getting lots of free links from blogs and forums, so I was getting free organic visitors, and compensated the always increasing adwords costs.

At the beginning of this month, the Quality Score thing practically erased my campaigns by increasing 99% of my keywords to $10.00, and the only ones surviving were those 4 years old affiliate campaigns, which by the way, have all keywords in "great" quality.
Then, I had a few email interchange with an Adwords representative about this last event, and I'm quite sure this was the one that triggered a manual revision and got my adsense account down.

After these three years, my website grew a lot and it is somehow well known in its niche. I get like 500 visitors a day, free of charge, from the SERPS.
Also, there are like 150 people who regularly sent press releases for products related to this IT niche. I mention this so you have an idea, that I'm talking about a REAL website, with real people reading and getting help and useful information.

I know there are histories about people getting theirs accounts back, at least, I've read about 7 or 8 in this three years of reading webmasterworld every day. But those were cases about "invalid clicks", which turned to be a false statements, so, Google give them theirs accounts back.

So, the main reason to post this here, and ask this here publicly, is if you know cases from people getting the "your business model is not a good fit" that has appealed and get their adsense account back.

 

LifeinAsia

WebmasterWorld Administrator lifeinasia us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 4:56 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

If you have AdWords ads going to landing pages with AdSense ads, it's going to look like arbitrage, which Google has said numerous times they are trying to get rid of.

I'd suggest either:
A) Remove AdSense on landing pages from AdWords ads, or
B) Discontinue AdWords (or at least to any landing pages with AdSense on them)

Then you can try appealing to Google.

fischermx

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 5:04 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

LifeinAsia:
Thanks for your comment.
Already done the three a), b) and c)
I didn't get a response yet.

Green_Grass

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 5:12 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

Very unfortunate to hear of this..I always thought 'real' sites were safe..

Are your landing pages..too 'thin' ? This is the only thing I could think off..

Google does allow adWords traffic on adSense pages.. There are blogs on inside adSense pointing to this.. so I wonder what happened.

ByronM

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 5:22 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

How do "CSE's" get away with mass arbitrage? Not only that but CSE's have taken precedence on serps as well. Sad time for shopping/commerce sites.

fischermx

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 5:22 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

My main landing page was the front page!
Just imagine a page like... let's say, that for eweek dot com, just as an example.
And that's why I got those $10.00 min CPC, because pages were not optimized at all.
Also, my website has subsections there were subcategories of that IT niche. Just like the big IT portal does. I have (had) a campaign for each section again and they were plenty of content, nothing thin at all.

I said I "had", because, I've just deleted any adwords campaign that was still "running". And I say "running" in quotes, because I was getting zero impressions since a month ago.
Go figure!

zett

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 5:59 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

Fischermx:

that's sad to hear, especially as you are a long standing member who apparently knows about the pitfalls of Adsense.

I had a few email interchange with an Adwords representative about this last event

That's why I think one should restrict communication with Adsense to the absolute bare necessities. There is the potential (read: RISK) that you will communicate with someone who is not really bright and might get everything wrong and at the end might even terminate your account.

I once communicated with a person (?) from Adsense, who turned out to have absolutely not understood what my question/problem was (and it was not a crucial problem). That person then responded with a canned response that made me shiver (because it somehow blamed me when the problem was clearly and unmistakenly with THEM).

My tip: never communicate with Google, unless you really really need to.

Hobbs

WebmasterWorld Senior Member hobbs us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 6:16 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

fischermx,
First of all sorry for your conundrum, you have a good content site, it was not arbitrage driven, it is obviously not in violation of the TOS, yet your business model is what got your account terminated, something is very wrong.

Did you buy traffic from other networks and land them on AdSense pages?

Are you selling something that can raise eyebrows on a manual review?

Is your site in violation of the search engine or Adwords guidelines?

If a competitor wanted to get you in trouble, what could they find to report on your site?

Details will help others who have sites similar to yours.

jetteroheller

WebmasterWorld Senior Member jetteroheller us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 6:32 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

Sorry to hear, and I think You have a good chance to be one of this famous, "I was reinstated".

purplecape

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 6:37 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

I don't think there's any mystery here. As fischermx said, his mistake was to leave the AdWords campaign running when Google started to crack down on arbitrage sites.

(Why they couldn't just turn off the Adwords account is what I don't understand....)

fischermx

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 6:41 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

Well, thinking of it well, over the time, a very big IT contacted me to put links to their white-papers for a comission. Also, last year, I started to send leads to a website that provides online magazines. That might make my site to look a bit "tacky", but all what I did in these cases was to put a link to something like mysitename.theirsite.com, I mean, the content is hosted in a subdomain on their site. So, all this boils down to 2 outbound links.

Now, yes, I also bought traffic from Look Smart, but it was like a $1.00 a day, and since they just send robots, they don't click the ads! lol
Well, seriously, I wonder if that could be a problem, but I have that campaign in looksmart like since 2 years ago.

The site has only one ad unit and one ad link for each page. Just one of each.
There are many pages without ads, because they contain only grouped results. Actually these pages rank well in search engines.

The only ad unit that I have is a big square that is right in the middle, but it is clearly marked with an additional "advertisements" title, so there's nothing deceptive at all.

What else? mmmh, let me think more...

fischermx

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 6:47 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)


(Why they couldn't just turn off the Adwords account is what I don't understand....)

Yes, you're so right about that.
I thought on deleting all my adwords campaigns when the last QS slap happen, but I just gave it time, to see if the campaigns woke up.
And seems I just gave them time... to cancel my account :(

martinibuster

WebmasterWorld Administrator martinibuster us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 6:51 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

Seems like most of the stuff you're talking about is not enough to get one banned for having an incompatible business model. So maybe it's time to look elsewhere.

How original was the content? Did you develop it yourself or are you aggregating?

Pardon me for asking, no offense intended, but did this have anything to do with file sharing, P2P, or obtaining *free* software?

fischermx

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 7:06 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

The website is a combination of a portal and a directory. It doesn't sell nothing, not it contains a single download. As I told, just imagine a website like "eweek", but it is not eweek :)

martinibuster

WebmasterWorld Administrator martinibuster us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 7:11 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

>>>imagine a website like "eweek",

This is perplexing. A site like "eweek" classified as incompatible? A portal or directory classified as an incompatible business model? I think it takes more than that to be deemed incompatible. Which might point to the content.

Is there a twist that's making it incompatible?

So it has 100% original articles written by you or by your staff, articles that are not found elsewhere and has nothing to do with P2P nor features links to P2P sites or places to download torrents or anything at all to do with copyrighted content?

fischermx

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 8:52 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

I don't think they don't like my website, their email didn't say a word about that. Actually, what they did send me was a link to an Adwords guidelines page.

So, I think that what they did not like was that I was driving traffic to landing pages with Adsense using Adwords.... :(

But, note, that they were not "optimized" landing pages, i.e. they were not pages with nothing but a paragraph and the ad unit. Instead, the landing pages were working sections or categories of my website.

Actually, I survived many raids of shutting down arbitrage sites.
It is until now, that I drew attention to my adwords (and adsense) account that this happened :O

Hobbs

WebmasterWorld Senior Member hobbs us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 8:59 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

Was the income/spending very low?

Go again though the Adwords guidelines point by point and tell us if you discover anything new to you.

fischermx

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 9:05 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

The last month it was around $1,200 in earnings in adsense and $1,000 in spendings on adwords.
And to make it worse to me: since the beginning of the month when the quality score changes make all my keywords to $10.00 and I lost all adwords traffic, I realized that with just organic traffic I was doing like $7-10 a day, that's like $200-$300 a month. So, I was losing in the "arbitrage" side...
Sad, sad, sad..... :(

martinibuster

WebmasterWorld Administrator martinibuster us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 9:14 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

Actually, what they did send me was a link to an Adwords guidelines page.

The AdWords Quality Guidelines [adwords.google.com] covers issues with content, including advertising copyrighted content. For example (an example, not saying this is you), a technology portal like eWeek dealing with bit torrents, bit torrent software, bit torrent news possibly might not pass their quality quidelines because it involves issues with the distribution of copyrighted content.

Is it all possible someone filed a complaint with AdWords about your site?

The quality guideline list is long. Among many other reasons:

  • Don't promote unacceptable academic aids.
  • Don't promote aids to pass drug tests.
  • Don't promote bulk marketing products.
  • Don't promote copyrighted content without permission.
  • Don't advertise for data entry affiliate programs.
  • Don't promote fake documents.
  • Don't promote hacking and cracking sites.
  • Don't promote miracle cures.
  • The promotion of prescription drugs and related content is restricted.
  • The solicitation of funds is restricted.
  • Don't promote template sites for ad networks such as AdSense.
  • Don't promote unacceptable webmaster techniques.

[edited by: martinibuster at 1:19 am (utc) on April 30, 2008]

fischermx

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 9:15 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)


Go again though the Adwords guidelines point by point and tell us if you discover anything new to you.

I did that and I found this:
"Provide substantial information. If your ad does link to a page consisting mostly of ads or general search results (such as a directory or catalog page), provide additional, unique content."

So, since most of these landing pages consisted of "boxes" with headlines (again, look at eweek to know what I'm talking about). May be they considered that I had not provided "additional, unique content". And well, they might be right, since you have to click on the headline to go to real content... but isn't that what everybody does in this type of websites !?!?
Who on earth put a full article on the front page of a portal? :(

And again, why it lasted three years? And it is until now I ask someone to look in my account that I got my account disabled?

Jane_Doe

WebmasterWorld Senior Member jane_doe us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 9:24 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

That's why I think one should restrict communication with Adsense to the absolute bare necessities.

I think the common term is "waking the sleeping giant".

See_It_Now

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 9:25 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

If you use Google Webmaster Tools you might also check the 'What Googlebot sees' and 'content analysis' results. Maybe your site looks more like an MFA to google than it does to a human.

fischermx

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 9:37 pm on Apr 29, 2008 (gmt 0)

'What Googlebot sees' shows a list of keywords.
And all those keywords are related to my site. And not surprisingly in 'In external links to your site' column I don't see a single keyword not related to my website. So, all my gained links are in related websites.

coachm

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 1:22 am on Apr 30, 2008 (gmt 0)

My sympathies, but I'm guessing you are not considering some things. I noticed that in past messages you've at least asked about a fair number of things that would be questionable for google if you ended up proceeding with them (for example, A query about article site software).

So, there's other things to consider, such as have you ever run other sites? Why is your natural traffic relatively low? Why is your ratio of spend to earn so low?

It seems to me that from your numbers your business model isn' working for you. I don't know, but I'm thinking from past posts there's other things you haven't included for consideration.

Anyway, perhaps it's an error.

fischermx

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 1:44 am on Apr 30, 2008 (gmt 0)

Oh, well, yes, I asked that. I own a domain name, actually, 300+ domains, and one of them is a perfect fit for an articles submission site, but I never started that proyect. And before you ask, about this 300+ domains, some of them, are parked in Sedo, and the rest are not even parked.

I also asked about running a lyrics site, but I never did that. Actually I left drop 3 good domain names perfect for lyrics, because I just didn't want to be associated with such sites. You'll find that recently I asked about adsense running on lyrics sites, and it is precisely, because I had an eye in a proyect like that, but yet again, I never did it.

And finally, I also asked my girlfriend about a ménage à trois, with a girl, but we never did that either..... lol

Are you getting the idea? Just by asking doesn't make me guilty... ;)

Well, seriously, I currently have only 4 websites, two portals on IT niches, one that holds some affiliate links and an spanish forum.
Just one of these have adsense, and it is the one I'm talking about.

And yes, my "business model" wasn't working for me, because I didn't have the intention to run such darn busines model to start with! ;)

Thanks for your sympathies :)

coachm

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 2:02 am on Apr 30, 2008 (gmt 0)

And finally, I also asked my girlfriend about a ménage à trois, with a girl, but we never did that either..... lol

Are you getting the idea? Just by asking doesn't make me guilty... ;)

Ok. I get it, although I extend my sympathy to you and your girlfriend!

Let me ask you a question. I'm a long time business owner, both online and offline, and I make my living based on ethical behavior, honesty, and I'm a real hard*** about these things. Would I (or a traditional conservative businessperson) have any particular reaction positive or negative, to our sites (all of them or any of them).

Would I immediately be impressed and want to link to it, or trust you to do business with?

Obviously, if you want input worth something more, you'd pretty much have to make available your website urls, PLUS your ads and key words. I'd bet there are things there that would jump out to someone else (a fresh eye), but of course you can't post that stuff here.

As it stands you and google are the only ones that can diagnose, and both of you have your own perceptions and biases(É!)

MsHuggys

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 2:38 am on Apr 30, 2008 (gmt 0)

After hearing your story, it brought back some thoughts I had a few months back with so many arbitrage accounts getting cancelled. I decided not to take any chances, and am cancelling my Adwords account.

I will take my advertising dollars else where, rather than lose my Adsense account. While I thought it would be easier to have everything handled by Google, when I signed up for Adwords many months after beginning with Adsense, I can see how wrong that can go.

Thanks for posting your story.

fischermx

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 3:10 am on Apr 30, 2008 (gmt 0)

Coachm:

As I mentioned in the first post:

After these three years, my website grew a lot and it is somehow well known in its niche. I get like 500 visitors a day, free of charge, from the SERPS.
Also, there are like 150 people who regularly sent press releases for products related to this IT niche. I mention this so you have an idea, that I'm talking about a REAL website, with real people reading and getting help and useful information.

Additionally:
The site is PR5, has a few hundred unsolicited back links from blogs and other profit and non-profit websites in the niche. It also has 3 unsolicited links from universities, ".edu" websites, one of them is right in the syllabus for the subject of my site, as a recommended resource.

I think that should answer your question about wanting to link to my site. :)

fischermx

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 3:12 am on Apr 30, 2008 (gmt 0)

MsHuggys:
My advise would be not to buy traffic AT ALL for a website living from adsense, after this experience.
:)

Green_Grass

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 3637845 posted 5:58 am on Apr 30, 2008 (gmt 0)

"The last month it was around $1,200 in earnings in adsense and $1,000 in spendings on adwords. "

This is hardly big money.. arbitrage?

This can happen on any genuine website even inadverently.

The reasons HAVE to be elsewhere. If not, there has been a major change in G policy.

We are top of SEPRS for a few kew phrases but we also buy traffic for many keywords for which we donot rank. We have adSense ads on some pages of our website. A part of the cost gets deffered by adSense. If G thinks this is arbitarge, then we are in trouble. They should clarify.

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