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Panda Everflux - Google incorporating it into overall algorithm

 5:56 pm on Mar 14, 2013 (gmt 0)

Google: Panda To Be Integrated Into The Search Algorithm (Panda Everflux)

Matt Cutts, Google’s head of search spam, announced at SMX West today that their Panda algorithm will soon be more integrated into their overall continuous algorithm updates.


Now no one will have to wait for the next Panda "update".

[edited by: goodroi at 6:15 pm (utc) on Mar 14, 2013]


Robert Charlton

 6:38 pm on Mar 14, 2013 (gmt 0)

From the Matt Cutts audio recorded at SMX, which Barry Schwartz posted...

So, rather than having some huge change that happens on a given day, you're more likely in the future to see Panda deployed gradually as we're rebuilding the index, and so you are less likely to see these large scale sorts of changes.


 7:50 pm on Mar 14, 2013 (gmt 0)

Now I have to wait for the "when" -- when will they integrate the Panda algorithm? This will make my life a little bit easier, as I can analyze what's working and what's not.


 7:56 pm on Mar 14, 2013 (gmt 0)

So it will be sort of like placing lobsters in a bowl of cool water and heating it slowly instead of tossing them in a pot of boiling water. The observant lobsters will detect the variance and climb over their friends to try to escape in time. :)


 7:56 pm on Mar 14, 2013 (gmt 0)

Now I have to wait for the "when" -- when will they integrate the Panda algorithm?

Friday or Monday

When will this happen? As early as this weekend with the next Panda refresh.

See 1st post for source of the text and for audio content making a confirming statement.


 1:04 am on Mar 15, 2013 (gmt 0)

Oh it's started and am I seeing the biggest load of garbage?

Freakin' unreal top answers at the moment!

For my widget sector the Chinese have stuffed Google.

Robert Charlton

 2:00 am on Mar 15, 2013 (gmt 0)

Mod's note: Let's keep this thread about implications of dealing with a Panda Everflux algorithm... and put subsequent comments about this particular update in the current Updates and SERP Changes thread [webmasterworld.com...]


 3:19 am on Mar 15, 2013 (gmt 0)

Anecdotally, I've come to believe that the above the fold updates were rolled into Panda at some point in time. If I'm right about that (I have only observation to go on), then this could also mean rolling updates on the ATF side as well.

Robert Charlton

 3:33 am on Mar 15, 2013 (gmt 0)

Sand... assuming that by "ATF" you mean "Automated Testing Framework", I think you're right on that. I have a bunch of observation on the topic I haven't had time to assemble, but basically they'd be using data-centers to test and roll results in.


 3:36 am on Mar 15, 2013 (gmt 0)

I meant Above the Fold, but I totally agree with what you're saying as well. I've seen that a lot too, particularly in the last 6 months.


 3:40 am on Mar 15, 2013 (gmt 0)

What is there to deal with ..what implications..it rains you get wet ..it is sunny you get dry..as I said in the other thread ..the surprising thing is that all the various criteria of Panda were not previously incorporated into what is known as the algo or the everflux algo ..years ago..

They also just patented something about maybe finding and possibly ignoring hidden text..depending on how they feel..except they have been saying that they could spot hidden text for years now ..and we all have seen and still see examples daily of it in #1 ranking sites..so..

The plex sends out an awful lot of hints messages and sows FUD via all the usual outlets ..who report it and repeat it, so as to have something to say..they are being played..( question is ..are they complicit and aware of being played, and if so, do they even care, it is after all better than being unemployed, and being thought of as privy to secrets and a first choice confident, a privileged bearer of scraps, is to be seen as one of the "inner circle of search" )..even if the player is a "search god"..

Lenin had a comment about the usefulness of those around who spread the word and messages and "leaks" that were predestined for dissemination..

Repeating and reporting the words of "the search gods"..might be good for link bait , and click bait..but serves no real purpose for those that read or hear it, that was not already intended and envisioned by "the search gods"..that is to increase the FUD..

As incrediBill commented in a parallel thread about G closing their RSS reader..
message 4554948

Many parasites live of the scraps of larger beasts even in the cyberspace ecosystem

Applies also to those who bring out "the scraps" from the tables and the mouths of "the search gods" ..but "the search gods" only let fall, and only allow to be carried away to "outside", those scraps which are not important to them if they should become known..they feed us the scraps that they want to feed us ..keeps us occupied, distracted..and stops us looking at what they are really doing..and the reporting and carrying away of those "purposely distracting scraps"..keeps individuals, entire websites..nay industries ..busy..and making money..transporting the scraps , and translating the deliberately Sibylline cryptic Pythian musings of "the search gods" to the hoi polloi..

Reminds me, anyone notice the Jesuits got one of their guys elected Pope..TV and News websites ran almost nothing else..got loads of viewers, who all saw what they were supposed to see ..who were all nicely distracted from looking at what they are not supposed to ..and maybe asking "the wrong" questions...

Bread, Circuses..and Matt Cutts's comments..

Think I'll go and eat some cake..get the feeling someone ( or even a lot of someones ) thinks I/we should..

Or is the cake a lie ..


 5:33 am on Mar 15, 2013 (gmt 0)

I "suspect" that Panda has been integrated to the main algorithm 6 months ago.
see - [webmasterworld.com...]
Google reacted almost immediately when we made intensive site's changes.


 7:24 am on Mar 15, 2013 (gmt 0)

So faster reactions up, and faster reactions down - and slowly for those that don't adjust.

I guess for Google that's going to create a more responsive environment to raise UI/quality standards [whatever that means] , and allow them to focus harder on settling in Penguin [webmasterworld.com...] - makes me wonder just how big this update is going to be.

@LifeinAsia - i like your analogy. It depends in which pot you sit as a lobster [Panda, Penguin or both]. One pot can still boil you quick.

And as Duanne Forrester of Bing commented at SMX , Bing tests extensively first, whereas Google fires much more aggressively into their changes first with lot's of sudden pain.


 8:42 am on Mar 15, 2013 (gmt 0)

Or is the cake a lie ..

Ha ha. I read that in a Homer Simpson voice...


 8:48 am on Mar 15, 2013 (gmt 0)

Impact 1:
No need to fear the next refresh or wait in hope.

Impact 2:
It's easier to swallow steady drops on a daily basis than one big one.

Impact 3:
When your peak season approaches you don't have to sweat on a sudden big drop and then having to wait until after your peak season for a reprieve.

Impact 4:
No need to monitor this forum so closely for news of Panda!

Google will have been testing this for a while and many here have seen signs of a daily/weekly Panda out in the wild for several weeks and months. I'm pleased they finally got round to this, should make it much easier to figure out whether we're moving in the right direction or not.

I think it will still take a month or so for most sites to see the effects of changes, high traffic sites might see results much faster.

Overall a good thing I think.


 11:48 am on Mar 15, 2013 (gmt 0)

I had been thinking precisely the same claaarky, they'll just keep occasionally uttering that they make xxxhundreds of alterations a year in the hope that we will all go away.

They're probably right, I'm totally and utterly fed-up of them playing unintelligible games.


 3:06 pm on Mar 15, 2013 (gmt 0)

Zivush - I think you are right. The testing of panda flux had been in the index for a while. I think that explains why some of the people are seeing gradual ranking losses instead of one major hits.

It feels like Panda has been a weekly minor updates and tweaks. Or a judgement call instantly levied as soon as enough pages are crawled and "site score" analyzed.


 3:23 pm on Mar 15, 2013 (gmt 0)

Overall a good thing I think.

For the most part I agree. But diagnosing what happened if a site's traffic drops will be much more difficult when there isn't a date to compare against.


 10:34 am on May 9, 2013 (gmt 0)

Every day, I run into people affected by the Panda update. "Affected" always means negatively affected, because when your rankings go up, it means that Google is finally recognizing the quality of your site. When your rankings go down, blame it on Panda. Now, none of this is to say that Google's Panda algorithm update, and its ongoing tweaking that has followed, is not a big deal. In fact, this might be the biggest search ranking algorithm change since Google inaugurated link analysis in the late '90s. Because the search ranking algorithm isn't really analgorithm any more, because people don't set the rules. Google has embraced machine learning, and SEO will never be the same.

Machine learning is a computer technique that uses pattern recognition to cluster together similar things. What Google is doing with machine learning is clustering good search results and separating them from bad search results. How do they do that? They have people working as search quality raters to decide which search results contain quality information and which doesn't.

Those ratings become the training data for machine learning. Then the machine learning techniques go to work, identifying which Web pages and which entire Web sites have qualities similar to the ones that the quality raters have judged the best--and also noting which sites seem to match low-quality sites. Then, in addition to all of the factors that Google has always looked at in its ranking algorithm, there's a new factor--this machine learning factor based on the search quality raters.

So what does this mean for SEO? Plenty. If you've been trying to reverse engineer the algorithm, you can stop now. If you've been playing tricks with content farms or paid links or any other spammy technique. stand down. Those techniques are probably not going to work very well for much longer. I say that not because the new algorithm is perfect. It's not. I've seen plenty of quality sites that have been unfairly downgraded. I am saying it because Google is committed to this approach and will keep at it until they get what they want. They've declared war on spam and finally have a computer technique that can add in a human judgment that is very hard to spam.

So, if your idea of SEO is gaming the ranking algorithm, then SEO is over. If your idea of SEO is providing the best content for searchers to find, then your time has come. I've always counseled companies to optimize for people more than for search engines. Never has that advice been more important than now.

[edited by: tedster at 11:35 am (utc) on May 9, 2013]
[edit reason] moved from another location [/edit]


 11:57 am on May 9, 2013 (gmt 0)

I've always counseled companies to optimize for people more than for search engines. Never has that advice been more important than now.

Very true, and that's what I do - responsive design, usability, putting all information at the fingertips of the shopper (delivery,returns,reviews etc). I have high conversion rates which indicate shoppers are happy but I have poor Google rankings - primarily I believe because of external links. So here's the conundrum - Google seemingly want to punish a site regardless even if it will give the user a good experience - IF there are bad off-page signals. Anyone who's ever looked at the generated "latest links" spreadsheet from GWT will know just how much off-page linking goes on that you have no control over. My site is being added to junk directories, scraper sites etc and I believe that is affecting the rankings of this site.

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