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Has Panda Created an Era of New Domain SPAM?
ErnestHemingway



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 8:22 am on Jan 5, 2012 (gmt 0)

Happy New Year everyone, I wanted to start my 2012 thread with something which I see a lot of people are doing in few 1000+ markets we maintain and honestly a lot of our clients are also asking for this very solution.

Here is the thing, since the launch of Panda, it seems that once you are pandalized the chance are 0.1% that you will recover I have not found anyone so far that has recovered FULLY from Panda.

So if your XYZ.com got hit for "blue widgets" then chances are you will not get that spot back, HOWEVEVER!and let me repeat that again HOWEVER there is a way to get back that same position again BUY A NEW DOMAIN and START A NEW SITE on the same topic and build some links. You will be amazed how fast that site will rank.

Content can be same/different or SPUN it doesn't matter this new domain/website will rank faster for the term than your old authority/trustworthy site.

And I see a lot of people are applying this tactic now. It seems to be the best remedy.

Now my question is:

IS THIS GOOD FOR GOOGLE? This will start a whole new era of domain/website spam. Where you get hit by Panda and the only good solution is just start a new website all over again and build the links and you are good to go.

I mean if I was making $10k from xyz.com for "blue widgets" and I can get that same spot again within $2000 then why not?

It is sort of failure on Google's side to kill authority site but rank a new junk site right away.

So basically every time you get hit, start over again. I have tested this in a mid-tier niche for one of my affiliate sites and it is amazing how this works. My 10 years old domain with ugly HTML design and no ads is on 5th page but my new site is ranking #1.

Unless Google fixes Panda itself this NEW DOMAIN spam will continue.

 

jsherloc



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 9:38 pm on Jan 7, 2012 (gmt 0)

@tedster, IMO the "core" of what is really needed to rank for anything meaningful and long-lasting is no longer about having the relative "BEST" content well-beyond those technical prequisites, and that is what I take issue with.

It is looking more and more like Google is casting long-term classifications to further overall efficiency and to funnel niche traffic certain ways (outside of and independent of what the webmaster can provide the SE in terms of "quality content"). This does not inspire quality and I'm afraid things are only going to get worse.

I'm expecting a massive iteration any day now though, so we'll see how things look after that I guess.

aristotle

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 9:44 pm on Jan 7, 2012 (gmt 0)

From what I've read, Panda is an attempt to deal with "content farms". So the sites that are affected are either content farms or sites with many of the same characteristics.

Reno

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 10:38 pm on Jan 7, 2012 (gmt 0)

From what I've read, Panda is an attempt to deal with "content farms".

This was the "official" story, and no doubt content farms were one target. But I've come to the conclusion with Google (as with almost all multi-billion $$ corporations), one should take with a grain of salt what they say. What they say and what they do are very probably two different things. I'd bet a large pizza that many of us here that dropped off the edge are not "content farms", yet we can measure our falls with the launch of Panda. But from Google's POV, telling the world that they were after content farms made for good press, no matter the collateral damage. Kind of like a drone targetting an individual but killing a village... "Sorry, these things happen".

...................

tangor

WebmasterWorld Senior Member tangor us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 5+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 10:42 pm on Jan 7, 2012 (gmt 0)

Back to the OPs original: Domain Spam... that's what we are seeing as every Tom, Dick and Harry are trying to get something back for the Panda MFA/Content Farm slaps over the last year. And G will figure this out (particularly since the topic was brought up here at Webmasterworld) and examination for duplicate content will probably get a new goose in detection of "hmm... I've seen this before, yup, was slapped earlier" and the "new site" boost will disappear.

For each correction in a market, there's always an over-correction. Florida first, Panda second (and a few tweaks inbetween that got some gab time) and what comes after Panda? Because it will happen if G intends to maintain control of the marketplace they have created.

Swanson

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 12:47 am on Jan 8, 2012 (gmt 0)

I think the game has always been changing and people have always tried to find a way around an algo to get traffic.

In the years gone by the debate was always "blackhat vs whitehat" and there was a feeling that blackhat="short term" and whitehat="long term".

That was clearly a flawed debate. Google wasn't looking at that at all - it was looking at a whole range of other factors that have affected "whitehats" more than ever.

Google cares about the quality of the top results that are returned for queries and that satisfy their users - I remember seeing an interview from a Google exec that said they look at the top 5 results to be the indication whether the algo is good - past page 1 they don't expect the algo to be laser accurate as the effort to make it does not equate with the number of people that actually bother to click to page 2+.

SEO as the old definition stands is now dead - it was dying anyway.

Yes, you can create a good site with great content, get good links and it will rise. After a Panda update it can die. After any update it can die. For no reason, or for any reason.

That is just fine by me - Google does not owe you any traffic, in fact every single click from Google is a gift not a given.

The smartest people have always thought like this and that is how you have to think if you want to get traffic from Google.

Don't think long term if you want traffic from Google - think what you need to do to get it.

If you want to create a great site for visitors then don't think about Google - think how can you get people to it without Google.

Or, try everything you can to grab that traffic while the chance is there - and yes, new domains - sub domains, copy pandalized content to new or existing domains. Anything you can to re-use all that effort - why not?

I think the word SPAM should be discontinued - it has happened from day one and happens now, and will happen as long as the Internet exists.

Do what works - if you get buried by spam then you have a choice to make depending on how much you need the money to feed your family.

Swanson

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 12:56 am on Jan 8, 2012 (gmt 0)

Sorry I forgot to make the point with relevance to the OP.

New domains with content ALWAYS worked - exact match domains always worked and now work better than ever, don't believe anyone that said otherwise.

You get a freshness boost with any new domain and content - technically that sounds right - but any smart person can and will game it.

I have always noticed loads of this in the results - for years. Panda hasn't changed that.

That's why years ago I started buying huge amounts of domains and put content on them, and feeds, and blogs...etc. Lucky I did really.

tangor

WebmasterWorld Senior Member tangor us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 5+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 12:58 am on Jan 8, 2012 (gmt 0)

Don't think long term if you want traffic from Google - think what you need to do to get it.

Agreed. One who becomes complacent has no right to complain when things change... one should always be changing, challenging, diversifying. We all know the old adage: "Don't put all your eggs in one basket" and it never ceases to amaze me how many still don't understand that.

That said, continuing to game the same one trick pony with a different saddle or bridle keeps one stuck in the same "basket". Diversification is the way to go. Find that, and no matter what Panda does will not affect you...because you are not relying on the creator of Panda ALONE as a source of income.

Swanson

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 1:23 am on Jan 8, 2012 (gmt 0)

tangor, it couldn't be said any better than the way you put it.

Never before has there been such a diverse range of traffic sources - social media changed the game in my opinion.

Now is the time of opportunity - and Google quite simply needs to treated as part of the mix, and a very volatile part of it.

You should never have thought of "pleasing Google" - ever. Anyone who did was chasing fools gold. People who cited "ethics" or "morals" as a part of their strategy in creating sites that Google would "like" long term was nonsense and is shown to be now.

Make no mistake - as an SEO getting traffic from Google, it is in effect gaming the system. You aren't putting in place long term good structure or foundations, you are simply reaping the rewards of a temporary situation.

And that is fine as long as you know that, and position that strategy correctly in the way you build your business online.

martinibuster

WebmasterWorld Administrator martinibuster us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 8:54 am on Jan 8, 2012 (gmt 0)

That's what Panda's picked up on, generalised mush published by too many wannabe non-experts.


Is Wikipedia the exception to that statement or proof that Panda doesn't work?

jsherloc



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 9:28 pm on Jan 8, 2012 (gmt 0)

No one should worry about "pleasing" Google, but at some point you have to get on the information super "highway" in some manner or another if you want to actually grow your business in today's modern times. Offline marketing methods today almost always have their root in ONLINE lead gen/ONLINE traffic generation of some kind. And Google is essentially "ONLINE" to most people/CONSUMERS now. They are the Internet for the majority of folks around the world for the next few years, at least. Bing is building "bridges" sure...

Google represents the freeways, everything else is sidestreets and little trails (that you can grow yourself with hardwork, but most people still use the freeways to get where they're going faster, no matter what type of "brand" "loyalty" you have. Plus, ever hear of sidestreets and whole neighborhoods getting taken out to make way for new freeway growth? Yea, same thing happens online). So, when the freeway is already "telling" you that you don't have a realistic shot at getting where you want to go with your available resources, as you are ENTERING...how is that useful long-term to ANYONE but Google? How does that inspire quality content representing a unique, creative angle? I just get sick of G saying it is/and should be for "the users" all of the time. That is what irks me. Nothing will ever be perfect, but IMO they could have/would have done things a bit differently if they were truly concerned about getting rid of the relative "BEST" content across many top niches from small-medium-sized operations/publishers online.

The bear should be approaching soon...

Planet13

WebmasterWorld Senior Member planet13 us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time Top Contributors Of The Month



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 3:45 pm on Jan 9, 2012 (gmt 0)

@ jsherloc


I think you are correct in your conclusion.

ggolge, to me, is like a psychotic boss; their messages for what they want are always mixed, and their fancies change significantly without warning, leading to wholesale job losses.

No one would want to work for such a boss, except for the fact that the boss has something of a monopoly and will "pay" some people handsomely for relatively little work, provided you can stay in their good graces.

netmeg

WebmasterWorld Senior Member netmeg us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 5+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 4:42 pm on Jan 9, 2012 (gmt 0)

One person's "best content" is always gonna be some other person's "garbage content"

rlange



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 6:54 pm on Jan 9, 2012 (gmt 0)

jsherloc wrote:
No one should worry about "pleasing" Google, but at some point you have to get on the information super "highway" in some manner or another if you want to actually grow your business in today's modern times. Offline marketing methods today almost always have their root in ONLINE lead gen/ONLINE traffic generation of some kind. And Google is essentially "ONLINE" to most people/CONSUMERS now. They are the Internet for the majority of folks around the world for the next few years, at least. Bing is building "bridges" sure...

Google represents the freeways, everything else is sidestreets and little trails (that you can grow yourself with hardwork, but most people still use the freeways to get where they're going faster, no matter what type of "brand" "loyalty" you have. Plus, ever hear of sidestreets and whole neighborhoods getting taken out to make way for new freeway growth? Yea, same thing happens online). So, when the freeway is already "telling" you that you don't have a realistic shot at getting where you want to go with your available resources, as you are ENTERING...how is that useful long-term to ANYONE but Google? How does that inspire quality content representing a unique, creative angle? I just get sick of G saying it is/and should be for "the users" all of the time. That is what irks me. Nothing will ever be perfect, but IMO they could have/would have done things a bit differently if they were truly concerned about getting rid of the relative "BEST" content across many top niches from small-medium-sized operations/publishers online.

The bear should be approaching soon...

No company has made a name for itself through Google's SERPs. Google doesn't make companies, and it only breaks them if they've made the poor decision to intimately tie their success with their position in Google's SERPs.

--
Ryan

Sgt_Kickaxe

WebmasterWorld Senior Member sgt_kickaxe us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 2:31 am on Jan 10, 2012 (gmt 0)

Google is grandfathering individual urls, perhaps after a period of observing user reactions to each url. Adding a lot of pages to a site dilutes the sites rating per page and will cost you traffic until the effect has time to propagate for all pages.

Less is more, condense pages and remove under-performers, then consider letting your congressman know how tired you are of Google's constant reshaping of the internet via its practices.

tictoc

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 6:46 am on Jan 10, 2012 (gmt 0)

Great thread. Enjoyed the posts from jsherloc. I agree not having all eggs in one basket but hopefully G will correct some of the bad results and spammy short sites we are seeing for some keywords. I feel there will be an update soon.

watchtower101



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 10:30 pm on Jan 12, 2012 (gmt 0)

Google crossed the line from indexing to dominating years ago.

chrisv1963

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 7:12 am on Jan 13, 2012 (gmt 0)

then consider letting your congressman know how tired you are of Google's constant reshaping of the internet via its practices


"Recent destruction of the internet with panda and favouring own web property" might be a better way to put it.

watchtower101



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 12:13 pm on Jan 13, 2012 (gmt 0)

The fact that google morphed from indexing to dominating cannot be ignored. Thanks for this thread. Great advice here on how to play the game.

mrguy

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 4403907 posted 1:43 pm on Jan 13, 2012 (gmt 0)

So if your XYZ.com got hit for "blue widgets" then chances are you will not get that spot back, HOWEVEVER!and let me repeat that again HOWEVER there is a way to get back that same position again BUY A NEW DOMAIN and START A NEW SITE on the same topic and build some links. You will be amazed how fast that site will rank.


This is exactly how it was with adwords for a while when they brought the hammer down with Quality scores and you ended up with $10 bids. All you had to do was put the exact same content on a new domain and you were good for a few months. Then they started kicking affiliates out of the program for good.

Since they can't kick you out of the organics for good like with adwords, then this method is going to remain effective and the sooner Goog realizes that affiliates are a crafty bunch and will always find a way, the better off the search results will be. I know they want to stamp out affiliates so they are the only super affiliate left standing, but the affiliate industry is huge and will never go away just because Google says they should.

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