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when msn beta search engine launch
kamlesh




msg:1539454
 10:09 am on Dec 27, 2004 (gmt 0)

Hi Everybody,

when msn beta search engine launch.

Good Day,

Kamal

 

RobinK




msg:1539455
 8:57 pm on Dec 29, 2004 (gmt 0)

I don't know, but I am sure as soon as they announce it someone will post it here.

TinkyWinky




msg:1539456
 10:16 am on Dec 31, 2004 (gmt 0)

supposed to be early to mid jan..... but expect it to be a little later IMHO.

europeone




msg:1539457
 11:47 am on Jan 1, 2005 (gmt 0)

MSN shows me different results for the same serp!

if i click once i got some results, if i click again i got different ones.

anyone?

Kennyh




msg:1539458
 10:22 am on Jan 6, 2005 (gmt 0)

Anyone think that BG will use his CES keynote to announce the SE launch date?

Imaster




msg:1539459
 12:30 pm on Jan 6, 2005 (gmt 0)

Lets hope they release it as per schedule because they are known for their lateness in almost everything they do.

I wouldn't be surprised if we still see them in beta by the year end.

But I really hope they launch soon to keep a check on Google and Yahoo.

RobinK




msg:1539460
 6:47 pm on Jan 6, 2005 (gmt 0)

Kennyh, I really hope so. They have said beginning to mid January, I am hoping they keep to it. I will be glad to see another engine in the mix.

northweb




msg:1539461
 7:53 pm on Jan 6, 2005 (gmt 0)

I agree, msn will become a serious player in the search engine world. Although, google has been kicking butt in the marketing department as of late.

lizardx




msg:1539462
 10:58 pm on Jan 6, 2005 (gmt 0)

Last I heard they said june-july, that's still what I'm guessing, if they put this thing out now it wouldn't do very well, there's way too many places it fails when pushed, complex searches, searches that require sorting through a huge number of similar pages, it's getting better though. June seems reasonable to me given the beta nature, after all, if they release this live and people don't like it, it's very difficult to get those annoyed users back, it's worth waiting for it to work quite consistently well before going live.

This isn't like longhorn where MS can fail on major feature after major feature, like new file systems etc, cut those features out, then say they are releasing longhorn.

MSN search will need to work at least as well as Yahoo before going live, it's very hard to win back hearts and minds on the web.

nalin




msg:1539463
 12:23 am on Jan 7, 2005 (gmt 0)

MSN search will need to work at least as well as Yahoo before going live, it's very hard to win back hearts and minds on the web.

I would strongly disagree with this, or the first part of it anyway. As a disclaimer, I like MSN search. I dont particularly care for MS.

MSN in general does not get overwhelming traffic from say, Mac users, who find it to be the most useful portal out there. Rather MSN and MSN search find themselves in the unique position of being integrated into a leading operating system, one that something like 90% of people use. MSN search still only manages to wrangle a very small number of internet searches (off the top of my head something like 20%).

Lets face it, if the users havent abandoned MSN search already, they are certainly not holding on for quality reasons, they are specifically using MSN because (A) it is good enough, (B) they know no alternatives, or (C) they are lacking the computer proficieny which is prerequisite to changing the homepage.

If I had to guess I would not think that quality assurance will be a foremost consideration when designing MSN search nor will it be paramount to a launch date.

RichTC




msg:1539464
 1:32 am on Jan 7, 2005 (gmt 0)

Well said

Time for MSN to launch the search engine. This has gone on long enough now.

Its already better than google if you ask me. If anyone loses confidence in MSN it will be because they keep holding back the launch date. This engine should have been live last year!

lizardx




msg:1539465
 1:43 am on Jan 7, 2005 (gmt 0)

<< Lets face it, if the users havent abandoned MSN search already, they are certainly not holding on for quality reasons, they are specifically using MSN because (A) it is good enough, (B) they know no alternatives, or (C) they are lacking the computer proficieny which is prerequisite to changing the homepage. >>

Nalin, nicely put. However, I don't think MSN is just going to go live, I think you'll see a major ad campaign to push it heavily, maybe after a preliminary live testing period using the existing user base you mention. But I don't actually agree, I think yahoo results are totally useable, in fact during more than one google algo tweak I was forced to use yahoo to find what I needed. Nice going google, that's really smart... maybe google's bought themselves one too many comp sci phds and ex microsoft guys, and need to pick up a few people with functioning common sense now.

But after that, MS people aren't going to be going for 8-15% market share, to grow they will have to be at least as good as Yahoo. I like parts of beta too, I think their search page is very well crafted, it's maybe the best one out there currently on a technical coding level.

And they have the capacity to easily compete with Google on the freshness level, Yahoo simply isn't upto that part of the challenge currently, I'm seeing upto 10 days or more delay to get new content in.

Which leaves the quality of the serps. In some areas I think they are very good. In other areas I see distinct weaknesses, some too serious to let this product out yet, it fails. Google fails too, but they're established, and can coast on their name while they fix their failures. MSN won't have that option, although I completely agree that they will have a very good testing platform with their current users. But yahoo/msn are really actually completely fine for most searches, it's just the freshness issue that I see holding yahoo back from seriously competing, the quality of the serps is usually fine.

I would love to see MSN go live right now by the way, a lot of stuff I track is doing very well on it, but to be honest, I have tried on a weekly basis to use msn beta and haven't lasted yet past about 2 searches, let alone a full day.

dazzlindonna




msg:1539466
 5:07 am on Jan 7, 2005 (gmt 0)

maybe google's bought themselves one too many comp sci phds and ex microsoft guys

Just for fun, how about a good old-fashioned conspiracy theory? What if those ex microsoft guys were really planted there by MS, to foul up the google algo (if so, they are doing a good job), and then return to MS with knowledge of the google algo and a nice bonus in their new paycheck?

Hey, I said it was just for fun! :)

lizardx




msg:1539467
 8:36 am on Jan 7, 2005 (gmt 0)

Yeah, that would be really funny, there's be legal problems of course, the system frowns on industrial espionage. But I think it was pretty simple, google is offering a really nice option package that will make the MS guys richer than they would have gotten at MS. Don't be evil... what a joke.

mark1615




msg:1539468
 2:47 pm on Jan 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

I have to agree, the sickly sweet, holier than thou, condescending, "don't be evil" is like a cliche of a Northern California hippie. Why, not "we like puppies" or "moms are nice?" Oh, I know, I've got one, how about, "we're a search company and we work hard to produce good searches." Nah, not righteous enough.

webzilla




msg:1539469
 5:57 pm on Jan 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

Anybody know when MSN's contract with Yahoo expires? That may be a key date.

Freedom




msg:1539470
 6:37 pm on Jan 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

There was a 2 year contract signed with inktomi before it got bought by Yahoo. I think it was in 2003, so that would make the expiration sometime this year. 1st quarter i think, but don't quote me on that.

BillyS




msg:1539471
 7:27 pm on Jan 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

MSN's efforts fly in the face of its recent pledge of support for its Inktomi relationship. In February 2003, Microsoft extended its license with Inktomi through December 2005, according to a filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission. The filing added that MSN contributed $5.6 million in revenue to Inktomi during the December 2002 quarter. About $5.1 million of that revenue was through paid inclusion and $500,000 was through licensing fees.

I also saw some information indicating they could get out of the contract earlier...

lizardx




msg:1539472
 8:55 pm on Jan 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

webzilla:
<<<
MSN has appointed Overture to supply the sponsored search results on its US, Canadian, European and Asian websites, until the end of June 2006. The one-year extension of a deal, which has been running since 2001, will keep Overture on its toes, but surely at some point MSN will choose or buy an ad broker that is not owned by a direct competitor.
>>>
full story [theregister.co.uk]

By the way, this is why I still can't use msn beta, I keep trying to get real answers for random searches like this one: msn search extends pay per click contract
and it doesn't give me the right answer. This is why I am pretty much positive, unless MS is about to make a huge mistake, that MSN beta is not ready for prime time even if it is working well on shorter search phrases, which I think it is in certain areas, but not all. For a while I thought they were closer, and was stickying msndude about errors, but I'm going to stop, they aren't close, although it's getting there piece by piece, but it still can't handle any type of searches that are very complex or push its limits, or go slightly beyond what the alpha testers had probably focused on.

I have still been unable to use msn beta for real world complex searches, it usually doesn't last more than 1 or two searches before I have to give up and use google or yahoo. I try though, one day it will be ready, that day just isn't today.

By the way, make absolutey sure you block beta.search.msn.com cookies when testing your keywords, the results begin to get tailored to your searches, and the positions change. This cookie blocking applies to all search engines.

Here's my utterly worthless prediction:
MSN is supposed to go live june or july. Like all major MS releases and projects, it will be late. MSN will go live next fall.

dazzlindonna




msg:1539473
 11:02 pm on Jan 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

Check out the MSNsearch blog. It is ramping up so that more msn searchers will be seeing the beta results starting next week!

RobinK




msg:1539474
 11:14 pm on Jan 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

As far as I am concerned they can turn the dial up to maximum level!

lizardx




msg:1539475
 12:22 am on Jan 9, 2005 (gmt 0)

<< Youíll continue to see us doing this on occasion for the forseeable future. As before, the service remains in beta status and we will officially launch it when itís ready. >>

From their blog. I'd say the key word here is 'when it's ready'. It's not ready now, but there is no way to test the system without exposing to real traffic, so it makes sense for them to do that intermittently, they can't just go live one day and hope it all works under full load.

RobinK




msg:1539476
 2:03 am on Jan 9, 2005 (gmt 0)

I am wondering if they will do it along the lines of how they did when they phased out looksmart. It didn't take them long once they got started.

lizardx




msg:1539477
 2:54 am on Jan 9, 2005 (gmt 0)

That's changing vendors, they could evaluate the quality themselves before hand, switching is a relatively minor thing. This is different, they are running the whole thing themselves, and it has to work reasonably well out of the box, or they could lose the release boost in publicity. Imagine it: press release: we are going live.

The next day the computer media jumps all over it: horrible results, useless, couldn't find what I needed, system failed. That would set them back probably 1 year. I don't see that happening, unless they really are impatient and willing to risk losing market share. Like I said, I can't use this day to day, I can't even use it for more than one or two searches before switching. In some areas it's great, but not enough. IMO.

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