Can't say i'm surprised. That super deep crawl they did a few weeks ago, was a big clue they had gone beta...
I can not wait till the new index is up. For the longest time we have been held together by only a few engines. New engines are great for the web, makes it so people have different choices. I for one am excited over the new index. We will wait and see what the results come up with but all that spidering over the year, we're hopen for a full index.
I hope they didn't follow Googles standard and try to make the results match. Although Google has good results and they have done a great job doing placement and relivencacy the web needs a new look :)
Okay, did Stefanie Olsen [zdnet.com.com] miss the boat or was she accurately reporting what was going on?
|On July 1, MSN plans to overhaul the way its search result pages appear... The top three listings, instead of four, will be highlighted with a box, marking them as "sponsored" results... Following that will appear natural or algorithmic search listings, provided by Yahoo-owned Inktomi. |
The LA Times headline states: Microsoft Redesigns MSN to Promote Ads
Could it be that Reed Stevenson [reuters.com] of Reuters is misunderstanding a press release?
By the way, where is the press release for this?
Is there a new SE on the block or did Reed Stevenson misinterpret the Press Release?
It has started
Microsoft will end up domonating this industry just how they have every other industry they are involved in.
I am personally excited for this new "choice" in search engines. Microsoft has the capital, knowledge, and workforce to make a very powerful and appealing search engine for millions of users.
Just form the millions of MSN subscribers that are force fed MSN search daily, Microsoft will have a good experiance with the search world.
Competition is always a good thing for the consumer, and the competition MS will bring to other major SE (google, yahoo, the like) will offer advertisers and consumers more options.
Google IPO? Yeah right...............
Gosh, could you imagine if there was any substance to the rumor that MS could buy AOL? That's one of Google's major distribution channels. Between that loss, MSN, and Yahoo ... what would Google really have left? There market share would probably be somewhere aroun 20% at that point. I wonder how long they could remain competitive at that point given the marketing saavy of their biggest rivals - MS and Yahoo. :-\
>>>It has started...
There is some confusion if this has started or not. It was previously stated that June would be their launch date, but there have been contrary statements, most notably from Bill Gates himself, that it won't happen until 2005.
So, who are we going to believe, Bill Gates, Stefanie Olsen, or the Reuters guy?
|Is there a new SE on the block or did Reed Stevenson misinterpret the Press Release? |
the latter (imo)
>Following that will appear natural or algorithmic search listings, provided by Yahoo-owned Inktomi.
Maybe you are reading too much into the supposed launch. If they are using Yahoo results, no big change for MSN business because it is not their engine. We will just see similar results in the natural listings to what we are already seeing in Yahoo right now. I guess we will see soon...
I reckon if Microsoft had intended to release it during the second half of 2004, then Microsoft would have called it "MSN Search engine 2003"
Non of us would be sitting here reading this today if it wasn't for Microsoft - this will be interenting!
I don't know but when I read this, I don't see how it could be interpreted otherwise - Microsoft IS planning to launch new search technology in july folks.
From the Yahoo news article:
Just over a year ago, Microsoft's executives sat down at its Redmond, Washington, headquarters and decided to build their own search technology that would challenge Google's ability to sift through the Web and return results relevant enough to make it the Web's top search provider.
Redetzki said MSN was making steady progress and that July's launch will reflect results driven by a revamped search engine with better algorithms, the underlying logic involved in sifting through information.
"We're much farther along in relevancy," Redetzki said.
I've read both articles. They don't quite jive with each other. Olsen is a pretty good reporter but she works on tight deadlines and sometimes gets deals off a bit. I don't know the Reuter guy's stuff. This doesn't make sense to me. A lot of information is missing.
How are the going to crank up enough ads to be meaningful by July?
This sounds like Yahoo of old:
|MSN will also replace Overture sponsored listings from underneath with one editorial staff-recommended site. |
Eh,... can we take them to lunch?
Great post, but martinibuster is right: Something is screwy here.
|None of us would be sitting here reading this today if it wasn't for Microsoft - this will be interenting! |
Yeah...it's hard to imagine where the computer world would be if Microsoft hadn't set it back 100 years. :)
Don't know if many here remember Microsoft's original foray into PPC with its disastrous B2B. Guess if they can buy and/or steal the technology this time around the competition could actually be beneficial for once.
Why is Microsoft's victory inevitable? They dominate 3 "markets," desktop operating systems, productivity software (word processing, spreadsheets, presentation software), and web browsers.
They have failed in many ventures: Accounting Software (Quicken beat them), Databases (Oracle maintains its lead), Web Servers (Apache completely dominates), Video Game Consoles (Xbox is a failure), AV Equipment (UltimateTV utterly trounced by Tivo in the DirecTV market), AOL Instant Messenger trounces MSN's chat thingy, etc., etc.
To make the jump that because they were able to dominate one industry (web browsers) against a poorly financed and operated company to assume that they can defeat all comers in all markets?
Microsoft has shown themselves to own 3 markets due to competition stupidity (none of the Windows competition was run efficiently, Word Perfect collapsed because of internal financial problems that caused the company to change ownership a million times, Netscape had no business model), and fail everywhere else. Plenty of companies have gone to the mat with Microsoft and won.
Why would Yahoo and Google, two well funded players that know the search business have to run in fear of MSN? They need to respect the entry of a player that owns the browser market, but they don't have to completely run and hide.
Note: when Microsoft announces that they will enter a market, competitors stock prices tend to plummet. If I was a short term trader, I could probably make a real living buying on post-MS announcement dips.
All I want to know is; who MSNGuy is going to be? Can I have first dibs? I have a hotmail address, so I guess that counts.
But on a more serious note alex_h
|Video Game Consoles (Xbox is a failure) |
Have you not played Halo?
And finally: The monopoly is dead (or on it's last legs) long live the plurocracy.
alex_h...you're completely right as far as I'm concerned. People are scared of Microsoft because the media tells them to be. You've pointed out very clearly that they have failed to gain a significant market share in most markets that they've tried to enter. Does anyone really think they care? Nope...they've got a little bit of everything...not a bad idea.
The MSN search engine will be a good thing to the industry IMHO. There's too few players that have a choke hold on search right now. Of course I won't name names...but we all know.
This is a positive evolution, beneficial to the whole search industry.
Microsoft's long term determination, financial and human resources, and strategy to dominate, or at least play a leader role in a certain industry, will put pressure on all competitors like Google and Yahoo to improve quality and investments.
I personally don't like any dominant player in any market, but three to five powerful players fiercely fighting for market domination can bring more benefits than a very fragmented market with lots of small competitors.
The timing is also right. Microsoft and Yahoo will keep putting pressure on Google even after it's IPO. I just hope those guys won't make cartel agreements too soon.
The search industry is really infant, the best has yet to come...
any word on the future bot yet, any advice on msnbot?
Working from past experience with Microsoft release dates, we should probably take any dates from them (or others) with a lorry-load of salt.
>On July 1, MSN plans to overhaul the way its search result pages appear... The top three listings, instead of four, will be highlighted with a box, marking them as "sponsored" results... <
WHAT IS DIFFERENT ABOUT THAT, than what MSN search does now? It displays 1 or 2 "featured sites" (paid ads, paid to MSN) at top and 3 OV ads on top now, titled as sponsored, and also OV ads to the right in a box. As far as its great results as a new engine, I have to say its hard to tell when the beta is there, and when whatever else they use is there, it is like playing ping pong on results.
But seems to me mostof the time its new beta engine displays a lot of shopping.com and bizrate and dealtime results at the top of "natural results."
This comment is in reference to ecommerce type sites, but even so: what is "real" about those results? They are all paid, or in the case of shopping.com and dealtime and bizrate, structered with high density keywords to capture the artificial intelligence of those robots. Not real at all.
No sour grapes on my part. I advertise on dealtime and shopping.com and bizrate for exactly that reason.
But the fact is: The major results showing on almost all search engines these days are paid for. One way or another.....
Just trying to get up to speed .... is MS planning on imbedding their web search into their next operating system, Longhorn?
>Just trying to get up to speed .... is MS planning on imbedding their web search into their next operating system, Longhorn?
From what I have read, yes.
>How are the going to crank up enough ads to be meaningful by July?
MS could easily run the SE without ads for quite a while. It ain't like they don't have the money. In fact, keeping it ad free in the beginning might help attract users who don't want the screen cluttered with ads.
Anyone know what "next generation search" means at Micosoft?
Take someone with the resources of Microsoft building a new search engine from the ground up and you could have a truly exciting new product.
If I could give one piece of advice to MS it would be:
"Don't rush this, get it as good as possible on day one".
I'm a huge fan of MS, but they may be feeling a little pressure to get into the game here. I personally don't think the pressure is real, and they should spend time getting it right, rather than blowing it with a "rush job" and something that people hate.
Gates has for 25 years been a very patience/strategic player, I doubt we will see that change, I sure hope it doesn't :)
Sorry everyone, going back to basics, does this mean:
a) MS are developing a new SE/bot which will no doubt have its own, proprietary PFI/PFC - TBC
b) They are another victim of the OverYahoo network, getting results from Ink which enevitably means paying Yahoo?
|Why is Microsoft's victory inevitable? |
I suppose some think it is inevitable because MSN are the only ones (of the big three) with their own browser. "Default search settings" tend to remain "default" settings by ... well ... default! :)
Most people are unaware that they can change their default settings or that they can download other browsers. Fewer still feel the need to do so if they are getting reasonable results. Ergo, if Internet Explorer is your great aunties default browser and MSN is set as the default "search" resource ... chances are that's the one she will use.
Unless Yahoo and Google get into the browser market, MSN has a huge leg up in the grab for eyeballs from the get go.
Yes Mark. Correct.
One is a short term tactic
- which Microsoft has now employed for what - how many 'short term tactical' years?
- the other is a mid/longer term strategy - which apparently will be launched in June/July
The speculation in this thread is which June/July it will be launched. Current speculation is 2004 - 2005 - 200x etc.
Its all FUD - Fear - Uncertainty - Doubt. If we don't have a product - FUD 'em. IBM invented it - Microsoft perfected the artform......
After 20 years of dealing with the beast from Redmond - I learnt that a month announcement is little more than a 'no holidays you guys' red flag - a year is a pseudo- commitment to a naming convention.
My money is still on "MSN Search Engine 2003" - shipping in a Win 2005 timescale.....
>My money is still on "MSN Search Engine 2003" - shipping in a Win 2005 timescale.....
My money is on that shipping in 2006/2007! Maybe even later:)
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