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This 252 message thread spans 9 pages: < < 252 ( 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 8 9 > >     
MSN Search Technology Preview
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seasalt

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 3:08 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

[techpreview.search.msn.com...]

 

johnser

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 9:57 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

MSN Search is temporarily unable to process your request.
Please try again in a few minutes.

EID: f:618926422 - 1041:1041:10004:1059
HC: 71d61b13

MSNdude, you want to have a chat with Bill?

snort

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 10:05 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

This may not be on par with google yet, but it's a whole lot better than what's currently on search.msn.com

Larryhat

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 10:13 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

In my more-or-less non commercial field, what I notice is the absense of my pet-peeve keyword stuffers and the like. A lot of tired old junk-sites that hogged the highest spots in the serps are gone. I see far more relevant results in my narrow niche. That and the speed make this something to watch.

My ratings improved by about 35%, no complaints there either. - Larry

mcavill

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 10:15 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

overall i think it's pretty good, as everyone has said there's a few bits to sort out, but that's the purpose of testing.

joeychgo

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 10:16 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

<Too many results from the same domain.>

Yeah, way too many --

The other thing... I never like when several urls point to the same page and all end up in the top listings.

tenerifejim

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 10:20 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

I've just jumped to the end of the thread but:

Too many results from the same domain.

Absolutely. Otherwise, I quite like it.

sit2510

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 10:20 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

For the commercial terms in my field, I have to say that MSN techpreviews brings up very good results as far as I can see and I think it is awesome.

SAME DOMAINS:
For same domains appearing in the serp, I observe that if keywords are less competitive, there are more chances that you will see same domains carrying different pages in the same result, but this will gradually decrease when the keywords become more competitive.

KEYWORD DOMAINS (?) -
At first glance, appear to be important, but there seems to have some other inherent algos that play more important roles behind the scenes, eg. hub-like page, size of the sites, etc.

TITLE TAG:
I doubt how much weight MSN counts the title tag. For my competitive terms, 1 or 2 sites on 1st page do not have title and MSN displays URL as title instead. A commercial site with good listings across the board on MSN for highly competitive keywords have their pages rank on page 1 with title "test". [Samples given in the commented form]

LINKS IN AND OUT
Both seems to play important role, especially if the page is a hub-like page having links pointing to internal pages.

Finally Good News to all friends at Webmasterworld, if you can rank well in Google before Florida, then you have a great chance to rank well in MSN, provided the final roll out is similar to this one. Isn't Google pre-florida serp makes Google big?

johnser

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 10:35 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

From the feedback page......

"If you are looking for a Web site that isn't listed in the search results, please type the URL here"

Fastest way to get listed?

GreatVista

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 10:47 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

Not related at all if you search hyphen connected keywords, e.g. widget-widget.

MSN search technology is too naive. I have never imagined such a Microsoft technology. I'm wondering what their product evaluating engineers have been doing.

helenp

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 10:50 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

feedback:

1. I am missing total amount when doing link:http://www.site
to know total amount one must keep doing next to know how many.

2. See linkfarm link pages are indexed.....

3. When hitting back pages, one goes to top of page instead of previous position on page.

[edited by: helenp at 11:04 am (utc) on July 1, 2004]

Dayo_UK

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 10:54 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

Interesting.

Obviously as has already been mentioned something has to be done about the results from the same domain.

Also I have let Msnbot have access to all my sites - slightly disappointed that when doing a site:domain search only about 100-120 pages are listed from each site.

But early days.....

BroadProspect

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 10:57 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

after checking on more then 15,000 keywords, I can say that it is a VERY immpresive set and with the best quality I have seen so far!
great work! I think that google and yahoo do have a competitor!

very nice MS, keep on!

/BroadProspect

glitterball

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 10:58 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

One change that would dramatically improve the results would be to demote the importance of all subdomains.
Way too many spammy keyword1.keyword2.com sites coming up in the first few spots.

zeus

WebmasterWorld Senior Member zeus us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 11:02 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

I have made a few searches in products, service and other stuff, Im sorry to say but MSN have alot of work to do, I hope they will use time until 2006.

I dont think I have seen so bad results since the start of seach engines.

zeus

Leosghost

WebmasterWorld Senior Member leosghost us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 11:05 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

Ok so it's indexing a billion plus pages ..but that doesnt explain why there is no indicator on the serps pages of how many "results" ..a la "here are the top 15 of 300,000 matches" found...
Keyword density spammable in present form ...nice if it changed...
Interesting to note ...if all other title and page elements are equal the number one spot goes to the title that begins with a lower case letter ..."feature..?"

BTW in the "about" page you have the option of going to other languages

..you might note that "Parlez-Vous Franšais?" should be written as "Parlez-vous Franšais?....

inviting people to use your international language service with a 3 word sentence which has one big grammatical fault in it smacks of poor PR ..

'specially with regard to France where you aren't exactly flavour of the month...

Dommage...

s'cuse spelling (comme d'ab)

zeus

WebmasterWorld Senior Member zeus us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 11:12 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

I just made a search for the words in my domain name and on the first site I got 7 results from my guestbook, but no main site and 7 pages from the same site, I know it mine, but thats not a good quality result.

zeus

TinkyWinky

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 11:13 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

Loads of spam - but hey who's complaining?

No really, they have obviously not employed an IP filter coupled with either whois or content matching software - otherwise they would have picked up a couple of companies in the health sector that have 30 odd domains turfing out exactly the same crap under different templates.

Of 50 results for a common 2 word keyterm - 40 are the same spammer....

Bit slow - but hey it is only development and I agree with it being a bit better than what's currently there.

rytis

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 11:14 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

I think current algo is:

have keyphrase once in

title
meta description
meta keywords
url
<h> tag at the beginning of html body

And that's it. Not needed in body text. 1999 Altavista SEO was more difficult ;)

Of course, have at least one irrelevant link from any irrelevant page for msnbot to find you.

That said, everything has to start somewhere - good to see the project moving forward and wishing good luck!

R

cleanup

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 11:16 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

Very slick, better than Yahoo! by far..

Perhaps a little too much domain/keyword
weighting..but pleasing - I would use it.

zulufox

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 11:21 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

The link doesnt work for me

when I click it I get:

MISSING CONTROL: lwhead
MISSING CONTROL: lwbody

[edited by: zulufox at 11:30 am (utc) on July 1, 2004]

helenp

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 11:28 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

Is there a spam filter for repeated keywords in title?
If so, well done.

One of my competitor, doing well in Yahoo and Google, is indexed in msn search, but nowhere to find on first 4 pages in msn search.

Site do repeat keywords in title and is databased.

Or could be 301 problem?
Site in question have an redirection from their .com site to .st site

[edited by: helenp at 11:52 am (utc) on July 1, 2004]

ptietze

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 11:32 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

See some 301 redirect problems.

dvduval

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 11:39 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

On the search for webmasterworld.com there are porn links. There is info in the description about webmasterworld, but definitely not what you see when you get there. It seems there are spammy doorway pages getting indexed.

dvduval

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 11:40 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

Also, MSN bot seems to be indexing pages with session ids quite readily.

RichD

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 11:45 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

A couple of people have mentioned the poor results for webmasterworld.com - remember that Brett has blocked msnbot in robots.txt (http://www.webmasterworld.com/forum97/73-4-15.htm)

Monkscuba

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 11:56 am on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

First impression..

OMG, that's awful.

I searched for a popular destination related to us. Half the first page of results were all photos from the same site. The top was a domain "popular-destination".com that never comes up on Google, as it's got no links and is a mirror site, one of many interlinked sites owned by the same company.

Searched for our company name. Every other search has no trouble knowing us. There's another company with the same name who have a site, no links in, PR0 on Google, site not built yet...it ranks no 1,2,3 on the MSN.

Searched for what we sell (the main kws). A spammy guy who has about 20 semi-mirror web sites that barely appear anywhere on Google anymore..he has 7 of the top 10 places.

etc..etc..

Well, I guess it is in testing mode..

HarryM

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 12:02 pm on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

ExpLarry wrote:

One immediate observation: there's no good visual indication that there's more than a screenful of results. I got the initial impression that it was only returning 15 keywords (on quite common phrases). How about "1-15 of XXXX results" and / or a prev 1 .. 10 next bar?

I have to agree with this. The 'next' link is very easy to overlook, and at first glance it seems there are only 15 results. Could be very frustrating for the average user.

Robber

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 12:03 pm on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

As most have said load of results from same domain and sub domains do really well. On the keywords in domain aspect though, I have only run a small number of searches, but it looks like the more competitive the search phrase the less dependent the results are on keywords in domain.

zulufox

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 12:06 pm on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

so as of right now I should register:

how-to-consolidate-a-loan.com

to get top of the MSN bot?

hmm... thats a bit worrying, since most of the best sites nowadays do not include keywords in the title.

PaulPA

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 12:08 pm on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

In my keyword area the results are not even close to matching what is seen with Google and Yahoo. Where Google and Yahoo would find many of the same sites listed in first 25 results, I don't see that same sites with MSN.

michael heraghty

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 107 posted 12:21 pm on Jul 1, 2004 (gmt 0)

What's particluarly bizarre about this fiasco is that Gates was poo-poo'ing the notion of keyword search, and then these results are entirely based on keywords in URL.

MSNdude, seriously, there simply is nothing to talk about when *all* the top results are keyword domains, either keyword.tld or keyword-1-x.tld.

Agree pretty much with SteveB.

Get ready for domain-buying frenzy, as kw in domain takes on a whole new importance!

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