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Reporting click inducements on password protected sites
david_uk

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 6:10 am on Jul 7, 2005 (gmt 0)

I've been having a bit of fun with the new Google idea of reporting the "Click on the google ads" sites. I'm glad to see that adsense has been removed from some of them alreadsy and the page still asks people to click on the non existant ads.

However, on quite a few sites, a google search throws up that site is asking people to click on the ads, yet I can't ascertain that the site is serving ads because it's necessary to register to gain access. I don't want to waste time by reporting sites that for all I know may have already been dealt with.

Suggestions?

 

joeking

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 5:52 pm on Jul 7, 2005 (gmt 0)

If you want to dedicate yourself to being an unpaid Googlebuster you will need to register and check those sites out for yourself.

Otherwise get on with improving your own sites and let others who get paid to do Google's work to catch up with the baddies (and please no sermons from people saying Google aren't doing the job blah blah blah).

blairsp

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 6:22 pm on Jul 7, 2005 (gmt 0)

<snip>

Anyway getting back to your point. Use a free e-mail service such as, well actually I am sure you are more than capable of doing a G search for free e-mail. Or is that not the problem with gaining access to the sites? Personally like one of the above posters suggested I wouldn't bother with the hassle-life is indeed too short and we literally don't know what is around the corner.

[edited by: Jenstar at 6:38 pm (utc) on July 7, 2005]
[edit reason] Off topic, thanks [/edit]

beren

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 6:41 pm on Jul 7, 2005 (gmt 0)

Otherwise get on with improving your own sites and let others who get paid to do Google's work to catch up with the baddies (and please no sermons from people saying Google aren't doing the job blah blah blah).

No sermon, but it upsets me when I see this type of attitude at Webmasterworld. The "don't snitch, just work on your own sites" attitude. As users of the Internet, we have a responsibility to help make it a better place. If you see a burgler breaking into your neighbor's house, you don't think "I won't snitch; I just won't do any burglery myself and that's all anyone can ask."

I think anyone who spends much time on the web should try to report at least 5 AdSense sites a week to Google. It's the least we can do as citizens.

joeking

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 8:03 pm on Jul 7, 2005 (gmt 0)

beren, that was a sermon :-)

BeeDeeDubbleU

WebmasterWorld Senior Member beedeedubbleu us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 8:55 pm on Jul 7, 2005 (gmt 0)

A sermon? You must be Joeking :)

aaronpaul

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 9:07 pm on Jul 7, 2005 (gmt 0)


If you see a burgler breaking into your neighbor's house...

That's a stretch. I would say it's more like reporting your neighbor for stealing cable.

ownerrim

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 9:09 pm on Jul 7, 2005 (gmt 0)

Since click fraud discourages advertisers and influences bid rates, it's actually more like reporting someone for "stealing from you and me".

aaronpaul

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 9:20 pm on Jul 7, 2005 (gmt 0)

Sure, but that's no different than stealing cable. It causes prices to go up for everyone because the infrastructure still has to be built and supported whether your neighbor pays for it or not.

If you want to go out of your way to hunt down and report them, go for it - report some for me too. I have better ways to spend my time though, like taking care the things I have more control over.

ann

WebmasterWorld Senior Member ann us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 1:26 am on Jul 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

suppose they tapped into your cable and YOU were paying the bills? Would you report them then?

aaronpaul

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 3:03 am on Jul 8, 2005 (gmt 0)


suppose they tapped into your cable and YOU were paying the bills? Would you report them then?

No, I would offer to split the cost with them before I reported it. (-;

david_uk

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 5:46 am on Jul 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

If you want to dedicate yourself to being an unpaid Googlebuster you will need to register and check those sites out for yourself.
Otherwise get on with improving your own sites and let others who get paid to do Google's work to catch up with the baddies

The attitude that snitching on sites that blatantly encourage in click fraud is a much greater crime than the click fraud itself never fails to amaze me.

Just for the record, my site always apears in the top 3 of a google seach for my primary keyword, and in the top 10 on the vast majority of relevant searches. I get a lot of traffic, do pretty well out of adsense and don't have any competition in my niche that is even close. Even so, I am constantly updating and improving the site.

As to the reason of the post, I'm not a serial snitcher, I was just playing around with the idea briefly after jenstar posted about it a couple of days ago.

For the record, I think that if a site blatantly puts a message to click the ads/support the sponsors etc, then that is a clear violation of the tos - no shades of grey involved. Therefore I would applaud people that report them.

Also for the record, I don't think Google does a wonderful job at weeding them out. How do we find the sites? Simple - do a google search for "click on the google ads". What's to stop them having a bot that does this, checks to see if ads are being served. Have a team of people to look at, and deal with whatever the bot throws up. I don't believe it's down to us to do this.

I was really asking for some official input here. Is it worth reporting these sites to adsense or not?

James

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 5:59 am on Jul 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

You forgot about a graphic which tells people to click on them!

As people have commented, use your time and efforts to imtpove your lot and don't worry about Google

joeking

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 7:03 am on Jul 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

David, glad to have amazed you :)

Do you report every car that speeds past you on the motorway? Presumably not. You probably should though as a concerned citizen. Speeding kills. Google click fraud probably doesn't.

The reason you don't report every motoring offence is because you hopefully have better things to do. And there are so many offenders it would quickly consume your life. Even a suggestion to report just five a week would be a waste of your time.

If you want official input regarding your quest however, here's an idea. Ask Google directly.

BeeDeeDubbleU

WebmasterWorld Senior Member beedeedubbleu us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 9:12 am on Jul 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

For the record, I think that if a site blatantly puts a message to click the ads/support the sponsors etc, then that is a clear violation of the tos - no shades of grey involved. Therefore I would applaud people that report them.

Correct! Not only that but in these situations they are highlighting to people that they need only click the ads as opposed to looking at the content of the sites they link to. They are effectively teaching people how to steal from Adwords users. This is not just about helping Google. It's about about preserving the reputation of the whole PPC advertising industry for the long term.

And, if I were an Adwords user I think I may just be a teensy weensy bit upset about this ;)

joeking

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 9:42 am on Jul 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

Nobody doubts that webmasters who tell people to click ads are breaching Google's TOS.

Just as nobody doubts that cars exceeding the speed limit are breaking the law.

If you feel your time is best spent tracking them down on behalf of Google best of luck to you. Such is the beauty of living in a free world.

DoingItWell

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 10:23 am on Jul 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

joeking et al, so where is your personal limit, when you will actively do something against a criminal act in WebmasterWorld-related areas? The way I understand it, click fraud is - fraud?

I can understand that there are people on WebmasterWorld that care enough to want to do something, considering what they spend most of their time doing, and the economical interest they might have through adwords campaigns.

To me this discussion is about morals rather than specifics - of course you can wonder whether it is worth it going after click fraud, but if you want the whole adsense/adwords system to work, you need to have confidence in it, and these fraudsters attack this confidence.

joeking

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 11:56 am on Jul 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

Why is it that when you ask for no sermons, the preachers appear? ;)

"To me this discussion is about morals rather than specifics"

I think we are in danger of getting carried away here.

When it comes to the web and morals, click fraud is so far down the list it isn't funny.

By all means chase down those webmasters who so obviously offend you. And expect cheers from some parts of the webmasterworld gallery for doing so. Do whatever it is that you feel utilises your time to the max.

I have a dog that chases cyclists. He hasn't caught one yet, but good luck to him for trying. I have nothing against him chasing them. He enjoys it. I just don't feel the need to join in. But that's just me.

(please, no sermons from cyclists . . . )

Buzliteyear

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 7740 posted 4:50 pm on Jul 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

I agree 100% with david_uk.

In a manner, everyone with AdSense is part of the same company, and we all have a stake in the company's success. Reporting fellow employees who are stealing from the company should not be viewed at "ratting" or something similar.

When I first joined this forum and saw posts about turning in AdSense cheats, I would laugh. I thought it was a ridiculous waste of time.

Today, I'm glad to see these posts.

Google is being sued by AdWords advertisers for click fraud. Events like this hitting being covered in the media benefit no one here.

I'm not saying that I spend all day reseraching for violators, but if I happend to see one, I do let Google know.

The ads that show up on our sites are from a limited inventory. Fraudsters eat up the inventory of ads, thereby leaving us with lesser paying ads.

Estimates of click fraud range from 20% to 38% as claimed in the G lawsuit. This means that if an advertiser (which I also am) allows for 100 ads, between 20 and 38 of them are bogus.

So, IMHO, Go Get um!

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