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Confusing PSA behaviour
...are PSAs paying?
james007




msg:1431869
 10:14 pm on Sep 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

Just seen tonight on my site...

I have the banners on most of my site.
On the banner, I saw...

[ PSA for working abroad ¦ Perfectly targeted ad ]

Now, to me, I'd have expected the most expensive ad to have been on the left, not the right; which almost makes me wonder whether the PSA I saw, for a registered charity, was actually paying for their spot? How bizarre.

 

Sense_able




msg:1431870
 10:23 pm on Sep 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

I mean are these PSA really PSA's has it ever been confirmed that they are PSA's

Or are they just really brong ads that fill in when the pages have not been indexed.

Blue_Fin




msg:1431871
 10:56 pm on Sep 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

Right click on the ad and click on Properties. If it's just a URL for the charity, you are not being paid.

danny




msg:1431872
 11:44 pm on Sep 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

Charities do advertise!

But there seem to be only a very small number of PSAs being run - I haven't tried to enumerate them, but it might be as few as 6 and I'd be surprised if it were more than 12.

Habitat for Humanity
Peace Corps
American Cancer Society
Donate to Charity
National PTA

All, incidentally, Amerian charities, which is one of the things I've been hoping they'd improve since the program started.

Sharper




msg:1431873
 12:43 am on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

The American charities does make some financial sense for Google. They are a U.S. company, so they file taxes in the U.S. and they may be claiming the extra ad space as a "donation" on their taxes. Also, "media" companies in the U.S. (like elsewhere, I imagine) have a tradition of filling out extra ad slots with PSAs.

What I dislike is that I don't agree with some of the goals and actions of some of the PSAs. I'd much rather be able to choose my own charities, or at least a wider list of charities... like say, exclude those from my site that are politically active in trying to restrict my freedom.

Blue_Fin




msg:1431874
 1:19 am on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

The charities listed are not advertising. Google is simply providing the space as a public service to them.

justageek




msg:1431875
 1:39 am on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

Anyone know how a charity gets listed there? Is it pay for placement or does Google just decide for themselves?

JAG

hyperkik




msg:1431876
 6:49 am on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

Google is simply providing the space as a public service to them.

I know that if I ran Google, I would try to find a way to get a tax deduction for running the ads. (This is not to say that Google does obtain a tax deduction - it's simply what I would advise them to try to do if I were their tax lawyer or accountant.)

MiG25




msg:1431877
 7:06 am on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

Speaking of PSAs, has anybody noticed new PSA ads?

Asian Developing Nations
The Green Guide
Pregnancy Weight Gain
Literacy Cambodia
Are you a new dad?

Etc...

birdstuff




msg:1431878
 10:17 am on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

They are a U.S. company, so they file taxes in the U.S. and they may be claiming the extra ad space as a "donation" on their taxes.

The problem is the extra ad space they're serving the PSAs in is supplied by the publisher, not Google. IF what you say is true, Google gets a tax advantage by giving away our ad space. We should at least have a say in which PSAs are displayed on our sites.

chiyo




msg:1431879
 10:44 am on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

>>Google gets a tax advantage by giving away our ad space. We should at least have a say in which PSAs are displayed on our sites<<

From where I sit it is googles ad space. You just sold it to them. I guess it is up to you whether you like what they show on the ad space you just sold to them and/or the revenue overall, by terminating the agreement or continuing on.

On the other hand it may have advantages to both to have more relevant PSA ads showing for sites with significant non-US visitors.

WebWalla




msg:1431880
 11:05 am on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

>Speaking of PSAs, has anybody noticed new PSA ads?

Yep - I thought they were extremly poorly targeted ads on my site at first. I bet a whole load of new charities are currently trying to get their webs into AdSense for the free publicity right now.

birdstuff




msg:1431881
 12:54 pm on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

From where I sit it is googles ad space. You just sold it to them. I guess it is up to you whether you like what they show on the ad space you just sold to them and/or the revenue overall, by terminating the agreement or continuing on.

No, it's my ad space. I allow Google to use that ad space in exchange for a commission earned on each click-through (PSA ads excluded).

I'm actually very happy with the arrangement (and the AdSense terms) overall. That's why I accepted the terms. That doesn't mean that I'm happy with everything that I agreed to in the terms. And just because I accepted the TOS overall doesn't mean that it's unfair to point out specific areas that are unfair and hope for a change.

The "like it or leave it" type of response does little to help anyone. Discussing problem areas that exist within an overall exceptional program may or may not help (time will tell), but it also doesn't hurt.

At the end of the day, it makes little difference in any meaningful way to my bottom line if Google places a free PSA ad or 2 on my site. But it is annoying when the publisher who owns the space has no say on which free ads are placed. And just because I agree to allow them to do it by accepting their TOS overall doesn't mean that I forfeit my right to express my displeasure with individual parts of it.

jrstark




msg:1431882
 2:41 pm on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

> >Speaking of PSAs, has anybody noticed new PSA ads?

> Yep - I thought they were extremly poorly targeted ads on my site at first. I bet a whole load of new charities are currently trying to get their webs into AdSense for the free publicity right now.

I had been getting and blocking teaching your kid to read ads, and thought that Literacy Cambodia was another badly targetted one.

I really wish we could get targetted charities.

chiyo




msg:1431883
 3:53 pm on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

hi birdstuff. it looks like we will just have to agree to disagree. I made no comment on your right to comment to express your displeasure, and this is the right place to do it and come up with suggestions. O just that i felt that your claim to "ownership" was illogical, just like a building developer does when they lease out retail space - they allow a second party to run their own business from a part of the building within certain contractural agreements. It didnt "fly" with me for one.

Google is clear that PSA results WILL appear when you signed up. I agree it would be great to have less PSA's, but arguing that it is still "your" space where you want more control than your contract with google suggests, does not seem very logical.

The only thing you can do following this strategy is to go back and renegotiate the terms of your leasing space to google.

justageek




msg:1431884
 4:35 pm on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

Actually, it states that the PSA's 'may' show up and only under two circumstances. Anything else to cause PSA's to show up is flat out wrong on their part and goes against what they say they will do with the ad space. Assuming that Google is not violating their own TOS then the only explanation for sites that have been spidered and did show targeted ads that suddenly change to PSA's and then back again is that the advertiser pool is shrinking. Either way Google is in a pickle from my view.

JAG

hyperkik




msg:1431885
 5:41 pm on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

I have a problem with the March of Dimes charity PSA's (where you can't tell it's a charity ad unless you look at the URL), and to some degree with the Literacy Cambodia "plan your trip of a lifetime" PSA content.

For the March of Dimes ads, it is my sentiment that if the charity isn't paying for the ad, I think it should be clear that the ad is for a charity. For the Literacy Cambodia ad, as its "trip planner" content is peripheral to its charitable activity, I would just as soon not have that content advertised on my site for free.

james007




msg:1431886
 11:52 pm on Sep 24, 2003 (gmt 0)

It is a valid argument, I think, for charity ads to say so - just as affiliate ads have to make that clear.

After all; if I think that I will charge the American Red Cross a few cents if I click on the Google ad, I might not...

dougb




msg:1431887
 12:06 am on Sep 25, 2003 (gmt 0)

Assuming that Google is not violating their own TOS then the only explanation for sites that have been spidered and did show targeted ads that suddenly change to PSA's and then back again is that the advertiser pool is shrinking.

Don't forget, supply is increasing very rapidly as people join AdSense, particularly for "hot" industries. I think supply is clearly increasing faster than the demand for AdWords in this early stage of AdSense. So naturally there are more and more cases when a valid advertiser cannot be found and a PSA must be shown.

justageek




msg:1431888
 12:20 am on Sep 25, 2003 (gmt 0)

particularly for "hot" industries

Yep. There will always be hot industries and there will always especially be the advertisers who figure out that by simply putting their name or url in the advertisement will most certainly get the 'branding' effect even if they don't get a click. Free advertising if you will.

JAG

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