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This 39 message thread spans 2 pages: 39 ( [1] 2 > >     
The dreaded email..
liestol




msg:1462135
 9:11 am on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

Wow, just checked my email to see that adsense has blocked my account for invalid clicks. After all the reading and whatnot on this forum, I've seen that 99% of the sites closed has in fact clicked their own ads/asked their users etc to do so and so on. Well, I haven't done anything like that - I run a 4000+ users forum, so some of those might be responsible for this..I've emailed google back, I will let you all know how it works out!

 

frox




msg:1462136
 9:28 am on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

Sorry to hear that
What, oh what can we do to avoid this...

roycerus




msg:1462137
 9:40 am on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

Is it because of the new update on "no chat page" policy?
How much did your forum earn. You can specify a range if you are not comfortable disclosing the exac amount.

R

Nikke




msg:1462138
 10:01 am on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

If it indeed was the "invalid clicks" mail it shouldn't be about the chat policy (which I find hard to believe would be implemented on forum pages anyhow).

That type of violation usually renders you a warning.

Have you searched your forum pages for any posts that talks about the ads?

liestol




msg:1462139
 10:02 am on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

No, it was not running on any chat pages. I was making 700-800$ a month, and just bought a dedicated server which is going to be hard to keep paying without adsense (I am a college student).

edit: I found one member that had "click the ads" (no idea why) in his signature 2 weeks ago or so, I promptly removed it and haven't found anything after that (I do regular searches).

roycerus




msg:1462140
 10:19 am on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

Hmm... Could be anything really. I have taken a few measures to avoid invalid clicks.

*I do not display adsense to logged in members. Just visitors and search engine hits.
*If I make any changes I make sure to talk to a adsense rep. So that they can review it and tell me if there are any problems.

~Always be honest about the content ads. Try to think when and where the users can find it useful. My clickthroughs are low but conversions are decent.

But seriously you don't need to worry too much about it. Try adsonar for now and Yahoo or MSN will soon be launching their own version of adsense. But I am unsure if they will allow forums.

Regards,
R

entropicus




msg:1462141
 10:30 am on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

from all these sorts of posts, the thing that they have in common, is that the majority of them seem to be forum sites. I wonder if this is just a coincidence, or google doesnt like them?

roycerus




msg:1462142
 10:48 am on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

I guess it's mainly because forums tend to have more numbers of repeated visitors and is prone to repeat visitors. Which is why I think the smart pricing is a good thing which let's advertiser costs down. But maybe the problem is that google is not profiting as much as they would want to from these sites unless they are extremely targeted.

Regards,
R

liestol




msg:1462143
 11:26 am on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

Yeah, I'm looking forward to Yahoo/MSN (if they support forums, that is). I'll be waiting for a reply from google, I told them they can take away whatever earnings where made from these "invalid clicks", also said they can reset all my earnings if that would make them happy..My CTR was very low, .1 to .3% roughly, I was having 50 clicks or so a day..I haven't checked my account since 2 days ago, so I have no way of checking the CTR for the last 2 days (those days could be the reason). I'll just wait for the response from Google before I try any other program.

Thanks for all the replies folks :)

dcmginc




msg:1462144
 12:38 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

Wow.. guess what I just got?! The same email! For over a year I've read on here about people losing their accounts on this site. I never thought it would happen to me. I guess I just had a feeling that if you lost your account you were doing something to lose it. I get this email today and I'm just sick at the thought because I don't know what happened. I don't think there is anything that I can ask to get the answers I need. This email clearly states invalid clicks so I know its not some other violation of the TOS. I wasn't able to log into my account the last couple of days so I didn't notice any strange activity.

On my site I still have the ads showing. I would have thought they'd disable the ads so they wouldn't appear if my accounts has been "disabled".

joebiff




msg:1462145
 1:07 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

dcmginc- did your site have a forum or chat? What would you think caused the cancelation?

oddsod




msg:1462146
 1:10 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

This email clearly states invalid clicks so I know its not some other violation of the TOS.

As a browse through previous threads here will reveal - they provide only one reason, invalid clicks, irrespective of why they've really closed your account.

dcmginc




msg:1462147
 1:27 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

I have about 4 different websites ... 1 of them is a forum. My past experience with G is that they'd give you a warning/bring it to your attention first. For example.. I had a video on one of my other sites that G considered to be inappropriate content. I got a nice email asking me to remove the Adsense from that area of the site. I did and responded. That was about a year ago. I'd like to think that G would still handle this the same way. I'm taking the angle from one of the earlier posts that said that it should have been a warning offense and not a termination/disable. Chat sites and forums are two different things IMO. I've had this account for about 15-16 months and was averaging between $1800 - $2500 a month. It would seem to me that if I'm making that, then G is making more then that off me. Wouldn't it serve them right to just provide a warning if it wasn't actually clicks that got this shut down?

All in all... there is a little piece of me that feels relieved. I was getting so angry with the earnings over the last couple of months and so far this month I had only earned $325 but I had more clicks and traffic then the previous months. Now I don't feel the need to run to the computer first thing in the morning to check the stats and get angry when I see that they're only a fraction of what I was getting. :)

esllou




msg:1462148
 1:38 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

we have discussed the "invalid clicks" terminology to death on these forums.

If you break the ToS, in whatever way G deems to be "breaking", then ANY clicks at that point can be termed "invalid".

If you live in DooDooStan and G has plainly stated they don't allow Doodoostanians to run AS, then every click you send them is "invalid" as far as they are concerned.

it does NOT mean only that someone or yourself has been clicking ads in an inappropriate manner.

somerset




msg:1462149
 1:49 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

whew, not worth the risk - I've just removed adsense from my forums. Fortunately, these pages only made up a small amount of traffic.

Zygoot




msg:1462150
 1:53 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

After reading this I removed Adsense from one of my forums and replaced it with Adsonar.

It's a low traffic board so those few dollars a month aren't worth the risk.

security56




msg:1462151
 2:22 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

Umm, why are people removing the ads from their forums? I think there is nothing in the TOS that says we canít have ads on forums, I hope not :). Anyways if adsense policy has change, which I think hasnít, then a lot of big sites such as phpbb.com and others would had too remove adsense, And I donít think Google wants that :)

About the invalid clicks, Well this is how I see, I donít think Google will cancel you if someone else besides you click on the ads with bad intensions. I think they smarter then that. If they did then a lot of accounts would be cancel by this method.

JuniorOptimizer




msg:1462152
 2:23 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

What a ridiculous ad program. You get kicked out without trial and people are "afraid" to place the ads on forum pages.

Living under the thumb of the Google regime is getting tougher every day. Luckily they kicked me out early on and let me back in. I realized to just not count their revenue at all and use it as a bonus.

roycerus




msg:1462153
 2:29 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

REALLY!
I run a few forums and they are a targetted group. Unless your website is JUST a forum [i.e: you don't use a forum for product support or something] you should keep them.
If your forum is targeted you should not have much trouble with invalid clicks or low conversion problems. Recently one of my forums got sponsored and adsense became 25% of the revenue from that site. And the ad agency which was responsible for choosing my site was a BIG one [so they are no fools who would throw away money]. So you see forums do give advertisers very targeted viewership and converts well if you have built the forum well.

Regards,
R

JuniorOptimizer




msg:1462154
 2:31 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

Forum traffic is excellent traffic, some of the best you can get.

AdSense just does a lousy job of displaying ads is all. Forums should be big money-makers and selling ads to sponsors is a great idea.

frox




msg:1462155
 2:32 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

JuniorOptimizer: Are you really a "re-born"?
I mean, did you really manage to get back in?
Can you give us more details on your case?

That's a quite interesting issue, I had always thought that, as a deterrent, G had a line of "once you are out, you stay out".

roycerus




msg:1462156
 2:46 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

Well said security56,
If I was larry page. I would tell those PHD masterminds to make sure that noone gets booted by fluke!
Surely there can be many attempts by your competitors..

ah! ads I seeee... very niceeee... click click click... No more revenue for you boy! now we shall rule! hahahahahahaha!

Nope don't think Google has NOT taken such situations into account. This is BASIC click fraud and must have been the first thing they must have thought of.

moneyraker




msg:1462157
 3:06 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

Every time I read a thread like this I grow more paranoid about being kicked out of G. One of my websites have several articles that came from websites that offer free articles. Is posting Adsense Ads on these 'free' articles ok? Of course, my site also has a lot of original articles. I just want to make sure though...

itisgene




msg:1462158
 3:24 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

Forums tend to have repeated visitors.
If Google records the IPs, etc to track the click behaviors, they will find that many clicks come from the same users over the time period. Whether those are valid or invalid clicks, Google doesn't care much. Google just disable the account if those clicks from the same people go over certain threshold.

I removed Adsense from my forum site long time ago not from a fear but from economic value. It wasn't make money anyways.

That's why I like new visitors to my sites... Less worries about repeated clicks from the same users.

europeforvisitors




msg:1462159
 3:45 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

people are "afraid" to place the ads on forum pages.

That fear may be reasonable in some cases. We've seen other reports of forum members causing problems for site owners.

Sponsorships may be a safer method of earning revenue from forums.

Also, as has been discussed ad infinitum on these boards, "invalid clicks" can encompass more than fraud. For example, it's possible that Google might disable an account if the site was generating a lot of clicks from an audience (such as children) that didn't have the power to make a purchase decision and charge a transaction to a credit card. Those clicks might not be fraudulent, but they'd be "invalid" from an advertiser's perspective.

If your forum is targeted you should not have much trouble with invalid clicks or low conversion problems....So you see forums do give advertisers very targeted viewership and converts well if you have built the forum well.

Again, it depends on the audience. And let's face it: Not all forums are well managed. Many are filled with copyright violations (such as the use of third-party images without permission), and that in itself is a violation of Google's AdSense TOS.

dcmginc




msg:1462160
 3:48 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

I agree with JuniorOptimizer... this program has become quite ridiculous. Its only going to get worst as it gets bigger.

To all those who are removing their ads from forums... why doesn't someone just email G and ask if forums are classified under chat sites?

I'm finding it really hard to not respond to the email I got. I feel like I should just to ask, but I know that I'll get a canned reply that will do me no good in the long run.

freeflight2




msg:1462161
 4:29 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

liestol: did you put adsense on login / logout or other "exit" pages?
As an advertiser on the adsense content network I see my ads on logout pages all the time and it's very easy to detect them in the logfiles.

liestol




msg:1462162
 8:35 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

No, I read the ToS and I removed my ads from all login/registration/thank you/whatever pages. I agree, adsense is becoming a bit..well, nazish, but that's just my opinion..I'll wait for their mail and ask them to clarify a bit as to what went wrong, and I've pretty much given up my hope about getting it back after reading a lot of similar threads..One fun fact; The day before I got the email, I added the new AdLinks..No idea if that had anything to with it or not though.

incrediBILL




msg:1462163
 9:17 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

I donít think Google will cancel you if someone else besides you click on the ads with bad intensions. I think they smarter then that.

Oh the pain, I'm convulsing in laughter.... you really give those PhDs too much credit.

I guess overall I'm concerned that Google simply doesn't ban the source of the clicks, or disclose the IP address so you can block the culprits. I've heard their nonsense about not being able to divulge IPs, but it was a visitor on YOUR web site, you already KNOW the IPs, you just don't know which of the IPs clicked like crazy on a Google Ad.

Considering this sometimes involves serious amounts of real money I would expect this situation to overflow into a California courtroom before long and/or some legislation on the books to handle such disputes so that the publishers have recourse.

HughMungus




msg:1462164
 9:22 pm on Mar 16, 2005 (gmt 0)

If you break the ToS, in whatever way G deems to be "breaking", then ANY clicks at that point can be termed "invalid".

Really?

I wonder if the original poster had not invalid clicks, but, some other kind of TOS violation (adult content, adult language, disallowed website/forum theme, etc.).

This 39 message thread spans 2 pages: 39 ( [1] 2 > >
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