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Adsense Fraud
Google Adsense fraudulent clicks and sucks
Commission King




msg:1460283
 1:40 am on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

Ok, Here's a question.
How many people have been reinbursed on their adwords accounts for fraudulent clicks?

Anyone?

I here google ****ing alot about fraudlent clicks, kicking out good webmasters for no reason and keeping all the money they earned, but I've yet to receive even 1 penny back on my adwords account. Now if google adsense is so rampant with fraudulent clicks, where the heck is my refund on my adwords account?

 

Jenstar




msg:1460284
 1:52 am on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

I don't think that there is a widespread problem with AdSense kicking publishers out of the program - I just tend to think that those who have been booted are the vocal minority. It is hardly a rampant problem at all, IMO.

You aren't as likely to see a post saying "Wow, Google is great, they just sent me a check for $xxxx.xx" Those who are no longer with AdSense are no longer bound by the TOS, so they are more likely to speak freely of their experiences with it.

As for refunds on AdWords account, you might want to ask that question in the AdWords forum and you will get a better response.

europeforvisitors




msg:1460285
 2:06 am on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

Also, fraudulent clicks aren't exclusive to AdSense. A competitor might repeatedly click an AdWord on a SERP to drain the advertiser's account, and someone with a grudge against the advertiser might do the same.

If anything, that type of fraudulent clicking is more likely to occur on SERPs (where the advertiser's ads will be easier to find).

As for the allegation that Google is "kicking out good webmasters for no reason and keeping all the money they earned," I agree with Jenstar. It's hard to draw a statistically valid conclusion from a small number of complaints--anonymous complaints, at that--on Webmaster World.

valortrade




msg:1460286
 2:09 am on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

I don't think that there is a widespread problem with AdSense kicking publishers out of the program - I just tend to think that those who have been booted are the vocal minority. It is hardly a rampant problem at all, IMO.

Hard to totally agree. Except Google, who knows! Considering the posts here, this pitfall could turn out worse.

You aren't as likely to see a post saying "Wow, Google is great, they just sent me a check for $xxxx.xx" Those who are no longer with AdSense are no longer bound by the TOS, so they are more likely to speak freely of their experiences with it.

First, no one expects to see such a post. It totally against Google's TOS. I hope that no one would make such a try after see your post.

Second, do you really think that Google would first send out 4-digit check and then announce you would be booted? No way!

Jenstar




msg:1460287
 2:22 am on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

Valortrade - I think you might have misread my second paragraph of my post. To clarify, what I meant is that you are not going to see a post of someone stating they received a 4 figure check because they are bound by the TOS. And people earning those figures are going to want to fly under the radar, so to speak. But that is why the forum seems skewed towards those who CAN say "I earned X amount with AdSense, they booted my for fraud, and now they aren't paying me," like we have seen in the fraudulent clicks thread.

Anyone who is earning 4 figures should know better than to state those specifics, and I was in no way encouraging people to do that. But that is precisely why you won't see it on these boards.

do you really think that Google would first send out 4-digit check and then announce you would be booted?

That actually isn't what I said, but now that you bring it up, that scenario probably will happen where someone has earned money for several months, received checks, and then is suspended for "fraudulent clicks/impressions".

valortrade




msg:1460288
 2:44 am on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

I think you might have misread my second paragraph of my post.

I wish no anyone would "misread" your message. You know it would be impossible but you set this kind of scenario in your post to respond other's post!? Reasonable?

loanuniverse




msg:1460289
 2:57 am on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

I frequent several webmaster boards and I can count less than a dozen people booted from the program. On the other hand, I know that thousands of sites are on board. I don't think there is rampant booting or fraudulent clicking.

I also think a lot of webmasters are happy with the program.

Jenstar




msg:1460290
 3:07 am on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

you set this kind of scenario in your post to respond other's post!?

I stated the scenario because Commission King said he was hearing a lot about AdSense fraud. I simply stated why AdSense fruad & fraudulent clicks would seem to be a widespread problem when reading through the AdSense forum, because of all the people stating they have received the fraudulent clicks/impressions email. I can see why AdWords advertisers could be worried about the financial cost of AdSense fraud, but I don't feel it is as big of a problem as some would believe.

As with any program, those who have a problem with it for wahtever reason are going to be much more vocal about their dissatisfaction than those who are happily making money. If AdSense was two-teir, we'd probably hear much more from people saying how great it is ;)

valortrade




msg:1460291
 3:08 am on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

I frequent several webmaster boards and I can count less than a dozen people booted from the program.

I doubt that the actual situation would be worse than what you simply counted the claims from different boards/forums. Not everyone did that.

I also think a lot of webmasters are happy with the program.

As what I said in other threads, I do feel great with Adsense, with the current payout rate and earning that is just an extra "gift" adding to our normal operation.

But meantime, I do have a little worry for Adsense program after I saw some "targeted" posts here.

valortrade




msg:1460292
 3:17 am on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

If AdSense was two-teir, we'd probably hear much more from people saying how great it is ;)

Of course, it would be great for me (as publisher/webmaster) as an extra revenue source. But sorry, I have not heard any direct positive comment from the advertisers except that "we have opted out the Adsense ...".

Compared with SE ads, I already heard too many "human efforts" being added to sites targeting those content-based ads. This does worry me a little bit and just makes it harder for advertiers to establish confidence to this brand new program.

europeforvisitors




msg:1460293
 5:06 am on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

Of course, it would be great for me (as publisher/webmaster) as an extra revenue source. But sorry, I have not heard any direct positive comment from the advertisers except that "we have opted out the Adsense ...".

I don't think you can opt out of AdSense per se; I think you have to opt out of content ads altogether (i.e., AdSense and "content partner" ads on large news/entertainment/portal sites).

Still, that's a technicality. If you haven't seen any positive comments, you must have missed the thread titled "Search ads vs. content ads: a case history" at:

[webmasterworld.com...]

valortrade




msg:1460294
 12:56 pm on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

Still, that's a technicality. If you haven't seen any positive comments, you must have missed the thread titled "Search ads vs. content ads: a case history" at:

[webmasterworld.com...]

I did read that case before and I did not intend to respond that thread because it would be a little meaningless. Now that it was referred here again, I just add my comment here.

I think you missed something if you had read that case carefully, at least you only referred the numbers but not referred when and there the data came from.

First, "Greer started seeing more clickthroughs on Impact Engine when Google added Content-Targeted Advertising earlier this year.". So, the data were based on earlier content-targeted advertising results. I could clearly tell it was before Google launched Adsense program in later June.

When Google first kicked off content-targeted advertising earlier this year (in March?), only limited large portals were qualified for that. Not our site, probably yours too. I have not seen Google updated that case since Adsense went live. If you would have an opportunity to talk with Mr. Greer, probably he would have different story to tell you, considering so many "creative sites" plus even two-digit CTR.

Also, please notice that you could not find single "Adsense" world in that case, probably due to the above reason.

PLEASE DO NOT REFER THIS CASE AGAIN IN ANY ADSENSE-RELATED DISCUSSION!

I hope that Google could update/edit some Adsense-related cases to help advertisers to establish confidence!

loanuniverse




msg:1460295
 3:01 pm on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

By the Way, there is an article on today's New York Times that talks about the Adsense program and has an account for an advertiser that is getting higher conversion through adsense content partners than through Google's search results.

Check the discussion about it and the link here:

[webmasterworld.com...]

So there! actual info from an actual advertiser :)

europeforvisitors




msg:1460296
 3:23 pm on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

PLEASE DO NOT REFER THIS CASE AGAIN IN ANY ADSENSE-RELATED DISCUSSION!

1) Please don't shout.

2) Unless you're the moderator, don't tell me what I can or can't refer to in a discussion of AdSense.

3) The case history is relevant to any discussion of "search only ads" vs. "search plus content ads," since AdSense ads are content ads and advertisers can't choose between large corporate partners and AdSense partners when deciding whether to use content ads.

I hope that Google could update/edit some Adsense-related cases to help advertisers to establish confidence!

I'm sure they will, but give 'em time: it's early days yet.

valortrade




msg:1460297
 4:02 pm on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

1) Please don't shout.

2) Unless you're the moderator, don't tell me what I can or can't refer to in a discussion of AdSense.

Only allow you to post, prohibit me from shouting?

I just hope everyone could take a little time after seeing any post. Think again whether it would make sense!

Shak




msg:1460298
 4:51 pm on Aug 4, 2003 (gmt 0)

I think that only a very small minority of adsense members are here at webmasterworld, the majority are elsewhere ;)

but back to the original topic starter, a number of adwords advertisers are reularly credited if/when fraud is discovered.

suppose thats the reason that ALL logs should be kept for accounting purposes, and issues raised with the relevant advertising house.

Shak

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