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This 34 message thread spans 2 pages: 34 ( [1] 2 > >     
Public Proxy - accidental mistake
toldan




msg:1357183
 3:44 am on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

I just accidentially signed into my adsense account with public proxy (forgot to turn it off). Who knows how many thousands people used exactly the same proxy to access the internet, and possibly my site.

Should I say goodbye to my account?

 

Tearabite




msg:1357184
 4:28 am on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

my guess would be that people saavy enough to use a public proxy proably arent much of ad-clickers..

add to that the percentage of the people that use that proxy who happen to find YOUR site and THEN click your ads..

i would not worry much.. unless there is some other reason that i'm missing..

toldan




msg:1357185
 4:49 am on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

my guess would be that people saavy enough to use a public proxy proably arent much of ad-clickers..
add to that the percentage of the people that use that proxy who happen to find YOUR site and THEN click your ads..

i would not worry much.. unless there is some other reason that i'm missing..

Thank you for your words of encouragement. I went to check "my ip" under proxy, and it does not show "proxy ip" nor does it show "my ip", but it shows different "IP#". It says "many proxies detected". What if this was some kind of chain of 10-20 proxies, and Google detects all of them? Usually, in overhelming number of cases, "real IP#" is detectable under proxies.

How stupid can I be, I forgot to turn my proxies off after I visited adult forums.

I just downloaded logs for today (27 megabytes download! big one!) and I couldn't find anybody with that proxy ip# visiting my website, which is good.

What if someone visited and clicked yesterday? or the day before yesterday? or maybe last week? or last month? or last year?

Or maybe I am just being too panicky. Google is not that stupid. They know that people log from many places (offices, restaurants, airplanes, whatever). Right? We should trust Google and their wisdom, they are not stupid, right?

jomaxx




msg:1357186
 4:58 am on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

No, they're far from stupid. In fact they're probably aware that it's a proxy and that therefore past clicks did not necessarily come from you.

jetteroheller




msg:1357187
 5:20 am on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

Computers are not only identified by IP,
but also by

cookie
Google toolbar
combination of OS, screen resolution, browser

toldan




msg:1357188
 5:51 am on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

Computers are not only identified by IP,
but also by
cookie
Google toolbar
combination of OS, screen resolution, browser

hey, that's a good point.

toldan




msg:1357189
 5:52 am on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

No, they're far from stupid. In fact they're probably aware that it's a proxy and that therefore past clicks did not necessarily come from you.

I will send them an email and see what they have to say. At least I am being honest with them, hope they value my honesty.

Seo1




msg:1357190
 12:25 pm on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)


Dumb question maybe... but where is it written that logging into your Adsense account through proxy is grounds for a ban?

That sounds like rumor to me. I can go down the street log in from relatives house, friends, school, library.

I can log in from Kinkos office supply which is neither my computer or network.

I think you may be confusing things a bit.

Clicking Ads from Proxy IP addresss might be an issue but then how does Google deal with AOL?

Peace

marcel




msg:1357191
 1:00 pm on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

Exactly Seo1, I suffered about 6 month without any internet connection at all, logging in from Work, Internet Cafes, Open WiFi Connections etc.

Now I only have Dial-Up and connect through the OnSpeed Proxies with thousands of others. And I also connect to the Adsense control panel while at work while there is a link on the Corporate Intranet to my Website.

I have never had a problem with this, and I think that you should be fine with G (if you are an honest publisher)

BillyS




msg:1357192
 2:33 pm on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

>>I just accidentially signed into my adsense account with public proxy (forgot to turn it off).

I'd worry if I were you. Do you have a lot of clicks coming from that proxy server's IP range?

Sorry to be so blunt here, but when I see posts like this I alway wonder why someone is worried about being banned. I know why a lot of folks use proxy servers and it's usually not for the right reasons.

Google's pretty smart and they sometimes count on these types of "accidents" to help clean house. If you're clean, don't sweat it. If you've been playing games, then say goodbye to you Adsense account.

humblebeginnings




msg:1357193
 3:03 pm on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

Toldan, I think it should be OK. You go way back with Adsense and if they have any questions I'm sure you can explain. But I guess they won't bother you about this.

"How stupid can I be, I forgot to turn my proxies off after I visited adult forums."

The only stupid thing is you told us you visit adult forums. Nana-nanana, Toldan is a naughty boy!

saraah




msg:1357194
 4:27 pm on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

Unlike our judicial system where if there is reasonable doubt a person is found not guilty - I think Google works the other way around. If they have reasonable doubt, they'll disable the account - With new publishers trying new tricks everyday - I would guess Google cannot afford to give the benefit of the doubt to the publisher.


You go way back with Adsense and if they have any questions

Does Google really take into consideration how long you've been with AS when they review your case for fraudulent clicks.

--Sarah

Seo1




msg:1357195
 4:51 pm on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

Hi there

Actually I will come to Googles defense and hopefully set the record straight. (Also this should shed some light on duplicate content filter)

First some ground work. I joined Adsense when first available at the end of 2003? I think it was..Others may be better able to refresh my memory. I had Adsense applied on one site, that was my first foray online. It didn't earn much and I hadn't at the time given it much thought.

In June of last year I went at it in earnest started reading everything, tried and tested things, and by December found a site where I could expand Adsense.

I now have two sites that earn me close to $1,000.00 per month.

I also have three very small websites which do not earn more than $20.00 per month at this time. These are baking for rankings in a few months.

One of those sites is designed to teach others how to use Adsense to earn revenues.

Now in my infinite wisdom I though I could clip Google's Adsense page found here

https://www.google.com/support/adsense/bin/static.py?page=tips.html&sourceid=aso&subid=ww-ww-et-asui&medium=link

Split it into two pages on my site and of course monetized it. The site went live in Mid February 2006.

Last week ( Mid April 2006) a little over 60 days since my Adsense help site went live, I received a letter from Google informing me that due to my TOS violations, (taking their content) Ads would no longer be shown on my site that was in violation.

Things learned:

1. Dupe content filter works well. However like all things Google on the organic or paid side, it takes time for G to discover things.

2. Google is not an evil empire out to ban sites for violating their TOS.

3. The violation will determine whether an outright ban or a smacking of the wrist will be dealt.

4. Making assumptions and claiming people will be banned for issues people are not sure of, is poor advice.

5. If you are doing things without evil intent. you have little to worry about other than a letter scolding you.

6. One mistake on one site does not damage your network of websites.

I hope this helps.

Peace

saraah




msg:1357196
 5:13 pm on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

Thanks for the insight SEO.

I thought if you have violated any TOS, your entire AS account is disabled. Infact I even know few people who had a network of 10 sites and if fraudulent clicks occurred on one site, their entire AS account was disabled.

But I guess its different. Your case is not the case of fraudulent clicks.

Thanks for sharing!

Seo1




msg:1357197
 8:35 pm on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

Hi saraah

You are of course correct, my case does not involve fraudulent clicks.

It is also something I did not know, was they would ban the whole network of sites.

That I think is poor practice... but without knowing whether more than one site on the network had fraudulent clicks, hard to make a case for or against.

I am glad I could help you learn something new as well.

Peace

Hobbs




msg:1357198
 9:03 pm on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

Sounds you will be ok toldan so don't send any panic emails.

Putting myself in Google's Billion dollar shoes:
I would ban small potatoes for small or big violations,
ban big fries for major violations only,
and ban ANYONE for click fraud.

I have been putting off taking my laptop to wifi joints
for this reason, in addition to security of course,
very inconvenient, but too much to risk.

toldan




msg:1357199
 11:36 pm on Apr 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

Seo1 said:
Clicking Ads from Proxy IP addresss might be an issue but then how does Google deal with AOL?

Doesn't one AOL account = 1 IP address? (I never dealt with AOL, so I don't really know).

marcel said:
Exactly Seo1, I suffered about 6 month without any internet connection at all, logging in from Work, Internet Cafes, Open WiFi Connections etc.

Now I only have Dial-Up and connect through the OnSpeed Proxies with thousands of others. And I also connect to the Adsense control panel while at work while there is a link on the Corporate Intranet to my Website.

Wow! Cool! I mean, you did it probably hundreds of times, and nothing happened? Cool!

BillyS said:
I'd worry if I were you. Do you have a lot of clicks coming from that proxy server's IP range?

Sorry to be so blunt here, but when I see posts like this I alway wonder why someone is worried about being banned. I know why a lot of folks use proxy servers and it's usually not for the right reasons.


Hahaha, good try Billy. I checked my server logs for yesterday, and none of that proxy server's IP ranges visited my site (but these logs were only for yesterday!).

humblebeginnings said:
The only stupid thing is you told us you visit adult forums. Nana-nanana, Toldan is a naughty boy!

hey, got2 use proxies for adult forums as another form of privacy protection. Sometimes people might disagree with you and send you DDoS attack - don't want my computer to suffer. I have apache server installed.

Seo1 said:
Things learned:

1. Dupe content filter works well. However like all things Google on the organic or paid side, it takes time for G to discover things.

2. Google is not an evil empire out to ban sites for violating their TOS.

3. The violation will determine whether an outright ban or a smacking of the wrist will be dealt.

4. Making assumptions and claiming people will be banned for issues people are not sure of, is poor advice.

5. If you are doing things without evil intent. you have little to worry about other than a letter scolding you.

6. One mistake on one site does not damage your network of websites.

I hope this helps.

Peace

This is by far the most constructive response I read so far. Thank you! I already feel better!

Hobbs said:
Sounds you will be ok toldan so don't send any panic emails.

Putting myself in Google's Billion dollar shoes:
I would ban small potatoes for small or big violations,
ban big fries for major violations only,
and ban ANYONE for click fraud.

I have been putting off taking my laptop to wifi joints
for this reason, in addition to security of course,
very inconvenient, but too much to risk.

I don't know am I a big fry yet. In the last 15 days, I earned over $8,000. But, that's really low compared to Marcus's $10,000/day hehehehehe...... Anyways, Hobbs, thank you, I value your encouraging response. It was one of the most constructive responses I have read so far.

Member02




msg:1357200
 12:03 am on Apr 17, 2006 (gmt 0)


Doesn't one AOL account = 1 IP address?

No it doesnít, from what I know is that every time an AOL user comes online a different IP is given. Meaning the IPís are shared.

So theoretically, a publisherís IP today, can be a random visitor IP tomorrow clicking an adsense on the publisherís site who had the same IP yesterday.


How does Google deal with AOL?

I second that question. Does anybody know?

Scurramunga




msg:1357201
 12:18 am on Apr 17, 2006 (gmt 0)

Been there, done that.

In all probability you are just an honest publisher who is concerned because you want to do the right thing. I now for a fact that Google would not openly condone publishers using proxies to look at their ads. Then again Google doesn't have a policy to the contrary either, because that would be impractical.

So don't worry about it. As someone here said , Google doesn't rely on IP alone and they are probably pretty good at assesing out our behaviours.

BillyS




msg:1357202
 1:19 am on Apr 17, 2006 (gmt 0)

>>Hahaha, good try Billy

You seem to be a little slow understanding me, so I will be exact here summarizing what I've already said. I'm not saying anything evil, but getting to the point:

If you were not clicking your own ads from that proxy, then you don't have anything to worry about. If you were, then you should be worried.

Seo1




msg:1357203
 2:14 am on Apr 17, 2006 (gmt 0)

Toldan Said

I just accidentially ""signed"" into my adsense account with public proxy.

Miscommunication

BillyS Said

If you were not ++clicking++ your own ads from that proxy,

BillyS the subject is signing into adsense and had nothing to do with clicks from his proxy server.

So were past that and I would like to know how Google see shared IP networks such as large corporation have, and how would they handle the clicks on Adwords Ads?

As for AOL, they are first & foremost an ISP, I know when I was in business installing high speed cable modems, that AOL used one shared IP address, they would only allow people to network home computers with AOL firmware installed on routers purchased through AOL, and why forums cannot ban AOL members who get too carried away without having to ban all AOL members.

This may have changed over the years since but I cannot see how .

It is also necessary to understand that AOL is it's own garden so to speak, not really a part of the www, and at one time was only accessable to paid members.

Knowing this, I cannot understand how Google looks at AOL and knows that clicks on Ads from AOL members are unique.

I should I think,,,,but can't and it bothers me.....

Member02




msg:1357204
 3:05 am on Apr 17, 2006 (gmt 0)

Being an AOL user myself, do you think I should contact Google and let them know that I am AOL user to avoid any future headaches or misunderstandings?

What if another AOL user who has my IP tomorrow clicks my ads? Although itís highly unlikely due to itís probability and the many factors involved, but there is always that 1% chance that It may occur.

Do you think I should let Google know about this, or Google will probably have their own way to deal with this matter?

Seo1




msg:1357205
 10:28 am on Apr 17, 2006 (gmt 0)

Member02

How long have you been using AOL & working with Adsense?

I would not worry about it at this time, as I would think there are many others using AOL and working with Adsense and I doubt they have had any issues.

Hope this helps

activeco




msg:1357206
 11:01 am on Apr 17, 2006 (gmt 0)

Many people access their accounts from different IP/PC's on a regular basis.
Think of corporations, business trips, vacations...
Nothing wrong with that.

greedy player




msg:1357207
 3:45 pm on Apr 17, 2006 (gmt 0)

You are all wrong, adsense has a HTTPS protocol put in place which would require a HTTPS proxy to effectively count as a login from another location, otherwise your main connection IP is used.

What you did for HTTPS://
YOUR IP > YOUR IP > YOUR IP
Client > HTTPS:// > Google Adsense

What you do for HTTP://
YOUR IP > YOUR IP > PROXY IP
Client > HTTP:// PROXY > [google.com...]

What you think happened:
Paranoia struck in, mass confusion and lack of knowledge and people thinking they know Adsense system like the back of their hands making you feel even worse telling you "your an idiot you'll find yourself banned now if they clicked your ads with that proxy".

The Real Story:
But in reality you logged in with your IP over a HTTPS protocol setup by Adsense which has it's own Encrypted SSL server.

Regards,
Greedy_Player

Member02




msg:1357208
 4:19 pm on Apr 17, 2006 (gmt 0)

greedy player,

I'm not sure what all that meant, did it meant being an AOL user was ok or should Google be informed?

greedy player




msg:1357209
 4:34 pm on Apr 17, 2006 (gmt 0)

Your real ip is masked by aol's http proxy when browsing http:// sites , but your aol or http proxy is ineffective when you connect to secure connections and will provide them with your real ip address between A your computer and B your adsense account.

AOL offers its users a safe way to surf the web by dropping their PROXY IP all over the internet, however... you really do have a unique ip address on their network.. which you can run services like your own web server on this is known as your personal IP address linking your router/dsl modem/dialup connection/broadband/cable line to the exchange of which is really a local area network setup in your area, you are routed from your machine to your local exchane and then to the internet, and then for most if not all AOL users are connected to a AOL proxy surfing HTTP:// webpages (hence why AOL is slow in my opinion and crap) and for HTTPS// SSL connections you are not protected by AOL's proxy or a http proxy, therefor your real ip is used between the connection from Client to the Adsense SSL server.

Word of warning if your ip changes on the AOL network everytime you connect to your Broadband service for example I wouldn't sign into adsense at all on your home connection without a REAL HTTPS:// proxy setup by yourself on your own dedicated server on the internet of which is never been used before for adsense.

That good enough?

Regards,
Greedy_Player

Seo1




msg:1357210
 4:37 pm on Apr 17, 2006 (gmt 0)

Greedy player said: You are all wrong.

No greedy player we are not all wrong.

Try a bit less of the condeming the whole group approach.

Seo1




msg:1357211
 4:41 pm on Apr 17, 2006 (gmt 0)

Why wouldn't you sign into Adsense if your IP address changes?

Cable modem users IP addresses change all the time..

Not making much sense.. first you say its okay to log in from a proxy server but not your own computer (with it's own unique IP address) if the ISP changes your IP through TCP/IP?

greedy player




msg:1357212
 4:45 pm on Apr 17, 2006 (gmt 0)

Why wouldn't you sign into Adsense if your IP address changes?

Cable modem users IP addresses change all the time..

Not making much sense.. first you say its okay to log in from a proxy server but not your own computer (with it's own unique IP address) if the ISP changes your IP through TCP/IP?

///////////////

I think you obviously don't understand if you do have a cable modem ip address and it changes all the time then its unsafe, the person next door could of got banned last night, your ip switches with his and your on your adsense account like himself you are banned.

It's okay to log into adsense from a HTTPS PROXY that the ip addres has never been used before, i do this myself when I'm at my friends houses/other places.

Do you need to be more idiotic, and if it's down to my bad grade in english then learn to understand it better, clearly teachers corrected my english at school to teach me to spell "because" so could do it in your head or print and correct it on paper.

This 34 message thread spans 2 pages: 34 ( [1] 2 > >
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