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Song Lyrics, Copyright, and Adsense
So many lyrics sites use adsense as their mainstay. . .
creepychris




msg:1322519
 9:04 pm on Dec 4, 2005 (gmt 0)

I have seen so many lyrics sites supporting themselves through Adsense. Are song lyrics fair game under fair use? Or would they be an infraction under copyright laws and hence an infraction under Adsense TOS. And if they are an infraction, why doesn't Google go after them?

 

Lobo




msg:1322549
 7:40 pm on Dec 5, 2005 (gmt 0)

See what I mean .. moan moan moan "I'm so good" "my mommy taught me well" etc ...

In general terms the geek twats giving you good advice are correct, but as you can see there is always some ambiguity, and in fact they don't really know how a court or judge would rule on this issue, so these over confident interpreters of the law actually know nothing.

For sure.. it's not so cut and dry, when you go out of the guidleines there is small chances or possibilites that some company may choose to put money up front to test the ruling ..

Yet for all the know all, for me it shows a real lack of knowing how the web actually works in the real world.. It's like discussing with a social worker if it's ok to take an apple from a tree.

You'll always get this do gooder attitude.. backed up with some reference to a law to make them feel better.

I'm not condoning the logic, they are for the most part right, but life is too god damn short.. When someone justifies their existance based on their so called knowledge of policy they are likely to defend that ..

Personally I think sometimes you've got to challenge these issues, sometimes even ignore them there are far more important points of web business which bussiness's are interested in. There is much more to success on the web than chasing every apple plucker..

Business's know this, anyone with any sense knows this.

"If you can't do it teach, if you can't teach moan about it"

jomaxx




msg:1322550
 8:20 pm on Dec 5, 2005 (gmt 0)

BTW I'm not sure about all these assertions that the music publishers aren't doing anything about it. It's my understanding that quite a few lyrics sites have been shut down by their owners or by their owners' ISPs.

hyperkik




msg:1322551
 8:27 pm on Dec 5, 2005 (gmt 0)

In general terms the geek twats giving you good advice are correct, but as you can see there is always some ambiguity, and in fact they don't really know how a court or judge would rule on this issue, so these over confident interpreters of the law actually know nothing.

If it is those of us who understand the law and issues who "know nothing", why is it you who refuses to address the issues and resorts to ad hominem attacks?

In any event, in my day job I'm a lawyer, so I get paid to make overconfident interpretations of the law.

Knappster




msg:1322552
 8:47 pm on Dec 5, 2005 (gmt 0)

Personally I think sometimes you've got to challenge these issues, sometimes even ignore them there are far more important points of web business which bussiness's are interested in.

Let's leave it Lobo to "challenge these issues." I forsee dozens of DMCA complaints in his future.

Atticus




msg:1322553
 9:06 pm on Dec 5, 2005 (gmt 0)

Lobo,

Sounds like your life is one long moan, or maybe a fart.

Mr_Fern




msg:1322554
 9:14 pm on Dec 5, 2005 (gmt 0)

People like knowing the words to the newest song, or maybe an old song, so they look it up. These Song Lyrics sites do no kind of damage to the music industry. All they do is provide for people to sing along with their favorite artists. These sites aren't selling lyrics, they're just providing people with the lyrics. Yes the songs are copyrighted, but people who have these lyrics sites don't claim to own the copyrights to any of these songs, they're just trying to do the public a generous service. As web hosting is not free, they use advertisements to keep their site up, make a little money while they're at it.

I remember a few years back one of my favorite lyrics websites was actually forced by RIAA specifically I believe, to shut down. I thought that was the most ridiculous thing in the world. If I sat there and listened to a song over and over so I could type the words and save it for myself, nobody would come knocking on my door. These sites are just trying to make things a little easier for everyone else.

I can understand the copyright on lyrics for someone trying to pretend the lyrics as their own, or reproducing an audio work with their lyrics as their own original work, but I fail to see the use of a copyright to bash on a website just helping people learn the words to a song.

On a seperate note, considering Google's Book Scanning controversy, to come down on those sites would be like coming down on themselves, it's a very similar issue at hand.

incrediBILL




msg:1322555
 11:12 pm on Dec 5, 2005 (gmt 0)

These sites aren't selling lyrics

They don't have to sell them - slap AdSense or some other banner on the site and you're making profit from someone else's work and that's when the lawyers come duck hunting.

Do a little research on the web and you'll find that around 1998-2000 a whole bunch of Lyrics sites like LyricFind were sued and forcibly shut down until they came to some licensing agreements and some other legal wrangling was all settled in and out of court.

There are lots of Lyric sites out there but you really don't know if they're legit or not except a handful that I'm sure are legit after they came back online after being sued to clean up their act. Besides, just because a few scoflaws are getting away with it now doesn't mean they will for long.

Don't think I'm just making this up as I go along as my bro-in-law wanted to start a lyrics site a few years back as he knows a ton off the top of his head. We did all the research into the copyright issues, ongoing lawsuits and licensing issues and he decided there was just too much liability unless you really played by the rules and at the time the rules for online licensing were still up in the air due to the pending lawsuits all over the place so he just dropped the idea as having too much liability at the time.

Bottom line is do whatever you want and spare us the posting of "holy crap I've been sued for $10,000 for copyright infringement" if and when it happens.

21_blue




msg:1322556
 11:41 pm on Dec 5, 2005 (gmt 0)

jomaxx wrote:
>BTW I'm not sure about all these assertions that the music publishers aren't
>doing anything about it.

Sorry to be late entering the fray, but take a look at the following:

[mindymac.com...]

That lyric site was closed down as long ago as 1999.

With regards putting Adsense on lyric pages, see the following from BBC news (about music, not lyrics):

[news.bbc.co.uk...]

The reason they didn't go to jail was because they hadn't made any money from the website. Once you start making money from a website - eg: via Adsense - jail is much more likely.

See also:

[news.bbc.co.uk...]

[news.bbc.co.uk...]
(where a 12 year old girl was find $2,000)

[news.bbc.co.uk...]
(Napster goes into liquidation)

Most of the prosecutions to date apply to music rather than song lyrics, as music copyright theft is far more costly to the industry than lyric copyright theft.

7_Driver




msg:1322557
 6:11 pm on Dec 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

Here's the latest on this subject:

[pcpro.co.uk...]

Looks like those publishing copyright lyrics without permission aren't out of the woods yet...

Iguana




msg:1322558
 12:58 pm on Dec 9, 2005 (gmt 0)

Latest BBC article suggests that the assault on the lyrics sites goes beyond the Pearl Search application and will target all the lyrics sites

[news.bbc.co.uk ]

and they think this will mean more sheet music will be sold? They must be on drugs - oops I forgot this is the music industry so they will be on drugs!

victor




msg:1322559
 2:55 pm on Dec 9, 2005 (gmt 0)

I must admit that if were the person responsible for something as banal as "love me for a reason let the reason be love", I'd take comfort from the knowledge that the music industry was working day and night to prevent my words being spread around.

javahava




msg:1322560
 6:40 pm on Dec 9, 2005 (gmt 0)

[yro.slashdot.org...]

[news.bbc.co.uk...]

Looks like lyrics sites AND guitar tabs sites may be in for some bumps ahead. I'm all for taking risks, but you need to be taking informed and measured risks.

This 42 message thread spans 2 pages: < < 42 ( 1 [2]
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